4 ms·

The whole thing is a paper thin farce. Strong principled stance until the valuations got big (helped in no small measure by the principled stance)…and then bac

by Havoc 2y ago

The whole thing is a paper thin farce. Strong principled stance until the valuations got big (helped in no small measure by the principled stance)…and then backtracked it when everyone saw the riches there for the taking with a little let’s call it reframing

taneq 2y ago
Everyone has a price, is this meant to be shocking? I mean, I’m disappointed… but I’d have been far more surprised if they’d stood fast with the philanthropic mission once world-changing money was on the table.
- butterNaN 2y ago
  No, not everyone has a price. Obviously anecdotal but I have met some truly passionate people in real life who wouldn't compramise their values. Humanity has not lost just yet. (I would say the same about some people who I haven't personally met, but it would be speculation)
  - mistrial9 2y ago
    people who do have a price, tend to cluster around situations where that can come into play; people who do not have a price, tend to cluster around situations where that does not come into play (?)
- tmpz22 2y ago
  If you sell out humanity for a Gulf Stream 5 private jet when you already have a Gulf Stream 4 it’s not deserving of empathy. “Somebody please think of the investors they only have 500 years of generational wealth”
  - dralley 2y ago
    https://youtu.be/zUshGP2UJEo https://youtu.be/zUshGP2UJEo
- Shawnecy 2y ago
  > Everyone has a price, Speak for yourself.
  - taneq 2y ago
    I’ve thought about this, a lot. My price is way higher than it once was, but still, if someone came along and dropped $10bn on my desk, I’d hear them out. There’s things I’d say no to, regardless of price, but otherwise things are probably negotiable.
    - saulpw 2y ago
      It might sound fun to 'have' $10bn but consider losing your family, knowing that every person you meet is after your money (because they are), not having anyone give you responsible feedback, spending large amounts of time dealing with lawyers and accountants and finance bros, and basically never being 'normal' again. Winning a huge amount of money in a lottery carries a huge chance of ruining your life. There's a limit to the amount of money I'd want (or could even use), and it's well below $10b. If someone came around with $10m and an honest deal and someone else offered $10b to buy the morality in my left toe, I'd take the $10m without question.
    - Jerrrry 2y ago
      There is nothing you can do with $10bn that you cannot personally do with $1bn. You can only buy the International Space Station twice.
- Havoc 2y ago
  Yes, likely most here would do the same even if they're not willing to admit it. I do think part of the price (paid) should be getting bluntly called out for it.
- maeil 2y ago
  > Everyone has a price, is this meant to be shocking? Left a very-well paying job over conscience reasons. TC was ~3x higher than I could get elsewhere without immigrating, probably higher than anywhere relative to CoL. I wasn't even doing defense stuff, crypto scams or anything clearly questionable like that, just clients were mostly in fossil-fuel adjacent sectors. Come from a lower-class background and haven't built up sizable assets at all, will likely need to work until retirement age. AMA. If anyone similar reads this, would love to get in touch as I'm sure we'll have a lot in common. In case someone here knows me, hi!
  - scarface_74 2y ago
    There is a huge difference between being “principled” between 3x and 1x when you are going from 200K to 600K and when you are going from $50K to $150K. Once you have “enough”, your personal marginal utility for money changes. Would you go from what you are making now to being an at home nurse taking care of special needs kids for $16/hour?
    - maeil 2y ago
      > There is a huge difference between being “principled” between 3x and 1x when you are going from 200K to 600K and when you are going from $50K to $150K. If it'd be anything remotely like the former, I would have built up sizable assets (which I didn't), especially as I mentioned relative to CoL :)
      - scarface_74 2y ago
        Did you give up so much potential income that you couldn’t meet your short term and long term wants and needs? What did you give up in your lifestyle that you personally valued to choose a lower paying job? I’m 50, (step)kids are grown, we downsized from the big house in the burbs to a condo in a state tax free state, etc and while I could make “FAANG” total compensation (been there done that), I much prefer a more laid back job, remote work, freedom to travel,etc. I also have always hated large companies. I would have made different choices a decade ago if the opportunities had arisen. I’m well aware that my income puts me at the top quintile of household income (while still lower than a mid level developer at any of the BigTech companies). https://dqydj.com/household-income-percentile-calculator/ https://dqydj.com/household-income-percentile-calculator/ Be as vague as you are comfortable with. But where are you with respect to the median income locally?
maeil 2y ago
> Strong principled stance There had never been one. Not with Sam Altman. It was a play put on to get $100+ million in donations. This was always the goal, from day 0. This is trivially obvious considering the person Sam Altman.
- bilbo0s 2y ago
  This. Anyone who thought Sam Altman wasn’t in it for the money from the start, was being naive. In the extreme. Not only Mr Altman, but most of the people giving the larger donations were hoping for a hit as well. Why is that so incredible to people? How else would you get that kind of money to fund a ludicrously speculative research based endeavor? You don’t even know if it’s possible before the research. What else could they have done?
  - justinbaker84 2y ago
    I think that is the case with Sam, but not Ilya and probably not with some of the other founders.
    - fnqi8ckfek 2y ago
      [dead]
    - maeil 2y ago
      Agreed, hence why he scammed people into believing he was in it for the "good of humanity" - 1. Get donors 2. Get bright minds in the space (e.g. Ilya) with such ideals to work for him.
cheald 2y ago
This is specifically why I caution people against trusting OpenAI's "we won't train on your data" checkbox. They are specifically financially incentivized to do so, and have a demonstrated history of saying the nice, comforting thing and then doing the thing that benefits them instead.

