4 ms·

Array Languages for Clojurians (2020)

106 points by simonpure 2y ago

cactusfrog 2y ago
[flagged]
- jraines 2y ago
  why?
  - cactusfrog 2y ago
    It isn’t a suitable language for data science and lacks the ecosystem of Python. For example, people will write Eden files to parse data, which involves creating a really complex DSL for every file for import. They will try to use Datomic as a database, which requires using datalog and does not scale. The worst part is the clojure users are convinced it is somehow better, and ignore the business use case. I feel bad for companies because it clearly isn’t a good fit and those devs will hire all their friends and do nothing for five years. This happened at an organization doing cancer research, so the selfish cultists ruined a chance at understanding immunotherapy by focusing on writing clojure rather than doing science. Recursion pharmaceuticals also had this problem, and had to rip out all of the clojure from their system.
    - daveliepmann 2y ago
      Datomic doesn't scale? Quick, tell the largest bank in South America, they must already be collapsing under the weight of all those transactions!
      - cactusfrog 2y ago
        It’s a closed source POS with unpredictable performance. Talk to people who have actually been forced to use it and many have terrible experiences. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16170955 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16170955
- thunkingdeep 2y ago
  Yeah? Like poor little mom and pop shops like Walmart?
  - cactusfrog 2y ago
    I’m glad they are wasting Walmart’s time and money.
- dang 2y ago
  "Please don't post shallow dismissals, especially of other people's work. A good critical comment teaches us something." "Don't be snarky." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
upghost 2y ago
Jeeze, the overlap of people who are interested in Clojure and array langs couldn't exceed the low double digits. Well, if you are among that sort of masochist and you like Clojure and APL, you could play with libapl-clj: https://github.com/jjtolton/libapl-clj https://github.com/jjtolton/libapl-clj I haven't touched it in awhile because honestly whether your coworkers do APL or your coworkers do Clojure they will hate you if you use this. Ye be warned. God forbid there's interest in it we could add more support... but there are like 75 significant systems engineering and architecture questions you should be prepared to either answer or blithely ignore before using this Frankenstein's monster.
- daveliepmann 2y ago
  Interop to APL from Clojure is completely wild and masochistic indeed. Hadn't seen this, thanks
  - upghost 2y ago
    I tried making Dyalog bindings but wasn't smart enough to figure it out at the time based on the info available and I doubt much has changed regarding either my intelligence or information availability there. But it would be awesome!
- BoingBoomTschak 2y ago
  > Not reimplementing APL instead Come on, step it up! https://github.com/phantomics/april https://github.com/phantomics/april EDIT: damn, didn't see it already got linked
fiddlerwoaroof 2y ago
Other work on integrating APL and lisp is here: https://github.com/phantomics/april https://github.com/phantomics/april
nph278 2y ago
Also maybe see this: https://github.com/kspalaiologos/kamilalisp https://github.com/kspalaiologos/kamilalisp

106 points by simonpure 2y ago

cactusfrog 2y ago

[flagged]

jraines 2y ago
why?
- cactusfrog 2y ago
  It isn’t a suitable language for data science and lacks the ecosystem of Python. For example, people will write Eden files to parse data, which involves creating a really complex DSL for every file for import. They will try to use Datomic as a database, which requires using datalog and does not scale. The worst part is the clojure users are convinced it is somehow better, and ignore the business use case. I feel bad for companies because it clearly isn’t a good fit and those devs will hire all their friends and do nothing for five years. This happened at an organization doing cancer research, so the selfish cultists ruined a chance at understanding immunotherapy by focusing on writing clojure rather than doing science. Recursion pharmaceuticals also had this problem, and had to rip out all of the clojure from their system.
  - daveliepmann 2y ago
    Datomic doesn't scale? Quick, tell the largest bank in South America, they must already be collapsing under the weight of all those transactions!
    - cactusfrog 2y ago
      It’s a closed source POS with unpredictable performance. Talk to people who have actually been forced to use it and many have terrible experiences. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16170955 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16170955
thunkingdeep 2y ago
Yeah? Like poor little mom and pop shops like Walmart?
- cactusfrog 2y ago
  I’m glad they are wasting Walmart’s time and money.
dang 2y ago
"Please don't post shallow dismissals, especially of other people's work. A good critical comment teaches us something." "Don't be snarky." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

upghost 2y ago

Jeeze, the overlap of people who are interested in Clojure and array langs couldn't exceed the low double digits. Well, if you are among that sort of masochist and you like Clojure and APL, you could play with libapl-clj: https://github.com/jjtolton/libapl-clj https://github.com/jjtolton/libapl-clj I haven't touched it in awhile because honestly whether your coworkers do APL or your coworkers do Clojure they will hate you if you use this. Ye be warned. God forbid there's interest in it we could add more support... but there are like 75 significant systems engineering and architecture questions you should be prepared to either answer or blithely ignore before using this Frankenstein's monster.

daveliepmann 2y ago
Interop to APL from Clojure is completely wild and masochistic indeed. Hadn't seen this, thanks
- upghost 2y ago
  I tried making Dyalog bindings but wasn't smart enough to figure it out at the time based on the info available and I doubt much has changed regarding either my intelligence or information availability there. But it would be awesome!
BoingBoomTschak 2y ago
> Not reimplementing APL instead Come on, step it up! https://github.com/phantomics/april https://github.com/phantomics/april EDIT: damn, didn't see it already got linked

fiddlerwoaroof 2y ago

Other work on integrating APL and lisp is here: https://github.com/phantomics/april https://github.com/phantomics/april

nph278 2y ago

Also maybe see this: https://github.com/kspalaiologos/kamilalisp https://github.com/kspalaiologos/kamilalisp