3 ms·

OKRs for Evil and Good

39 points by zdw 2y ago

Spivak 2y ago
A good real life example of how to actually live the principle of not letting metrics become targets while still having them.
- siva7 2y ago
  Not sure i've taken anything substantially from that example
high_na_euv 2y ago
I really like the concept of OKRs, but some managers misuse them e.g OKRs arent equal Some require a week of effort meanwhile the other 3 months
hpaavola 2y ago
If the oobjective itself is easy to measure, "Increase purchases through Alexa’s voice interface" for example, then that is the the key result. Objectives need to be abstract complex things, grandiose goals. And key results are measurable good ideas to approximate our movement towards the objective.
- markerz 2y ago
  I don’t think objectives need to be complex or grandiose. Sometimes they can be but rarely do they need to be. In the end of the day, engineers are just employees solving business problems. The main business problem is driving shareholder value. Everything else is a means to achieve that. Fetishizing complexity leads to unnecessarily complex systems to achieve our personal objective of promotions and raises. At my previous company, there was a strong drive to make OKR’s complex because it looks better on a performance review package, but it just caused us to spend so much time creating and finding complex problems rather than solving the ones in front of us.
- phillipcarter 2y ago
  IMO "Increase purchases through Alexa’s voice interface" is pretty grandiose at the scale of Alexa, given that it's a huge network of devices and services powered entirely by voice.
- asplake 2y ago
  “Grandiose”? Stretching, sure, but for a time-bound objective, oh please no. What leading indicators would suggest that you’re making real progress towards that goal? Those would be key results, more granular than that objective. And how might you bring them about? That they inspire solution ideas is the point really.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
nkurz 2y ago
What purpose is served by the large graphic at the top of the article? It looks to be a picture of yellowjackets (or possibly honeybees) eating leftover barbecue sauce at a picnic table. There was some mention of "Honeycomb" in the article, but beyond that I don't see any tie-in. Did anyone find that it enhanced their experience or understanding?
- Brian_K_White 2y ago
  Maybe it's that the bees are chasing sugar instead of flowers. But that would be a weak illustration because the bees probably don't care where the sugar comes from. We and the flowers and probably everyone else but the bees are the ones who value their pollenization.

39 points by zdw 2y ago

A good real life example of how to actually live the principle of not letting metrics become targets while still having them.

siva7 2y ago
Not sure i've taken anything substantially from that example

high_na_euv 2y ago

I really like the concept of OKRs, but some managers misuse them e.g OKRs arent equal Some require a week of effort meanwhile the other 3 months

hpaavola 2y ago

If the oobjective itself is easy to measure, "Increase purchases through Alexa’s voice interface" for example, then that is the the key result. Objectives need to be abstract complex things, grandiose goals. And key results are measurable good ideas to approximate our movement towards the objective.

markerz 2y ago
I don’t think objectives need to be complex or grandiose. Sometimes they can be but rarely do they need to be. In the end of the day, engineers are just employees solving business problems. The main business problem is driving shareholder value. Everything else is a means to achieve that. Fetishizing complexity leads to unnecessarily complex systems to achieve our personal objective of promotions and raises. At my previous company, there was a strong drive to make OKR’s complex because it looks better on a performance review package, but it just caused us to spend so much time creating and finding complex problems rather than solving the ones in front of us.
phillipcarter 2y ago
IMO "Increase purchases through Alexa’s voice interface" is pretty grandiose at the scale of Alexa, given that it's a huge network of devices and services powered entirely by voice.
asplake 2y ago
“Grandiose”? Stretching, sure, but for a time-bound objective, oh please no. What leading indicators would suggest that you’re making real progress towards that goal? Those would be key results, more granular than that objective. And how might you bring them about? That they inspire solution ideas is the point really.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

nkurz 2y ago

What purpose is served by the large graphic at the top of the article? It looks to be a picture of yellowjackets (or possibly honeybees) eating leftover barbecue sauce at a picnic table. There was some mention of "Honeycomb" in the article, but beyond that I don't see any tie-in. Did anyone find that it enhanced their experience or understanding?

Brian_K_White 2y ago
Maybe it's that the bees are chasing sugar instead of flowers. But that would be a weak illustration because the bees probably don't care where the sugar comes from. We and the flowers and probably everyone else but the bees are the ones who value their pollenization.