4 ms·

Isn’t the distinction sort of moot at this point? I seem to remember things setting into a “birds = dinosaurs” paradigm, although I am almost certainly oversimp

Isn’t the distinction sort of moot at this point? I seem to remember things setting into a “birds = dinosaurs” paradigm, although I am almost certainly oversimplifying things.

Swizec 2y ago
> Isn’t the distinction sort of moot at this point? I seem to remember things setting into a “birds = dinosaurs” paradigm, although I am almost certainly oversimplifying things. Birds are dinosaurs. Specifically they’re the avian branch of the theropods. Distinction has to do with hip bone structure – for lizards the hip joint goes out sideways, for dinosaurs and birds it goes down (iirc). Then dinosaurs have that big bone between their legs whereas for birds it developed into a keel-bone I believe. We know dinosaurs had to have been sortof-birds because for a lizard to reach that size it would’ve had to live hundreds of years. Whereas birds have a period of rapid growth when young, which enables them to reach near full adult size in a single breeding season. Basically: All birds are dinosaurs but not all dinosaurs are birds.
tokai 2y ago
dzonga didn't bring up any distinction. On the contrary. An old bird breeding naturally raises questions about the lifespans of non-avian dinosaurs, because they are related.
rsynnott 2y ago
Birds are a subset of dinosaurs; not all dinosaurs were birds, though all current dinosaurs are birds.
- zie 2y ago
  I thought crocodiles counted? They are related to birds, but clearly are not birds.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - LandStander 2y ago
    OneZoom.org has a nice common ancestor search feature. Here are the results for albatross and crocodile: https://www.onezoom.org/life/@Archelosauria=4947372?otthome=%40_ozid%3D1&highlight=path%3A%40Diomedeidae%3D85277&highlight=path%3A%40Crocodylus%3D35868#x525,y1310,w1.6361 https://www.onezoom.org/life/@Archelosauria=4947372?otthome=...
    - zie 2y ago
      When clicking the link, I just get an error saying the species is not in the DB.

Isn’t the distinction sort of moot at this point? I seem to remember things setting into a “birds = dinosaurs” paradigm, although I am almost certainly oversimplifying things.

Swizec 2y ago

> Isn’t the distinction sort of moot at this point? I seem to remember things setting into a “birds = dinosaurs” paradigm, although I am almost certainly oversimplifying things. Birds are dinosaurs. Specifically they’re the avian branch of the theropods. Distinction has to do with hip bone structure – for lizards the hip joint goes out sideways, for dinosaurs and birds it goes down (iirc). Then dinosaurs have that big bone between their legs whereas for birds it developed into a keel-bone I believe. We know dinosaurs had to have been sortof-birds because for a lizard to reach that size it would’ve had to live hundreds of years. Whereas birds have a period of rapid growth when young, which enables them to reach near full adult size in a single breeding season. Basically: All birds are dinosaurs but not all dinosaurs are birds.

tokai 2y ago

dzonga didn't bring up any distinction. On the contrary. An old bird breeding naturally raises questions about the lifespans of non-avian dinosaurs, because they are related.

rsynnott 2y ago

Birds are a subset of dinosaurs; not all dinosaurs were birds, though all current dinosaurs are birds.

zie 2y ago
I thought crocodiles counted? They are related to birds, but clearly are not birds.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- LandStander 2y ago
  OneZoom.org has a nice common ancestor search feature. Here are the results for albatross and crocodile: https://www.onezoom.org/life/@Archelosauria=4947372?otthome=%40_ozid%3D1&highlight=path%3A%40Diomedeidae%3D85277&highlight=path%3A%40Crocodylus%3D35868#x525,y1310,w1.6361 https://www.onezoom.org/life/@Archelosauria=4947372?otthome=...
  - zie 2y ago
    When clicking the link, I just get an error saying the species is not in the DB.