by Havoc 2y ago

taneq 2y ago

Everyone has a price, is this meant to be shocking? I mean, I’m disappointed… but I’d have been far more surprised if they’d stood fast with the philanthropic mission once world-changing money was on the table.

butterNaN 2y ago
No, not everyone has a price. Obviously anecdotal but I have met some truly passionate people in real life who wouldn't compramise their values. Humanity has not lost just yet. (I would say the same about some people who I haven't personally met, but it would be speculation)
- mistrial9 2y ago
  people who do have a price, tend to cluster around situations where that can come into play; people who do not have a price, tend to cluster around situations where that does not come into play (?)
tmpz22 2y ago
If you sell out humanity for a Gulf Stream 5 private jet when you already have a Gulf Stream 4 it’s not deserving of empathy. “Somebody please think of the investors they only have 500 years of generational wealth”
- dralley 2y ago
  https://youtu.be/zUshGP2UJEo https://youtu.be/zUshGP2UJEo
Shawnecy 2y ago
> Everyone has a price, Speak for yourself.
- taneq 2y ago
  I’ve thought about this, a lot. My price is way higher than it once was, but still, if someone came along and dropped $10bn on my desk, I’d hear them out. There’s things I’d say no to, regardless of price, but otherwise things are probably negotiable.
  - saulpw 2y ago
    It might sound fun to 'have' $10bn but consider losing your family, knowing that every person you meet is after your money (because they are), not having anyone give you responsible feedback, spending large amounts of time dealing with lawyers and accountants and finance bros, and basically never being 'normal' again. Winning a huge amount of money in a lottery carries a huge chance of ruining your life. There's a limit to the amount of money I'd want (or could even use), and it's well below $10b. If someone came around with $10m and an honest deal and someone else offered $10b to buy the morality in my left toe, I'd take the $10m without question.
  - Jerrrry 2y ago
    There is nothing you can do with $10bn that you cannot personally do with $1bn. You can only buy the International Space Station twice.
Havoc 2y ago
Yes, likely most here would do the same even if they're not willing to admit it. I do think part of the price (paid) should be getting bluntly called out for it.
maeil 2y ago
> Everyone has a price, is this meant to be shocking? Left a very-well paying job over conscience reasons. TC was ~3x higher than I could get elsewhere without immigrating, probably higher than anywhere relative to CoL. I wasn't even doing defense stuff, crypto scams or anything clearly questionable like that, just clients were mostly in fossil-fuel adjacent sectors. Come from a lower-class background and haven't built up sizable assets at all, will likely need to work until retirement age. AMA. If anyone similar reads this, would love to get in touch as I'm sure we'll have a lot in common. In case someone here knows me, hi!
- scarface_74 2y ago
  There is a huge difference between being “principled” between 3x and 1x when you are going from 200K to 600K and when you are going from $50K to $150K. Once you have “enough”, your personal marginal utility for money changes. Would you go from what you are making now to being an at home nurse taking care of special needs kids for $16/hour?
  - maeil 2y ago
    > There is a huge difference between being “principled” between 3x and 1x when you are going from 200K to 600K and when you are going from $50K to $150K. If it'd be anything remotely like the former, I would have built up sizable assets (which I didn't), especially as I mentioned relative to CoL :)
    - scarface_74 2y ago
      Did you give up so much potential income that you couldn’t meet your short term and long term wants and needs? What did you give up in your lifestyle that you personally valued to choose a lower paying job? I’m 50, (step)kids are grown, we downsized from the big house in the burbs to a condo in a state tax free state, etc and while I could make “FAANG” total compensation (been there done that), I much prefer a more laid back job, remote work, freedom to travel,etc. I also have always hated large companies. I would have made different choices a decade ago if the opportunities had arisen. I’m well aware that my income puts me at the top quintile of household income (while still lower than a mid level developer at any of the BigTech companies). https://dqydj.com/household-income-percentile-calculator/ https://dqydj.com/household-income-percentile-calculator/ Be as vague as you are comfortable with. But where are you with respect to the median income locally?

maeil 2y ago

> Strong principled stance There had never been one. Not with Sam Altman. It was a play put on to get $100+ million in donations. This was always the goal, from day 0. This is trivially obvious considering the person Sam Altman.

bilbo0s 2y ago
This. Anyone who thought Sam Altman wasn’t in it for the money from the start, was being naive. In the extreme. Not only Mr Altman, but most of the people giving the larger donations were hoping for a hit as well. Why is that so incredible to people? How else would you get that kind of money to fund a ludicrously speculative research based endeavor? You don’t even know if it’s possible before the research. What else could they have done?
- justinbaker84 2y ago
  I think that is the case with Sam, but not Ilya and probably not with some of the other founders.
  - fnqi8ckfek 2y ago
    [dead]
  - maeil 2y ago
    Agreed, hence why he scammed people into believing he was in it for the "good of humanity" - 1. Get donors 2. Get bright minds in the space (e.g. Ilya) with such ideals to work for him.

cheald 2y ago

This is specifically why I caution people against trusting OpenAI's "we won't train on your data" checkbox. They are specifically financially incentivized to do so, and have a demonstrated history of saying the nice, comforting thing and then doing the thing that benefits them instead.