7 ms·

A lot of scorn for this latest offering from Pi, but I think perspective is important here. No, most of us here do not have a use for the Pi 500 or it's display

by 0xEF 2y ago

A lot of scorn for this latest offering from Pi, but I think perspective is important here. No, most of us here do not have a use for the Pi 500 or it's display, but in part so the world where a lightweight low-consumption device can open some doors for connectivity and learning, this looks like a great solution. We tend to forget that not everyone on the planet has the same resources or needs we do.

gchadwick 2y ago
I do find HN threads about R-Pi products weigh heavily negative. Yet despite the apparent many major issues that keep getting pointed out R-Pi seems to keep going from strength to strength. Maybe they understand their own customers and their market better than commenters here?
- surgical_fire 2y ago
  HN crowd is solid in some very narrow technical subjects. The more you deviate from those, the worse. It quickly degenerates into some incredibly stupid takes from people that clearly think very highly of themselves, and are unable to do any introspection. R-Pi offerings are fine. It is supposed to be a cheap computer, and they could get something that costs less than 200 bucks with a monitor. Definitely not bad.
  - Ekaros 2y ago
    I think the thing many are starting to feel that they are not cheap anymore. At least compared to some things like refurb laptops and such. Just recently saw 249€ Lenovo laptop with Ryzen 5 4500U, 16GB RAM and 480GB SSD. Not new, but still, more powerful and having storage too.
    - surgical_fire 2y ago
      Yes, but that is true for basically every consumer product. Cars, electronics, you name it. "You can buy old restored/refurbished thing cheaper than a cheap brand new thing" is hardly a very insightful take. Does that mean that there is no market for "cheap brand new thing"?
      - Citizen_Lame 2y ago
        N100 box is new and cheaper. 256GB, 16GB RAM HDMI, 2.5 Gb network, case, charger etc. Raspberry Pi is pointless as a "cheap" computer. It's good if you you are building something which requires GPIO. So perhaps you are the one out of touch.
        geerlingguy 2y ago
        In some parts of the world, that box is around the same price as a similarly kitted Pi 5 (though with 8GB of RAM), but certainly not cheaper. Nothing against the N100 as an option, it's a great option for many use cases... but it's at minimum the same price (for a different type of computer), but typically a little more expensive ($150+)
        esskay 2y ago
        I think if its a one off purchase for use as a general pc or learning tool that doesn't require GPIO something like a second hand thinkcentre or optiplex is probably the best option. They'll be cheaper than a Pi 5 or Pi 500, plus often come with a keyboard and mouse in addition to the power supply. Sure, they arent going to be quite as power efficient but you're getting significantly more for your money, as well as repurposing second hand kit that might have otherwise ended up in landfill. GPIO aside I struggle to think of a good reason to buy a Pi 5 for this sort of application, especially when the cheaper second hand alternatives have one thing the pi doesn't - upgradability. On the N100's, they seem to occasionally get a fair bit cheaper. The GMKtec G3 Mini for example (8GB ram, 256GB SSD) was down to £67.55 on Aliexpress[1] recently for example. I do like a good Pi but for a lot of applications they just do not make much financial sense anymore. [1] https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/gmktec-g3-mini-pc-intel-alder-lake-n100-windows-11-pro-mini-pc-8gb256gb-4465113 https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/gmktec-g3-mini-pc-intel-ald...
        tacticalturtle 2y ago
        I’m all for second hand, and have gone in this direction myself for use cases, but you do need some bare minimum level of technical competency, or someone to guide you. I’ve purchased several SFFs on eBay, and had some experiences with broken hardware. If you’re purchasing this as learning tool, particular for kids/teenagers, that’s not going to be a great experience. That’s really the market where something like the Pi 400/500 shines. It’s new, it’s going to work, and the documentation/tutorials are super accessible.
  - cdt5050 2y ago
    I find that communities like these are far too focused on "TECHNICALLY CORRECT". Like, yeah, there are some things that technically are faster and cheaper than a Raspberry Pi, like that ebay special or that Alibaba-only SBC that's a direct copy of orange pi, or whatever. But when it comes to things you can't glean from spec sheets, they utterly fail. Like the most important thing: the human experience. Like when it comes to Pi competitors, nothing even comes close to the Pi in having such an ecosystem of learning resources. I personally really appreciate the MagPi magazine as it's a great source of inspiration.
- sho_hn 2y ago
