4 ms·

> Only the large-scale, deliberate targeting of civilian populations "with intent to destroy [them] as a group, in whole or in part", per the definition above.

> Only the large-scale, deliberate targeting of civilian populations "with intent to destroy [them] as a group, in whole or in part", per the definition above. So given you so much care about "mini" details, surely you would admit that the latest Hamas attack where so many anihilated villages close to the Gaza strip, killing Israeli Jews and Arabs alike as well as several foreigners, killing babies, women and the elderly indiscriminately, burning buildings and taking hostages is, by your own definition, very much to be considered to be a genocide?

aguaviva 2y ago
Surely you would admit ... You know, you could have asked your question in a normal, straightforward manner -- e.g. "Would you say the Oct 7th attack was also genocidal in nature, per these criteria?" -- and you would have gotten a straightforward answer. But as it is, you've chosen a weird, pretentious way of formulating your question. So I'll have to pass, and let you think whatever you want to think.
- thenaturalist 2y ago
  We’re on a public discussion forum. Always telling to see people bring these elaborate details to the forefront instead of simply stating where they stand if it’s about Jewish life.
  - aguaviva 2y ago
    Your framing was disingenuous, straight up -- it was a baiting question in the classic mold -- and that's why it was necessary to shut it down. When you start a question with "Surely you will admit ...", it presupposes a certain aura of doubt or guilt on the part of the person that you're addressing (as if you think there's grounds to believe they would be reluctant to give a normal, sensible answer to that question). You also buttered up your inquest with excessive detail, as if you thought the person you were addressing it to would be ignorant of (or in denial about) the events of that day. No one needs to answer questions like this. Always telling to see ... I find the bullshit insinuation of antisemitism that you're making here (on a public discussion forum, no less) to be rather insulting, actually.
    - thenaturalist 2y ago
      You can deseminate my words all you want. > When you start a question with "Surely you will admit ...", it presupposes a certain aura of doubt or guilt on the part of the person that you're addressing No, it does not. You were fervent in your argumentation, so it is fair to equally fervently ask for a reply? > You also buttered up your inquest with excessive detail, as if you thought the person you were addressing it to would be ignorant of (or in denial about) the events of that day. I literally do not know anything about you or your level of subject matter expertise. > I find the bullshit insinuation of antisemitism that you're making here (on a public discussion forum, no less) to be rather insulting, actually. I'm not insinuating anything. Again, I don't know much about you other than you were very vocal about the definition of genocide as it pertains to the Israeli defensive response to the worst mass murder of Jewish life since the Holocaust and your abject silence and avoidance of answering a simple question, when asked about the other direction.
      - aguaviva 2y ago
        I'm not insinuating anything. You damn sure were. Again, I don't know much about you other than you were very vocal about the definition of genocide as it pertains to the Israeli response You're hallucinating. In this particular thread, I haven't touched on the genocide definition in the Oct 7th context at all. Someone switched the focus to Dresden, and I started chiming in on that. and your abject silence and avoidance of answering a simple question. Because it was a leading question, as already explained. And the fact that you immediately whipped out the antisemitism accusation after I refused to take the bait proves that this was the stick you were carrying all along. You're just a bully. Go away.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
juliuskiesian 2y ago
Dude, hamas beheading your babies is a lie and that has long been debunked. The IDF bombing schools and hospitals, on the other hand, was live streamed. You guys are the real baby killers, what else do you expect us to admit? Waving that antisemitism flag won't change the facts, just makes people sick of that very word.
- thenaturalist 2y ago
  You're arguing from extremes and insinuation. I never said anything about beheaded babies, so don't paint me as someone spreading fake news. If you want a taste of Hamas live streams and videos, feel free to peruse this website: https://www.thisishamas.com/ https://www.thisishamas.com/ Proceed at your own risk, graphic details. If you want to learn how Hamas uses civilians as human shields every step of the way, how ingrained blanket hate for Jews and genocide of Israel is ingrained in Gazan life and culture and what they do to people in the streets who are considered to be cooperating with Israel, I challenge you to watch this mini-documentary of a Gaza-born Muslim who became an Israeli citizen (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FqzAsFIIrL0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FqzAsFIIrL0) or literally any interview with released hostages. > You guys... Wonderful blanket term. Do you have an issue with Jews in general? I am neither Jewish nor Israeli, but someone who sees things as they are. There were no deaths in Gaza prior to October 7th, there is only one side publicly hell bent on anihilating the other and that has spent billions of dollars on weapons and bunkers instead of their own people. > Waving that antisemitism flag won't change the facts I agree, just makes it clear to everyone who reads this who is one and who isn't.
  - aguaviva 2y ago
    Wonderful blanket term. Which (as used by the commenter) was very clearly meant to apply to those who support Israel's military operation. Not to Jews in general. I agree, [waving the antisemitism flag] just makes it clear to everyone who reads this who is one and who isn't. Except when it's unsubstantiated. In which case it's just a cheap, ugly smear.

