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HDMI should have made it easy to see what cable is supporting what. The HDMI versioning chaos did not help. The worst is still USB 3.1 Gen 2.1 Hyper Giga Supe

HDMI should have made it easy to see what cable is supporting what. The HDMI versioning chaos did not help. The worst is still USB 3.1 Gen 2.1 Hyper Giga Super Speed Mark II

radicality 2y ago
Yeah I have no idea how normal non-tech people are supposed to make any sense of USB-C cables and device compatibility. Even us tech people find it difficult. Small rant - I have the M1 Max MacBook which comes with “USB4”. I remember at some point getting a SanDisk external “USB4” ssd which claimed 20Gb/s, you would think it should all work together. But no, apparently the ssd needed 3.2 2x2 support, which the Mac doesn’t implement, since it’s apparently only a optional part of USB4 spec… One other funny thing - Apple’s page for “Identify the ports on your Mac” has 5 separate entries that are all USB-C shape. https://support.apple.com/en-us/109523 https://support.apple.com/en-us/109523
- wtallis 2y ago
  The simple but disappointing answer is that if you want a guaranteed level of functionality, you need to be looking at the Thunderbolt branding and ignore almost all the USB nomenclature. IIRC, the inability of some Apple Silicon machines to drive multiple external displays is why they're only advertised as "Thunderbolt" rather than TB3, 4 or 5: the specs are strict enough that even Apple can't cut corners without consequences.
  - russelg 2y ago
    I don't think this is true. If you look at the M4 MacBook Pro spec pages, it says Thunderbolt 4 for the base model, and Thunderbolt 5 for the M4 Pro models... https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/specs/ https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/specs/
    - wtallis 2y ago
      The ones listed as "Thunderbolt / USB 4" ie. not Thunderbolt 3, 4 or 5, appear to be exactly the models that are limited to one external display (I'm not 100% sure about the iMacs). The models you mention with M4 and M4 Pro are all capable of driving multiple external displays, and the difference between TB4 and TB5 for those models is one of the maximum data rate (40Gb/s vs 80Gb/s with an asymmetrical 120Gb/s mode). But I've never actually read a Thunderbolt spec, so I can't be sure exactly what disqualifies those "Thunderbolt / USB 4" from being advertised with a more recent Thunderbolt version number.
- ksec 2y ago
  Unfortunately everything you said, aren't new. And even before the new spec were done, before USB-C was a thing. All of these problem were predicted and raised. No one would listen. You wont even find people supporting these scenerio as a problem on HN. Before 2022, 99.9999% of HN and generally all tech comments somehow thought it will all be Thunderbolt speced. What makes it even worst is that Apple falls into the same trap as the rest of Internet / Tech / HN. I can almost guarantee this wont happen under Steve Jobs. Unfortunately that battle is long lost. The world will have to suffer enough pain before it can learn and do something.
throwaway81523 2y ago
Just wait til they extend USB to carry this new super speed HDMI.

HDMI should have made it easy to see what cable is supporting what. The HDMI versioning chaos did not help. The worst is still USB 3.1 Gen 2.1 Hyper Giga Super Speed Mark II

radicality 2y ago

Yeah I have no idea how normal non-tech people are supposed to make any sense of USB-C cables and device compatibility. Even us tech people find it difficult. Small rant - I have the M1 Max MacBook which comes with “USB4”. I remember at some point getting a SanDisk external “USB4” ssd which claimed 20Gb/s, you would think it should all work together. But no, apparently the ssd needed 3.2 2x2 support, which the Mac doesn’t implement, since it’s apparently only a optional part of USB4 spec… One other funny thing - Apple’s page for “Identify the ports on your Mac” has 5 separate entries that are all USB-C shape. https://support.apple.com/en-us/109523 https://support.apple.com/en-us/109523

wtallis 2y ago
The simple but disappointing answer is that if you want a guaranteed level of functionality, you need to be looking at the Thunderbolt branding and ignore almost all the USB nomenclature. IIRC, the inability of some Apple Silicon machines to drive multiple external displays is why they're only advertised as "Thunderbolt" rather than TB3, 4 or 5: the specs are strict enough that even Apple can't cut corners without consequences.
- russelg 2y ago
  I don't think this is true. If you look at the M4 MacBook Pro spec pages, it says Thunderbolt 4 for the base model, and Thunderbolt 5 for the M4 Pro models... https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/specs/ https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/specs/
  - wtallis 2y ago
    The ones listed as "Thunderbolt / USB 4" ie. not Thunderbolt 3, 4 or 5, appear to be exactly the models that are limited to one external display (I'm not 100% sure about the iMacs). The models you mention with M4 and M4 Pro are all capable of driving multiple external displays, and the difference between TB4 and TB5 for those models is one of the maximum data rate (40Gb/s vs 80Gb/s with an asymmetrical 120Gb/s mode). But I've never actually read a Thunderbolt spec, so I can't be sure exactly what disqualifies those "Thunderbolt / USB 4" from being advertised with a more recent Thunderbolt version number.
ksec 2y ago
Unfortunately everything you said, aren't new. And even before the new spec were done, before USB-C was a thing. All of these problem were predicted and raised. No one would listen. You wont even find people supporting these scenerio as a problem on HN. Before 2022, 99.9999% of HN and generally all tech comments somehow thought it will all be Thunderbolt speced. What makes it even worst is that Apple falls into the same trap as the rest of Internet / Tech / HN. I can almost guarantee this wont happen under Steve Jobs. Unfortunately that battle is long lost. The world will have to suffer enough pain before it can learn and do something.

throwaway81523 2y ago

Just wait til they extend USB to carry this new super speed HDMI.