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Your feelings as a non-Japanese have absolutely no bearing on what flies in Japan. Whether the content concerned is tentacle hentai, or goth lolis, or genderbe

Your feelings as a non-Japanese have absolutely no bearing on what flies in Japan. Whether the content concerned is tentacle hentai, or goth lolis, or genderbent King Arthur and Leonardo Da Vinci, or whatever else, that stuff is legal under Japanese law and Visa/MC are violating Japanese rights ordering Japanese creators and merchants to censor them. Visa/MC are quite literally engaging in foreign interference and subversion of democracy and Japan's very culture.

epolanski 2y ago
That's overblown. In any case, you can't force a private entity to do business with you.
- efitz 2y ago
  Sure you can. Power companies etc.
habinero 2y ago
That's a, uh, rather overheated statement and ironically, a very Western point of view. Japan is one of the richest nations in the world, they can (and do) run their own payments systems. Also, it's risible to call that stuff Japan's "very culture". It's not. Otaku culture is fringe there, too. Japan is not anime. Also, there are plenty of legal things that are (rightly) publicly shamed and ostracized. For example, I don't want white supremacists to go to jail for what they say, but I want their lives to be as annoying and lonely as possible.
- lmm 2y ago
  > For example, I don't want white supremacists to go to jail for what they say, but I want their lives to be as annoying and lonely as possible. Do you want e.g. electricity companies to refuse to do business with them? Do you think that's a private business decision that doesn't need any particular right of appeal or evidentiary standard? (The author deliberately presents the notion that a bank account is something different from a utility as though this were an objective, immutable fact of nature, rather than the product of choices that the financial industry makes because it finds it very convenient to think of itself that way)
  - habinero 2y ago
    The idea of making people with 19th century views actually live in 19th century conditions is extremely amusing. We could try it, sure. On a more serious note, I don't think it's accurate or fair to say it's merely because of industry choices. The US stretched the idea of the common carrier (ie everyone has equal access to send freight on the railroads) to things like oil pipelines and telecommunications lines. Utilities offer services under license from the government and have special rights and subsidies. I don't think a bank account is that similar. It's essentially floating you a loan - you can cash a fraudulent check and skip out with the money, for example, and the bank eats the cost.
- Dalewyn 2y ago
  >Japan is one of the richest nations in the world, they can (and do) run their own payments systems. Indeed. JCB and certain western credit cards contracted with them for access into Japan (namely AMEX and Discover) have no problems (and why should they) with what Visa/MC want to censor. >Also, it's risible to call that stuff Japan's "very culture". It's not. Otaku culture is fringe there, too. Japan is not anime. Tentacle hentai goes back at least as far as Katsushika Hokusai[1], so you are mistaken. Otaku culture is very much a part of Japanese culture and inseparable. >Also, there are plenty of legal things that are (rightly) publicly shamed and ostracized. When legal tender cannot be used for legal transactions, there is a problem. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dream_of_the_Fisherman%27s_Wife https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dream_of_the_Fisherman%27s...
  - habinero 2y ago
    > When legal tender cannot be used for legal transactions, there is a problem Why? Something being legal for you doesn't make it compulsory for others. With limited exceptions, nobody is required to do business with you. Also, I must stress again that Japan is a real country with real people. It is not anime, and it's even more risible to point to famous historical porn and say it's analogous to modern porn. That's like gay slurs are deeply central to American culture because the Roman poet Catallus lost his cool once at some critics.[0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catullus_16 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catullus_16
    - Dalewyn 2y ago
      >Why? Something being legal for you doesn't make it compulsory for others. Money is legal tender for all debts public and private, money has value precisely because everyone can and should use and accept it. If banks or payment processors inhibit or prohibit my ability to conduct business by refusing to transact my money with no justifiable basis, then that is violating my and the other party's rights to free association as well as destroying the very essence of money. If you truly do not see the very serious problem here, I'm not sure what it will take to enlighten you. >Also, I must stress again that Japan is a real country with real people. You are literally talking to a Japanese man, I probably know about Japan more intimately than you will ever do. >It is not anime Otaku culture is an inseparable part of Japanese culture and attacking it like Visa/MC are doing is attacking Japanese culture, what part of that do you not understand? >it's even more risible to point to famous historical porn and say it's analogous to modern porn. Kinoe no Komatsu[1] is quite literally a doujinshi-equivalent[2] from its time. Classic Japanese eroges are sometimes featured[3] as a symbol of Japanese culture of its time. >That's like gay slurs are deeply central to American culture because the Roman poet Catallus lost his cool once at some critics. Whitewashing histories and cultures is nothing short of reprehensible. Whatever happened to diversity and heritage? [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinoe_no_Komatsu https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinoe_no_Komatsu [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shunga https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shunga [3]: https://x.com/Ian_Fisch/status/1820897232746594354 https://x.com/Ian_Fisch/status/1820897232746594354 - The lower screenshot (it is SFW) is from Words Worth[4]. The dialogue translates to English like so: [Astral]: Hey Katra... Are you always peeping at Sharon when she's naked? [4]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Words_Worth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Words_Worth (Link is SFW.)
- rosmax_1337 2y ago
  What is a white supremacist?

