3 ms·

There's definitely a lesson to be learned from Wayland's rollout. Technically it's a vastly superior approach to system graphics. The major roadblock to its ado

There's definitely a lesson to be learned from Wayland's rollout. Technically it's a vastly superior approach to system graphics. The major roadblock to its adoption has been that it didn't deal with all the "extras" that X provided to desktop distributions as well. Things like copy/paste, screen sharinf, and others don't have a single standard way of accomplishing through Wayland because those aren't things related to Waylands core goals. As a result, it's been a no man's land of distributions waiting to see if someone else will build a standard for those things they like, or building a very opinionated standard that no one else likes. Future projects wanting to overturn crusty old incumbents by supercharging the worst part of that incumbents' process should at least provide a side project where all the extra bits that maybe people liked can grow a replacement, even though it's not the focus.

zozbot234 2y ago
> provide a side project where all the extra bits that maybe people liked can grow a replacement The whole point of freedesktop.org was to provide such a side project in the first place. The fact that it doesn't seem to be doing this with any effectiveness at present is the real issue.
nine_k 2y ago
FTFY: s/extras/essential features/ the decision to roll window management and keyboard management and screen management into one thing called "compositor" looks very cavalier to me. It resulted in a need to duplicate so many things that are modular and pluggable under X. (Repeating myself, I wish somebody created a Wayland compositor that explicitly delegates most tasks to plugins, providing a stable interface, so that you could use your own WM, your own keyboard switcher, etc. Thankfully, screenshooting is using a similar approach already, but in a limited way. The idea is so obvious that somebody must have attempted this already.)
- lproven 2y ago
  > The idea is so obvious that somebody must have attempted this already You'd think that, wouldn't you? The closest thing I know to a universal Wayland server that's WM and desktop independent is Mir. I blame the disappearance of the one concerted competitive rival effort to the primarily Red Hat-backed complex of Wayland+GNOME+Flatpak to a single HN thread. In my experience, HN commenters are often surprised when I say that I find this place to frequently be toxic, negative, with a strong element of groupthink. It's all on display in this thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14002821 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14002821 It is also why Jamie Zawinski blocks incoming URL requests from here, and redirects to a famous image. https://cdn.jwz.org/images/2024/hn.png https://cdn.jwz.org/images/2024/hn.png

zozbot234 2y ago

> provide a side project where all the extra bits that maybe people liked can grow a replacement The whole point of freedesktop.org was to provide such a side project in the first place. The fact that it doesn't seem to be doing this with any effectiveness at present is the real issue.

nine_k 2y ago

FTFY: s/extras/essential features/ the decision to roll window management and keyboard management and screen management into one thing called "compositor" looks very cavalier to me. It resulted in a need to duplicate so many things that are modular and pluggable under X. (Repeating myself, I wish somebody created a Wayland compositor that explicitly delegates most tasks to plugins, providing a stable interface, so that you could use your own WM, your own keyboard switcher, etc. Thankfully, screenshooting is using a similar approach already, but in a limited way. The idea is so obvious that somebody must have attempted this already.)

lproven 2y ago
> The idea is so obvious that somebody must have attempted this already You'd think that, wouldn't you? The closest thing I know to a universal Wayland server that's WM and desktop independent is Mir. I blame the disappearance of the one concerted competitive rival effort to the primarily Red Hat-backed complex of Wayland+GNOME+Flatpak to a single HN thread. In my experience, HN commenters are often surprised when I say that I find this place to frequently be toxic, negative, with a strong element of groupthink. It's all on display in this thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14002821 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14002821 It is also why Jamie Zawinski blocks incoming URL requests from here, and redirects to a famous image. https://cdn.jwz.org/images/2024/hn.png https://cdn.jwz.org/images/2024/hn.png