4 ms·

This type of analysis is heavily rooted in personal preference. Critics have their own biased. Relying on mass review system should represent more of what the a

This type of analysis is heavily rooted in personal preference. Critics have their own biased. Relying on mass review system should represent more of what the average person like rather than some elitist idea of a critic of what should be.

piva00 2y ago
The issue is for finding stuff that doesn't cater to the "average person". I'm not interested on what the average person like if I'm looking for artistic value.
keiferski 2y ago
Sure, there is some value in knowing what the average person thinks about it. But if I want a more expert or educated opinion, then there is more value in asking someone that knows more about the topic. The labeling of any sort of expert opinion as “elitist” is precisely the issue.
mrbombastic 2y ago
Rotten tomatoes seems like a good case study in the value of both by presenting a critics score and a general audience score. Usually when they diverge greatly is when it is most valuable for me, e.g. critics loved it and audiences hated it, it is probably pretentious and arty and I can skip, audiences loved it and critics hated it, it is probably mass appeal slop.
- kevinventullo 2y ago
  Curious what you make of the The Last Jedi then: https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_wars_the_last_jedi https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_wars_the_last_jedi A terribly lazy movie that even the popcorn-guzzling public could see through, but which mysteriously received rave reviews from the “culturally elite” critics.
  - BriggyDwiggs42 2y ago
    Why do you think that was?
  - soco 2y ago
    41% is not terrible either, but if you want the most blatant example from that universe, take The Acolyte: 18% given by the audience for a show of high school project-quality was quite generous, even.
  - bluepizza 2y ago
    Because it is a fantastic movie, with fascinating characters, a thrilling storyline, and full of interesting concepts. The popcorn and soda public loved it - it was the highest grossing movie in 2017. There is no mystery in its rave reviews. Both critics and general public enjoyed it. The vicious hate this movie gets is from Star Wars fans only. Nobody hates Star Wars as much as its fans.
    - Fnoord 2y ago
      I'm not sure if those still count as fans or former fans suffering from nostalgia. Consider Call of Duty. I really liked 3 and 4. After that, not so much, and I have not even bothered with recent ones. They could've stopped there, as far as I'm concerned. I also did not really like The Phantom Menace either, but I get the appeal for _others_ (and I liked the next one a lot more). Do I include that in my review? If it is a personal review, no. If it were a professional review for a magazine or website (i.e. critic)? Sure. I believe (cannot prove) the main reason the latest Star Wars movies gets a lot of flak is Star Wars = Disney, and Disney is too 'woke' for some people. They don't like a female POC lead.
      - foobarchu 2y ago
        > I believe (cannot prove) the main reason the latest Star Wars movies gets a lot of flak is Star Wars = Disney, and Disney is too 'woke' for some people. They don't like a female POC lead. If you earnestly believe this, you really need to seek out more diverse news. Everyone I know absolutely hated both TLJ and TRoS, and I can guarantee it's not because they're racist or misogynist. They are just really bad movies (TRoS in particular is a series of nonsensical mcguffin quests held together by the most nonsensical plot). TFA is pretty universally agreed in my experience to have been fine, but too safe. It also feels like a big stretch to call Kelly Marie Tran the lead, even if the harassment she experienced was abhorrent. It's an ensemble cast and she has 12th billing.
- notTooFarGone 2y ago
  Note that this is prone to review bombing. Often series and films get accused of having an "agenda" and a lot of non-fans join in review bombing. It can still be good media if "fan reviews" don't like it.
  - oersted 2y ago
    Just to note that this is even more common in gaming and Steam has developed strong countermeasures, not to outright suppress review bombing because there are legitimate cases that look similar, but to highlight it and give some options to filter it out.
bobthepanda 2y ago
For now. If you thought botting on reviews was bad now, LLMs and the like are going to supercharge spam and drown us all in a grey goo of bullshit.
Scarblac 2y ago
Exactly, and with most dubjects what the average person thinks is useless. The average person knows very little about most subjects.

piva00 2y ago

The issue is for finding stuff that doesn't cater to the "average person". I'm not interested on what the average person like if I'm looking for artistic value.

keiferski 2y ago

Sure, there is some value in knowing what the average person thinks about it. But if I want a more expert or educated opinion, then there is more value in asking someone that knows more about the topic. The labeling of any sort of expert opinion as “elitist” is precisely the issue.

mrbombastic 2y ago

Rotten tomatoes seems like a good case study in the value of both by presenting a critics score and a general audience score. Usually when they diverge greatly is when it is most valuable for me, e.g. critics loved it and audiences hated it, it is probably pretentious and arty and I can skip, audiences loved it and critics hated it, it is probably mass appeal slop.

kevinventullo 2y ago
Curious what you make of the The Last Jedi then: https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_wars_the_last_jedi https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_wars_the_last_jedi A terribly lazy movie that even the popcorn-guzzling public could see through, but which mysteriously received rave reviews from the “culturally elite” critics.
- BriggyDwiggs42 2y ago
  Why do you think that was?
- soco 2y ago
  41% is not terrible either, but if you want the most blatant example from that universe, take The Acolyte: 18% given by the audience for a show of high school project-quality was quite generous, even.
- bluepizza 2y ago
  Because it is a fantastic movie, with fascinating characters, a thrilling storyline, and full of interesting concepts. The popcorn and soda public loved it - it was the highest grossing movie in 2017. There is no mystery in its rave reviews. Both critics and general public enjoyed it. The vicious hate this movie gets is from Star Wars fans only. Nobody hates Star Wars as much as its fans.
  - Fnoord 2y ago
    I'm not sure if those still count as fans or former fans suffering from nostalgia. Consider Call of Duty. I really liked 3 and 4. After that, not so much, and I have not even bothered with recent ones. They could've stopped there, as far as I'm concerned. I also did not really like The Phantom Menace either, but I get the appeal for _others_ (and I liked the next one a lot more). Do I include that in my review? If it is a personal review, no. If it were a professional review for a magazine or website (i.e. critic)? Sure. I believe (cannot prove) the main reason the latest Star Wars movies gets a lot of flak is Star Wars = Disney, and Disney is too 'woke' for some people. They don't like a female POC lead.
    - foobarchu 2y ago
      > I believe (cannot prove) the main reason the latest Star Wars movies gets a lot of flak is Star Wars = Disney, and Disney is too 'woke' for some people. They don't like a female POC lead. If you earnestly believe this, you really need to seek out more diverse news. Everyone I know absolutely hated both TLJ and TRoS, and I can guarantee it's not because they're racist or misogynist. They are just really bad movies (TRoS in particular is a series of nonsensical mcguffin quests held together by the most nonsensical plot). TFA is pretty universally agreed in my experience to have been fine, but too safe. It also feels like a big stretch to call Kelly Marie Tran the lead, even if the harassment she experienced was abhorrent. It's an ensemble cast and she has 12th billing.
notTooFarGone 2y ago
Note that this is prone to review bombing. Often series and films get accused of having an "agenda" and a lot of non-fans join in review bombing. It can still be good media if "fan reviews" don't like it.
- oersted 2y ago
  Just to note that this is even more common in gaming and Steam has developed strong countermeasures, not to outright suppress review bombing because there are legitimate cases that look similar, but to highlight it and give some options to filter it out.

bobthepanda 2y ago

For now. If you thought botting on reviews was bad now, LLMs and the like are going to supercharge spam and drown us all in a grey goo of bullshit.

Scarblac 2y ago

Exactly, and with most dubjects what the average person thinks is useless. The average person knows very little about most subjects.