  I have mixed feelings about their products :-) I use them quite a lot for various projects (mosty recently in my e-piano build, where the Pi 5 performs admirably pulling off low-latency audio for my piano VSTs - https://eikehein.com/piano https://eikehein.com/piano), but while I vibe with the whole "sets a known standard, just works, network effects" advantages, there's some real annoyances that run counter to that. For example, I'd expect the standard SBC from the Good Ones to have great upstream support, but it turns out a vanilla kernel doesn't support the Pi 5 until perhaps 6.13 due to lacklustre upstreaming efforts, meaning most alternative distros to the patched-up Raspberry Pi OS still don't support the Pi 5 properly. (I ended up managing to bake up a modified Fedora 41 because I wanted the much newer audio stack in said piano, but only with a lot of effort.) And yes, the dreaded Micro HDMI ports, perhaps the weakest, shoddiest, most prone-to-failure port around ... why they'd put those on the keyboard one (the 500 linked here) is beyond me. That said, I like a lot of the strategic choices they made with the RP1, and I suspect there will be more interesting HW from them coming down the pipe over time.
- mschuster91 2y ago
  > I do find HN threads about R-Pi products weigh heavily negative. The HN audience at large is still pissed that RPi chose to prioritize large industrial accounts over hobbyists during the Covid chip shortage era, and what few stock arrived at hobbyist distribution channels quickly got mopped up and re-sold by scalpers. A few FOSS hardliners are pissed about binary blobs and a lack of in-depth documentation - which is something I do understand, after all RPi-as-an-ecosystem should be one of the larger accounts at Broadcom, so I'd expect the negotiators to finally make some progress on that front in a decade. And others are pissed because Broadcom messed up Pi 4's PCIe implementation [1], or the RPi-side fuck-up with USB-C resistors. And the final general group of pissed-off people I'm aware of - which again I support - are annoyed about the situation regarding the CSI and DSI (camera and display, respectively) interfaces. Cameras still are limited to official cameras only, and there's (almost?) no DSI compatible displays which means everyone has to pay HDMI licensing fees despite not needing to. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27150697 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27150697
  - musicale 2y ago
    You're not wrong I think. ;-) I too was alienated by RPi's supply and scalping situation – combined with their seeming contempt for the hobbyists, teachers, and students who had actively supported the platform. Another unfortunate aspect is that Pi 5 has a list price of $50 vs. $35 for the 4 and earlier models (and also requires a more expensive power supply.) The price seems to be heading in the wrong direction.
- wqaatwt 2y ago
  And how successful the RPi 400 was? not saying it wasn’t but I doubt it was (after all it’s mainly a device for enthusiasts/toy) compared to their other products. > Maybe Maybe, maybe not. Certainly not saying they don’t but do you think that’s true about every single company by default?
Cumpiler69 2y ago
>but in part so the world where a lightweight low-consumption device can open some doors for connectivity and learning, this looks like a great solution I hear this repeated over and over again in RPi threads, but nobody ever provides any proof of developing nations using RPis as affordable desktop computers apart from some PR articles every now and then involving partnerships and donations. This feels more of an opinionated viewpoint or stereotype from clueless westerners from rich countries they have on developing countries. $50+ for a RPi might be affordable computer for you when your average computer at home is $700+, but for people in developing countries even $50 is A LOT of money and they're not gonna spend it buying RPis. As someone originally from a developing nation, most people there use x86 PCs or laptops from the used market or rescued from e-waste imports and repaired because they're much cheaper (nearly free) and more abundant than a new RPI 5 based computer, not to mention more versatile in what SW they can run. Or, more recently people started using old Android phones to learn on because they're also cheap and abundant and can be used for coding/tinkering. But RPis, not so much. The OLPC project intended to provide cheap computers to developing countries also failed in part because, just like a RPI as a computer, westerners don't understand the market of developing countries and do product development from their own privileged perspective. This isn't meant to denigrate anyone's work or effort, just wanted to share the reality in the field that I encountered. Oh and BTW, even in the rich west where I live now, a RPi5 is pretty expresive and impractical for a general purpose computer when you can find Core i5 laptops with 8GB of RAM and 256GB SSDs for that money on the used market. And it comes with display and battery to boot and can be used on the go.
- lukeck 2y ago
  This is a really interesting perspective. Thanks for sharing. In your opinion, what would a product that successfully provides low cost computing in developing markets look like? Is one even needed?
- alxlaz 2y ago
  Yeah, I'm going to second that. I've lived in (technically I am from what used to be a "developing nation" at the time), worked in, and worked with people from, "developing nations", both in education and industry. It's just not how things work. The Pi is a good educational platform for e.g. Western organizations that need to kickstart education programs at a scale. It's infinitely easier to ship 100 Pis than to locally source 100 similar computers and set them up. And it's as good a platform for introducing people to computers as any, I guess. But it's not the kind of platform that gets "grassroots" adoption. First off, if you live in a developing country, you want access to technology with wide-scale application (and the opportunities it brings). Realistically, what you want is something that runs Windows 11 or (dare dream...) macOS, that you