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As heavy Discord user, it's nice to see that IRC is still kicking and might be available if/when Discord ZIRP gas runs out.
by stackskipton 2y ago
As heavy Discord user, it's nice to see that IRC is still kicking and might be available if/when Discord ZIRP gas runs out.
- arcanemachiner 2y agoJust think of all that information, stuck in the walled garden, away from the prying eyes of search engines or any other forms of public discoverability. Just waiting to get flushed down the drain or shoved into the training data of a future round of AI crapware...
- ycuser2 2y agoIRC is also a walled garden.
- TonyTrapp 2y agoIRC is pretty much the opposite of the definition of a walled garden. Its content is not discoverable by search engines by default, but that is not the definition of a walled garden, which is typically a synonym for closed platforms where you have no choice how to access their content (e.g. being forced to use a specific client software).
- tryauuum 2y agoHm, for me the definition of the walled garden is "you have to have an account to see any discussions"
- fl0id 2y agoWhich you don’t need for irc. Also pretty sure that’s not an accurate definition as you can be walked without needing an account technically.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- sandos 2y agoBut in general IRC is not really archived etc? So just as throw-away as Discord imo.
- johannes1234321 2y agoHowever on IRC this is not for technical reasons, but limited interest. Pre-LLM-GenAI gathering information from huge chat logs was quite limited. But different extraction mechanisms always existed. Some people kept logs, some servers/channels had web-archives. Discord tries to keep it exclusive to them. (Focussing on technical side here, whether it's socially wanted is a different big question, which ends with a "it depends")
- anthk 2y agogrep/recoll. Fast even on ancient machines.
- johannes1234321 2y agoThat's nice for finding Keywords, but dismantling a chat discussion, which probably consists of many parallel threads in a channel, isn't easy.
- corobo 2y agoBeing knowingly throwaway meant that any long term knowledge got turned into a blog post, documentation, a forum thread, or a search engine indexable logs-to-html site in the worst case. With discord the message might get pinned if a mod thinks it was useful and remains undiscoverable for the majority of people
- thunky 2y ago> remains undiscoverable for the majority of people IME it doesn't work very well. If you hang around a discord server long enough you see the same conversations happening over and over and over. And the app is not good at helping you finding old conversations (which is why they are repeated endlessly). It's also very bad at resuming where you left off, so it's incredibly difficult to follow an active thread without missing anything: https://www.reddit.com/r/discordapp/comments/18d4tiv/inexplicable_pure_autoscrolling_hell/ https://www.reddit.com/r/discordapp/comments/18d4tiv/inexpli...
- bomanjak 2y ago[dead]
- Klonoar 2y agoThis is notably not the definition from the thread you’re responding to, though. So…
- boltzmann64 2y agoIt's not a website a search engine can crawl but anyone on the internet can log all the messages on IRC as long as they want without any restrictions. In fact if you are nice, you will never need to login and can have conversation for as long as you want with a guest login. It is not a walled garden.
- trollbridge 2y agoSearch engines could crawl it if they wanted to.
- rendx 2y agoFor me, a "walled garden" is also something controlled and regulated by a party I have no influence over. They can arbitrarily make and change rules and decide who to let in or not, which feature to drop, how the UX looks like etc. IRC is an open, community protocol, and as such not a walled garden. Even if I'm not involved, which I could be, I trust the composition of people there much more than any single commercial actor. The power dynamics are fundamentally different. A single instance (an IRC network) may be a "walled garden", in control of the group that runs it. The incentives are different. Also because people can simply migrate to another network given the open protocol (and different, third party clients; the API cannot be shut down like with Twitter/X). Historical example e.g. Freenode ownership change.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- blueflow 2y agoIRC is not "walled off" - open protocol, open servers, open clients.
- tomrod 2y agoA walled garden is a platform where auth is required to come in and user content is owned and stuck within. IRC is not a walled garden. You will have a better time registering with Nickserv, but you can pull content and logs channels. So, more like a fenced meadow.
- yapyap 2y agoexplain ur definition of walled garden please
- mmanfrin 2y agoI did not realize IRC chats were archived on search engines.
- kaamkiya 2y agoAnd if it's not, or you need something more secure, there's always Matrix. https://matrix.org https://matrix.org
- stackskipton 2y agoEhhhh, Not a fan of Matrix but I haven't investigated it a ton. What I'm looking for probably doesn't exist. Central Login Server hosted by Foundation of Chat Program and servers authenticate via OAuth2. Central Login Server keeps track of which Servers identity is in and their endpoints so people don't lose track of servers. Central Mobile Notification Service because mobile app notification is so important AND SO PAINFUL TO RUN. Federation NOT required.
- Arathorn 2y agofwiw Matrix does do this, although making the OIDC IdP track the right target homeserver might need a bit of config.