aguaviva 2y ago

Surely you would admit ... You know, you could have asked your question in a normal, straightforward manner -- e.g. "Would you say the Oct 7th attack was also genocidal in nature, per these criteria?" -- and you would have gotten a straightforward answer. But as it is, you've chosen a weird, pretentious way of formulating your question. So I'll have to pass, and let you think whatever you want to think.

thenaturalist 2y ago
We’re on a public discussion forum. Always telling to see people bring these elaborate details to the forefront instead of simply stating where they stand if it’s about Jewish life.
- aguaviva 2y ago
  Your framing was disingenuous, straight up -- it was a baiting question in the classic mold -- and that's why it was necessary to shut it down. When you start a question with "Surely you will admit ...", it presupposes a certain aura of doubt or guilt on the part of the person that you're addressing (as if you think there's grounds to believe they would be reluctant to give a normal, sensible answer to that question). You also buttered up your inquest with excessive detail, as if you thought the person you were addressing it to would be ignorant of (or in denial about) the events of that day. No one needs to answer questions like this. Always telling to see ... I find the bullshit insinuation of antisemitism that you're making here (on a public discussion forum, no less) to be rather insulting, actually.
  - thenaturalist 2y ago
    You can deseminate my words all you want. > When you start a question with "Surely you will admit ...", it presupposes a certain aura of doubt or guilt on the part of the person that you're addressing No, it does not. You were fervent in your argumentation, so it is fair to equally fervently ask for a reply? > You also buttered up your inquest with excessive detail, as if you thought the person you were addressing it to would be ignorant of (or in denial about) the events of that day. I literally do not know anything about you or your level of subject matter expertise. > I find the bullshit insinuation of antisemitism that you're making here (on a public discussion forum, no less) to be rather insulting, actually. I'm not insinuating anything. Again, I don't know much about you other than you were very vocal about the definition of genocide as it pertains to the Israeli defensive response to the worst mass murder of Jewish life since the Holocaust and your abject silence and avoidance of answering a simple question, when asked about the other direction.
    - aguaviva 2y ago
      I'm not insinuating anything. You damn sure were. Again, I don't know much about you other than you were very vocal about the definition of genocide as it pertains to the Israeli response You're hallucinating. In this particular thread, I haven't touched on the genocide definition in the Oct 7th context at all. Someone switched the focus to Dresden, and I started chiming in on that. and your abject silence and avoidance of answering a simple question. Because it was a leading question, as already explained. And the fact that you immediately whipped out the antisemitism accusation after I refused to take the bait proves that this was the stick you were carrying all along. You're just a bully. Go away.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

juliuskiesian 2y ago

Dude, hamas beheading your babies is a lie and that has long been debunked. The IDF bombing schools and hospitals, on the other hand, was live streamed. You guys are the real baby killers, what else do you expect us to admit? Waving that antisemitism flag won't change the facts, just makes people sick of that very word.

thenaturalist 2y ago
You're arguing from extremes and insinuation. I never said anything about beheaded babies, so don't paint me as someone spreading fake news. If you want a taste of Hamas live streams and videos, feel free to peruse this website: https://www.thisishamas.com/ https://www.thisishamas.com/ Proceed at your own risk, graphic details. If you want to learn how Hamas uses civilians as human shields every step of the way, how ingrained blanket hate for Jews and genocide of Israel is ingrained in Gazan life and culture and what they do to people in the streets who are considered to be cooperating with Israel, I challenge you to watch this mini-documentary of a Gaza-born Muslim who became an Israeli citizen (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FqzAsFIIrL0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FqzAsFIIrL0) or literally any interview with released hostages. > You guys... Wonderful blanket term. Do you have an issue with Jews in general? I am neither Jewish nor Israeli, but someone who sees things as they are. There were no deaths in Gaza prior to October 7th, there is only one side publicly hell bent on anihilating the other and that has spent billions of dollars on weapons and bunkers instead of their own people. > Waving that antisemitism flag won't change the facts I agree, just makes it clear to everyone who reads this who is one and who isn't.
- aguaviva 2y ago
  Wonderful blanket term. Which (as used by the commenter) was very clearly meant to apply to those who support Israel's military operation. Not to Jews in general. I agree, [waving the antisemitism flag] just makes it clear to everyone who reads this who is one and who isn't. Except when it's unsubstantiated. In which case it's just a cheap, ugly smear.