can use to write mobile apps and games, web apps that target interesting and "hot" technologies and markets, learn system administration for contemporary platforms and so on. That alone kind of excludes anything that's not x86 or a Mac. Hipster platforms for retrogaming and "radical simplicity" is something that engineering professionals in well-off countries can afford to do as a hobby. But if you're learning programming in the hope that it will be a development opportunity (for yourself and your family, or for your country, no matter what form it takes, whether you want to emmigrate or stay and develop your local industry) you want to learn things with real industrial relevance. The few Pis I've seen used in a scenario like these were almost exclusively embedded devices, largely because the Pi is an easily-available embedded platform, making it easy to outsource development for it. But other than that? No, once you factor in shipping, currency conversion and all the accessories you need, a Pi is about as expensive as a hand-me-down laptop that can run a lot more software, with a lot less hassle, and isn't a fire hazard you have to be careful around with and/or fit into a makeshift case (because, if you have to scrounge money for a 50 USD Pi, even a 10 USD case is going to be kind of expensive).
thiht 2y ago
I would have absolutely loved getting this as my first personal computer. The form factor is so cool, and even living in a first world country, that price tag is incredible. I really don't understand most of the comments, who cares if it just has micro hdmi ports, no nvme (whatever it is, I don't think I would care if I was 16, and I don't think I care today either) or whatever you think is missing? It costs less than $100 and runs Linux!
- Citizen_Lame 2y ago
  Absolutely agree, but like 20 years ago.
- dagw 2y ago
  16 year old me, back when I was 16, would also have found this amazing. The thing is that today, lots of things cost less than $100 and runs linux. Go on Ebay or Facebook marketplace, and you'll find a near unlimited supply of $100 laptops that will run Linux at least as well as this will, and there you even get a screen. Go to AliExpress and you'll find mini PCs with similar specs to this for around $100, and you'll get an x86 CPU and the option of also running Windows. There is lots of competition in the "costs less than $100 and runs Linux" market, and it is not clear why this is necessarily better. who cares if it just has micro hdmi ports, no nvme Clearly lots of people. Choosing to need a special 'weird' cable, that very few people have lying around, to plug it into a monitor or choosing the storage option with the much worse IO performance and reliability just seem like strange choices, given that making the 'right' choice probably wouldn't increase the cost by all that much.
  - cdt5050 2y ago
    The Raspberry Pi has three huge advantages over those other options: 1) GPIO, letting you do things like learning to flash LEDs or controlling robotic arms and getting ready to use a Pi Zero for robots or such. 2) Cool add-ons, like the Pi Camera or AI modules, and a product family such as compute modules, Pi Zero, etc. A strong third party market of Hats, etc. 3) SUPPORT. Pi 500 is available as part of a kit with the official Raspberry Pi Beginner’s Guide, which I know from experience in teaching people interested in learning this kind of stuff, is a really awesome getting started resource. But it doesn't stop there -- Raspberry Pi Press has a lot of freely available books that teach various topics, AND a monthly magazine to teach and inspire. Not to mention countless tutorials meant specifically for Pi and Pi OS. This is really, really awesome. Those ebay specials aren't going to satisfy any of these. And while direct RPi competitors do provide a response to the first point, they get weak on the second point, the RPi is pretty unique in the third point.
aa-jv 2y ago
>We tend to forget that not everyone on the planet has the same resources or needs we do. True, but we must also admit that misguided prejudices about resources can lead people to miss out on some very significant opportunities, as well. By way of anecdotal example: I have a Pi 400 on my desk that I have used as a Linux development workstation for the past couple of years - in which it has performed superlatively, I might add. Its small and light and fast enough, yet works as a perfectly good performance metric/measurement for the projects I've thrown at it. I used it to develop a scientific instrumentation and sampling product which has gone on to produce >$40million in revenue for the customer. I've used it to develop audio capture tools which have been integrated into the r&d facilities at a major audio hardware vendor. So, even though it might seem 'underpowered' and 'un-sexy' for most such tasks, this particular embedded developer has been able to squeeze much value out of the limits of the hardware. Not only is it a good performance reference, but it has just enough oomph to allow me to avoid using cross-compiler techniques, and in that sense is a gateway device to so many very powerful embedded Linux development tools and methods.
pjmlp 2y ago
I personally find this great option for doing hobby ARM development on UNIX like OS, or even playing with build your own ARM OS kind of thing. My first computer had 48 KB of memory, folks don't have any idea of how much computing is wasted nowadays in their Electron garbage.
hashishen 2y ago
Exactly, everyone here complaining can probably build what they're looking for on their own att the end of the day

