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So we ban cars? So top 3 killers are cats, windows and cars and it doesn’t help if cats only kill small birds and mammals because they basically kill the food

by croes 2y ago

So we ban cars? So top 3 killers are cats, windows and cars and it doesn’t help if cats only kill small birds and mammals because they basically kill the food of the larger birds. Don’t forget tire wear and all the other sources of pollution that endangers any living being. And add climate change. So why are wind turbines singled out?

briandear 2y ago
Because we are building wind turbines when there are far better alternatives such as nuclear. We’re also being sold that “wind is better for the environment” when it’s not.
- mrweasel 2y ago
  You will notice that the same people who are against wind turbines are frequently also oppose to nuclear power (and cell tower, highways, factories, farms, forests, high rise building, schools, railroads, new neighbourhoods, pretty much any change that is not to their immediate benefit. In many cases nuclear is a better option, but if you want to stand up a few gigawatts of power in two - five years, turbines will let you do that. There's no chance of getting a nuclear power plant operating in a country with no history of nuclear power in less than ten year, and that's perhaps being fairly optimistic. Wind is better than running coal 24/7, which is what you competing against in most cases.
- croes 2y ago
  We‘re also being sold nuclear is better. Nuclear power plants take a long to build and are expensive in power production and maintenance. Just look at France in the hot summers. And that doesn’t include the danger of sabotage and terrorism. Didn’t read anything about the fear of russian rockets hitting Ukrainian wind turbines. Nuclear power plants are also a SPF. In insecure times decentralization is better.
aziaziazi 2y ago
What makes you think turbines are singled out?! There’s no point to ban them altogether neither the cats or cars. Consider a range if options between total ban and total unregulation. Thing about traffic code. The biologists that took of look at it probably already have propositions like putting them outside of the narrowest migratory corridors or ways to be visible to birds as stickers does on German windows.
mrweasel 2y ago
> So why are wind turbines singled out? Because some people hate the looks of wind turbines, they believe it lowers their property value. To pretend that this is about the birds is absurd, because if it was these same people would target cats as well and they are not doing that and never did. People can be amazingly stupid. Some people in my area wanted to prevent the construction of wind turbines as it would destroy the view of the nearby fjord. They strategically forgot to mention that the turbines would be replacing a coal fired power plant (and the open air coal storage). The view is already destroyed, if anything the turbines will actually let you see the fjord and make room for a huge nature area around them. There might also be a group of people working in the fossil fuel industry who fear that wind turbines are taking their jobs.
mcv 2y ago
> So why are wind turbines singled out? Because the oil lobby only objects to windmills, and not to buildings, powerlines, domestic cats, and certainly not to cars. And the oil industry has the funds to control the narrative, and this is a narrative that may get some environmentalists to work for them. The counter is of course to widen the discussion to all manmade structures that kill birds, especially glassy high-rises.

by croes 2y ago

briandear 2y ago

Because we are building wind turbines when there are far better alternatives such as nuclear. We’re also being sold that “wind is better for the environment” when it’s not.

mrweasel 2y ago
You will notice that the same people who are against wind turbines are frequently also oppose to nuclear power (and cell tower, highways, factories, farms, forests, high rise building, schools, railroads, new neighbourhoods, pretty much any change that is not to their immediate benefit. In many cases nuclear is a better option, but if you want to stand up a few gigawatts of power in two - five years, turbines will let you do that. There's no chance of getting a nuclear power plant operating in a country with no history of nuclear power in less than ten year, and that's perhaps being fairly optimistic. Wind is better than running coal 24/7, which is what you competing against in most cases.
croes 2y ago
We‘re also being sold nuclear is better. Nuclear power plants take a long to build and are expensive in power production and maintenance. Just look at France in the hot summers. And that doesn’t include the danger of sabotage and terrorism. Didn’t read anything about the fear of russian rockets hitting Ukrainian wind turbines. Nuclear power plants are also a SPF. In insecure times decentralization is better.

aziaziazi 2y ago

What makes you think turbines are singled out?! There’s no point to ban them altogether neither the cats or cars. Consider a range if options between total ban and total unregulation. Thing about traffic code. The biologists that took of look at it probably already have propositions like putting them outside of the narrowest migratory corridors or ways to be visible to birds as stickers does on German windows.

mrweasel 2y ago

> So why are wind turbines singled out? Because some people hate the looks of wind turbines, they believe it lowers their property value. To pretend that this is about the birds is absurd, because if it was these same people would target cats as well and they are not doing that and never did. People can be amazingly stupid. Some people in my area wanted to prevent the construction of wind turbines as it would destroy the view of the nearby fjord. They strategically forgot to mention that the turbines would be replacing a coal fired power plant (and the open air coal storage). The view is already destroyed, if anything the turbines will actually let you see the fjord and make room for a huge nature area around them. There might also be a group of people working in the fossil fuel industry who fear that wind turbines are taking their jobs.

mcv 2y ago

> So why are wind turbines singled out? Because the oil lobby only objects to windmills, and not to buildings, powerlines, domestic cats, and certainly not to cars. And the oil industry has the funds to control the narrative, and this is a narrative that may get some environmentalists to work for them. The counter is of course to widen the discussion to all manmade structures that kill birds, especially glassy high-rises.