epolanski 2y ago

That's overblown. In any case, you can't force a private entity to do business with you.

efitz 2y ago
Sure you can. Power companies etc.

habinero 2y ago

That's a, uh, rather overheated statement and ironically, a very Western point of view. Japan is one of the richest nations in the world, they can (and do) run their own payments systems. Also, it's risible to call that stuff Japan's "very culture". It's not. Otaku culture is fringe there, too. Japan is not anime. Also, there are plenty of legal things that are (rightly) publicly shamed and ostracized. For example, I don't want white supremacists to go to jail for what they say, but I want their lives to be as annoying and lonely as possible.

lmm 2y ago
> For example, I don't want white supremacists to go to jail for what they say, but I want their lives to be as annoying and lonely as possible. Do you want e.g. electricity companies to refuse to do business with them? Do you think that's a private business decision that doesn't need any particular right of appeal or evidentiary standard? (The author deliberately presents the notion that a bank account is something different from a utility as though this were an objective, immutable fact of nature, rather than the product of choices that the financial industry makes because it finds it very convenient to think of itself that way)
- habinero 2y ago
  The idea of making people with 19th century views actually live in 19th century conditions is extremely amusing. We could try it, sure. On a more serious note, I don't think it's accurate or fair to say it's merely because of industry choices. The US stretched the idea of the common carrier (ie everyone has equal access to send freight on the railroads) to things like oil pipelines and telecommunications lines. Utilities offer services under license from the government and have special rights and subsidies. I don't think a bank account is that similar. It's essentially floating you a loan - you can cash a fraudulent check and skip out with the money, for example, and the bank eats the cost.
Dalewyn 2y ago
>Japan is one of the richest nations in the world, they can (and do) run their own payments systems. Indeed. JCB and certain western credit cards contracted with them for access into Japan (namely AMEX and Discover) have no problems (and why should they) with what Visa/MC want to censor. >Also, it's risible to call that stuff Japan's "very culture". It's not. Otaku culture is fringe there, too. Japan is not anime. Tentacle hentai goes back at least as far as Katsushika Hokusai[1], so you are mistaken. Otaku culture is very much a part of Japanese culture and inseparable. >Also, there are plenty of legal things that are (rightly) publicly shamed and ostracized. When legal tender cannot be used for legal transactions, there is a problem. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dream_of_the_Fisherman%27s_Wife https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dream_of_the_Fisherman%27s...
- habinero 2y ago
  > When legal tender cannot be used for legal transactions, there is a problem Why? Something being legal for you doesn't make it compulsory for others. With limited exceptions, nobody is required to do business with you. Also, I must stress again that Japan is a real country with real people. It is not anime, and it's even more risible to point to famous historical porn and say it's analogous to modern porn. That's like gay slurs are deeply central to American culture because the Roman poet Catallus lost his cool once at some critics.[0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catullus_16 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catullus_16
  - Dalewyn 2y ago
    >Why? Something being legal for you doesn't make it compulsory for others. Money is legal tender for all debts public and private, money has value precisely because everyone can and should use and accept it. If banks or payment processors inhibit or prohibit my ability to conduct business by refusing to transact my money with no justifiable basis, then that is violating my and the other party's rights to free association as well as destroying the very essence of money. If you truly do not see the very serious problem here, I'm not sure what it will take to enlighten you. >Also, I must stress again that Japan is a real country with real people. You are literally talking to a Japanese man, I probably know about Japan more intimately than you will ever do. >It is not anime Otaku culture is an inseparable part of Japanese culture and attacking it like Visa/MC are doing is attacking Japanese culture, what part of that do you not understand? >it's even more risible to point to famous historical porn and say it's analogous to modern porn. Kinoe no Komatsu[1] is quite literally a doujinshi-equivalent[2] from its time. Classic Japanese eroges are sometimes featured[3] as a symbol of Japanese culture of its time. >That's like gay slurs are deeply central to American culture because the Roman poet Catallus lost his cool once at some critics. Whitewashing histories and cultures is nothing short of reprehensible. Whatever happened to diversity and heritage? [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinoe_no_Komatsu https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinoe_no_Komatsu [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shunga https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shunga [3]: https://x.com/Ian_Fisch/status/1820897232746594354 https://x.com/Ian_Fisch/status/1820897232746594354 - The lower screenshot (it is SFW) is from Words Worth[4]. The dialogue translates to English like so: [Astral]: Hey Katra... Are you always peeping at Sharon when she's naked? [4]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Words_Worth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Words_Worth (Link is SFW.)
rosmax_1337 2y ago
What is a white supremacist?