by 0xEF 2y ago

gchadwick 2y ago

I do find HN threads about R-Pi products weigh heavily negative. Yet despite the apparent many major issues that keep getting pointed out R-Pi seems to keep going from strength to strength. Maybe they understand their own customers and their market better than commenters here?

surgical_fire 2y ago
HN crowd is solid in some very narrow technical subjects. The more you deviate from those, the worse. It quickly degenerates into some incredibly stupid takes from people that clearly think very highly of themselves, and are unable to do any introspection. R-Pi offerings are fine. It is supposed to be a cheap computer, and they could get something that costs less than 200 bucks with a monitor. Definitely not bad.
- Ekaros 2y ago
  I think the thing many are starting to feel that they are not cheap anymore. At least compared to some things like refurb laptops and such. Just recently saw 249€ Lenovo laptop with Ryzen 5 4500U, 16GB RAM and 480GB SSD. Not new, but still, more powerful and having storage too.
  - surgical_fire 2y ago
    Yes, but that is true for basically every consumer product. Cars, electronics, you name it. "You can buy old restored/refurbished thing cheaper than a cheap brand new thing" is hardly a very insightful take. Does that mean that there is no market for "cheap brand new thing"?
    - Citizen_Lame 2y ago
      N100 box is new and cheaper. 256GB, 16GB RAM HDMI, 2.5 Gb network, case, charger etc. Raspberry Pi is pointless as a "cheap" computer. It's good if you you are building something which requires GPIO. So perhaps you are the one out of touch.
      - geerlingguy 2y ago
        In some parts of the world, that box is around the same price as a similarly kitted Pi 5 (though with 8GB of RAM), but certainly not cheaper. Nothing against the N100 as an option, it's a great option for many use cases... but it's at minimum the same price (for a different type of computer), but typically a little more expensive ($150+)
        esskay 2y ago
        I think if its a one off purchase for use as a general pc or learning tool that doesn't require GPIO something like a second hand thinkcentre or optiplex is probably the best option. They'll be cheaper than a Pi 5 or Pi 500, plus often come with a keyboard and mouse in addition to the power supply. Sure, they arent going to be quite as power efficient but you're getting significantly more for your money, as well as repurposing second hand kit that might have otherwise ended up in landfill. GPIO aside I struggle to think of a good reason to buy a Pi 5 for this sort of application, especially when the cheaper second hand alternatives have one thing the pi doesn't - upgradability. On the N100's, they seem to occasionally get a fair bit cheaper. The GMKtec G3 Mini for example (8GB ram, 256GB SSD) was down to £67.55 on Aliexpress[1] recently for example. I do like a good Pi but for a lot of applications they just do not make much financial sense anymore. [1] https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/gmktec-g3-mini-pc-intel-alder-lake-n100-windows-11-pro-mini-pc-8gb256gb-4465113 https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/gmktec-g3-mini-pc-intel-ald...
        tacticalturtle 2y ago
        I’m all for second hand, and have gone in this direction myself for use cases, but you do need some bare minimum level of technical competency, or someone to guide you. I’ve purchased several SFFs on eBay, and had some experiences with broken hardware. If you’re purchasing this as learning tool, particular for kids/teenagers, that’s not going to be a great experience. That’s really the market where something like the Pi 400/500 shines. It’s new, it’s going to work, and the documentation/tutorials are super accessible.
- cdt5050 2y ago
  I find that communities like these are far too focused on "TECHNICALLY CORRECT". Like, yeah, there are some things that technically are faster and cheaper than a Raspberry Pi, like that ebay special or that Alibaba-only SBC that's a direct copy of orange pi, or whatever. But when it comes to things you can't glean from spec sheets, they utterly fail. Like the most important thing: the human experience. Like when it comes to Pi competitors, nothing even comes close to the Pi in having such an ecosystem of learning resources. I personally really appreciate the MagPi magazine as it's a great source of inspiration.
sho_hn 2y ago
I have mixed feelings about their products :-) I use them quite a lot for various projects (mosty recently in my e-piano build, where the Pi 5 performs admirably pulling off low-latency audio for my piano VSTs - https://eikehein.com/piano https://eikehein.com/piano), but while I vibe with the whole "sets a known standard, just works, network effects" advantages, there's some real annoyances that run counter to that. For example, I'd expect the standard SBC from the Good Ones to have great upstream support, but it turns out a vanilla kernel doesn't support the Pi 5 until perhaps 6.13 due to lacklustre upstreaming efforts, meaning most alternative distros to the patched-up Raspberry Pi OS still don't support the Pi 5 properly. (I ended up managing to bake up a modified Fedora 41 because I wanted the much newer audio stack in said piano, but only with a lot of effort.) And yes, the dreaded Micro HDMI ports, perhaps the weakest, shoddiest, most prone-to-failure port around ... why they'd put those on the keyboard one (the 500 linked here) is beyond me. That said, I like a lot of the strategic choices they made with the RP1, and I suspect there will be more interesting HW from them coming down the pipe over time.
mschuster91 2y ago
> I do find HN threads about R-Pi products weigh heavily negative. The HN audience at large is still pissed that RPi chose to prioritize large industrial accounts over hobbyists during the Covid chip shortage era, and what few stock arrived at hobbyist distribution channels quickly got mopped up and re-sold by scalpers. A few FOSS hardliners are pissed about binary blobs and a lack of in-depth documentation - which is something I do understand, after all RPi-as-an-ecosystem should be one of the larger accounts at Broadcom, so I'd expect the negotiators to finally make some progress on that front in a decade. And others are pissed because Broadcom messed up Pi 4's PCIe implementation [1], or the RPi-side fuck-up with USB-C resistors. And the final general group of pissed-off people I'm aware of - which again I support - are annoyed about the situation regarding the CSI and DSI (camera and display, respectively) interfaces. Cameras still are limited to official cameras only, and there's (almost?) no DSI compatible displays which means everyone has to pay HDMI licensing fees despite not needing to. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27150697 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27150697
- musicale 2y ago
  You're not wrong I think. ;-) I too was alienated by RPi's supply and scalping situation – combined with their seeming contempt for the hobbyists, teachers, and students who had actively supported the platform. Another unfortunate aspect is that Pi 5 has a list price of $50 vs. $35 for the 4 and earlier models (and also requires a more expensive power supply.) The price seems to be heading in the wrong direction.
wqaatwt 2y ago
And how successful the RPi 400 was? not saying it wasn’t but I doubt it was (after all it’s mainly a device for enthusiasts/toy) compared to their other products. > Maybe Maybe, maybe not. Certainly not saying they don’t but do you think that’s true about every single company by default?

Cumpiler69 2y ago

>but in part so the world where a lightweight low-consumption device can open some doors for connectivity and learning, this looks like a great solution I hear this repeated over and over again in RPi threads, but nobody ever provides any proof of developing nations using RPis as affordable desktop computers apart from some PR articles every now and then involving partnerships and donations. This feels more of an opinionated viewpoint or stereotype from clueless westerners from rich countries they have on developing countries. $50+ for a RPi might be affordable computer for you when your average computer at home is $700+, but for people in developing countries even $50 is A LOT of money and they're not gonna spend it buying RPis. As someone originally from a developing nation, most people there use x86 PCs or laptops from the used market or rescued from e-waste imports and repaired because they're much cheaper (nearly free) and more abundant than a new RPI 5 based computer, not to mention more versatile in what SW they can run. Or, more recently people started using old Android phones to learn on because they're also cheap and abundant and can be used for coding/tinkering. But RPis, not so much. The OLPC project intended to provide cheap computers to developing countries also failed in part because, just like a RPI as a computer, westerners don't understand the market of developing countries and do product development from their own privileged perspective. This isn't meant to denigrate anyone's work or effort, just wanted to share the reality in the field that I encountered. Oh and BTW, even in the rich west where I live now, a RPi5 is pretty expresive and impractical for a general purpose computer when you can find Core i5 laptops with 8GB of RAM and 256GB SSDs for that money on the used market. And it comes with display and battery to boot and can be used on the go.

lukeck 2y ago
This is a really interesting perspective. Thanks for sharing. In your opinion, what would a product that successfully provides low cost computing in developing markets look like? Is one even needed?
alxlaz 2y ago
Yeah, I'm going to second that. I've lived in (technically I am from what used to be a "developing nation" at the time), worked in, and worked with people from, "developing nations", both in education and industry. It's just not how things work. The Pi is a good educational platform for e.g. Western organizations that need to kickstart education programs at a scale. It's infinitely easier to ship 100 Pis than to locally source 100 similar computers and set them up. And it's as good a platform for introducing people to computers as any, I guess. But it's not the kind of platform that gets "grassroots" adoption. First off, if you live in a developing country, you want access to technology with wide-scale application (and the opportunities it brings). Realistically, what you want is something that runs Windows 11 or (dare dream...) macOS, that you can use to write mobile apps and games, web apps that target interesting and "hot" technologies and markets, learn system administration for contemporary platforms and so on. That alone kind of excludes anything that's not x86 or a Mac. Hipster platforms for retrogaming and "radical simplicity" is something that engineering professionals in well-off countries can afford to do as a hobby. But if you're learning programming in the hope that it will be a development opportunity (for yourself and your family, or for your country, no matter what form it takes, whether you want to emmigrate or stay and develop your local industry) you want to learn things with real industrial relevance. The few Pis I've seen used in a scenario like these were almost exclusively embedded devices, largely because the Pi is an easily-available embedded platform, making it easy to outsource development for it. But other than that? No, once you factor in shipping, currency conversion and all the accessories you need, a Pi is about as expensive as a hand-me-down laptop that can run a lot more software, with a lot less hassle, and isn't a fire hazard you have to be careful around with and/or fit into a makeshift case (because, if you have to scrounge money for a 50 USD Pi, even a 10 USD case is going to be kind of expensive).

thiht 2y ago

I would have absolutely loved getting this as my first personal computer. The form factor is so cool, and even living in a first world country, that price tag is incredible. I really don't understand most of the comments, who cares if it just has micro hdmi ports, no nvme (whatever it is, I don't think I would care if I was 16, and I don't think I care today either) or whatever you think is missing? It costs less than $100 and runs Linux!

Citizen_Lame 2y ago
Absolutely agree, but like 20 years ago.
dagw 2y ago
16 year old me, back when I was 16, would also have found this amazing. The thing is that today, lots of things cost less than $100 and runs linux. Go on Ebay or Facebook marketplace, and you'll find a near unlimited supply of $100 laptops that will run Linux at least as well as this will, and there you even get a screen. Go to AliExpress and you'll find mini PCs with similar specs to this for around $100, and you'll get an x86 CPU and the option of also running Windows. There is lots of competition in the "costs less than $100 and runs Linux" market, and it is not clear why this is necessarily better. who cares if it just has micro hdmi ports, no nvme Clearly lots of people. Choosing to need a special 'weird' cable, that very few people have lying around, to plug it into a monitor or choosing the storage option with the much worse IO performance and reliability just seem like strange choices, given that making the 'right' choice probably wouldn't increase the cost by all that much.
- cdt5050 2y ago
  The Raspberry Pi has three huge advantages over those other options: 1) GPIO, letting you do things like learning to flash LEDs or controlling robotic arms and getting ready to use a Pi Zero for robots or such. 2) Cool add-ons, like the Pi Camera or AI modules, and a product family such as compute modules, Pi Zero, etc. A strong third party market of Hats, etc. 3) SUPPORT. Pi 500 is available as part of a kit with the official Raspberry Pi Beginner’s Guide, which I know from experience in teaching people interested in learning this kind of stuff, is a really awesome getting started resource. But it doesn't stop there -- Raspberry Pi Press has a lot of freely available books that teach various topics, AND a monthly magazine to teach and inspire. Not to mention countless tutorials meant specifically for Pi and Pi OS. This is really, really awesome. Those ebay specials aren't going to satisfy any of these. And while direct RPi competitors do provide a response to the first point, they get weak on the second point, the RPi is pretty unique in the third point.

aa-jv 2y ago

>We tend to forget that not everyone on the planet has the same resources or needs we do. True, but we must also admit that misguided prejudices about resources can lead people to miss out on some very significant opportunities, as well. By way of anecdotal example: I have a Pi 400 on my desk that I have used as a Linux development workstation for the past couple of years - in which it has performed superlatively, I might add. Its small and light and fast enough, yet works as a perfectly good performance metric/measurement for the projects I've thrown at it. I used it to develop a scientific instrumentation and sampling product which has gone on to produce >$40million in revenue for the customer. I've used it to develop audio capture tools which have been integrated into the r&d facilities at a major audio hardware vendor. So, even though it might seem 'underpowered' and 'un-sexy' for most such tasks, this particular embedded developer has been able to squeeze much value out of the limits of the hardware. Not only is it a good performance reference, but it has just enough oomph to allow me to avoid using cross-compiler techniques, and in that sense is a gateway device to so many very powerful embedded Linux development tools and methods.

pjmlp 2y ago

I personally find this great option for doing hobby ARM development on UNIX like OS, or even playing with build your own ARM OS kind of thing. My first computer had 48 KB of memory, folks don't have any idea of how much computing is wasted nowadays in their Electron garbage.

hashishen 2y ago

Exactly, everyone here complaining can probably build what they're looking for on their own att the end of the day