4 ms·

uv is its own thing, but direnv + `source .venv/bin/activate` is straightforward nowadays. Direnv has saved me so much pain nowadays

by rtpg 2y ago

goku12 2y ago
I like direnv too. But if you're not planning to use uv, you might want to give pipenv a try - the officially recommended tool for the purpose. Pipenv has just one command to create a virtual environment and install packages. And while pipenv can handle traditional requirements.text file, it's real strength is pipfile - a richer format with supporting lock files. Pipenv doesn't automatically activate the venv on entry into a shell. But a shell plugin named pipenv-activate supports this. It does what you use direnv for in this case, without an envrc file in the source. One major difference of pipenv from vanilla venv is that pipenv creates the venv in a common location outside the project (like poetry does). But this shouldn't be a big problem, since you wouldn't commit the venv into VCS anyway.
- BerislavLopac 2y ago
  Pipenv is certainly not "officially recommended", and it should be avoided at all costs: https://chriswarrick.com/blog/2018/07/17/pipenv-promises-a-lot-delivers-very-little/ https://chriswarrick.com/blog/2018/07/17/pipenv-promises-a-l...
  - short_sells_poo 2y ago
    I'm loving how we're just 3 levels down into "python installers/package management" and it's already a heap of radioactive waste. Within 3 comments, 6 different python packaging and/or environment management tools were mentioned, and as a seasoned python user, I haven't even heard of direnv yet. Every week, a new pip/py/v/dir/fuck/shit/tit/arse -env tool emerges and adds to the pile of turd that is python packaging. It's truly getting to parody level of incompetence that we are displaying in the python community here.
    - vimto 2y ago
      haha, thank you for summarising my thoughts on python package management... and very few people have mentioned poetry which is what we and most teams I know use.
      - short_sells_poo 2y ago
        I use poetry as well, but lately I've been looking at uv and had to actively stop myself because it'd be the 3rd tool I migrated to in the last 3 years. Rust programmers seem to be lousy with ECS frameworks that never get used in any games but seem hell bent on proving that rust is the best language for game programming, and python programmers seem to break out in a case of "packaging tool building". I don't know what causes this. Perhaps some sort of pathological thinking that "I can do better"? I really like python (and I like rust too), but if I were to take an honest look at the python packaging and environment ecosystem, I'd think that I'm being trolled. I lived through the age of setuptools.py, and while it was not good, at least there was only one approach really. Now we have a bazillion approaches that are all good, and zero consensus on what to use. Each individual tool is much better than what we had before, but the landscape has become so fractured that as a whole it's a complete shitshow.
        no_wizard 2y ago
        Rust has no GUI game yet, and it’s the last heavy bastion of C++. Therefore, I think it’s because so many Rust programmers were C++ programmers they would like to move another major stronghold over. Pure speculation though.
        short_sells_poo 2y ago
        The first project I built to learn rust - we are talking 2018 - was an ECS. I was speaking of personal experience in that particular jibe :) Happily, I haven't yet been afflicted by a strong urge to build python packaging tools and inshallah I will escape this dreadful fate.
    - djbusby 2y ago
faster 2y ago
Why `source .venv/bin/activate` with direnv? I use `layout python` in my .envrc and direnv activates the venv on entry to the directory.
- rtpg 2y ago
  `layout python` means that the venv is managed by the layout script in direnv, but when sourcing manually I can create it with uv (or pyenv, because I sometimes need to pin the python version) and then just add the source line. `layout python` is great when that just works. I have trouble juggling various Python version effectively with direnv's layout script (I _know_ I'm doing something wrong, but I can just set up a virtual env as a one time operation so...) (I also like sourcing bceause I know _exactly_ what's happening, as I know more about the activation scripts than the layout script direnv provides. But that's just a personal thing)

uv is its own thing, but direnv + `source .venv/bin/activate` is straightforward nowadays. Direnv has saved me so much pain nowadays

by rtpg 2y ago

uv is its own thing, but direnv + `source .venv/bin/activate` is straightforward nowadays. Direnv has saved me so much pain nowadays

goku12 2y ago

I like direnv too. But if you're not planning to use uv, you might want to give pipenv a try - the officially recommended tool for the purpose. Pipenv has just one command to create a virtual environment and install packages. And while pipenv can handle traditional requirements.text file, it's real strength is pipfile - a richer format with supporting lock files. Pipenv doesn't automatically activate the venv on entry into a shell. But a shell plugin named pipenv-activate supports this. It does what you use direnv for in this case, without an envrc file in the source. One major difference of pipenv from vanilla venv is that pipenv creates the venv in a common location outside the project (like poetry does). But this shouldn't be a big problem, since you wouldn't commit the venv into VCS anyway.

BerislavLopac 2y ago
Pipenv is certainly not "officially recommended", and it should be avoided at all costs: https://chriswarrick.com/blog/2018/07/17/pipenv-promises-a-lot-delivers-very-little/ https://chriswarrick.com/blog/2018/07/17/pipenv-promises-a-l...
- short_sells_poo 2y ago
  I'm loving how we're just 3 levels down into "python installers/package management" and it's already a heap of radioactive waste. Within 3 comments, 6 different python packaging and/or environment management tools were mentioned, and as a seasoned python user, I haven't even heard of direnv yet. Every week, a new pip/py/v/dir/fuck/shit/tit/arse -env tool emerges and adds to the pile of turd that is python packaging. It's truly getting to parody level of incompetence that we are displaying in the python community here.
  - vimto 2y ago
    haha, thank you for summarising my thoughts on python package management... and very few people have mentioned poetry which is what we and most teams I know use.
    - short_sells_poo 2y ago
      I use poetry as well, but lately I've been looking at uv and had to actively stop myself because it'd be the 3rd tool I migrated to in the last 3 years. Rust programmers seem to be lousy with ECS frameworks that never get used in any games but seem hell bent on proving that rust is the best language for game programming, and python programmers seem to break out in a case of "packaging tool building". I don't know what causes this. Perhaps some sort of pathological thinking that "I can do better"? I really like python (and I like rust too), but if I were to take an honest look at the python packaging and environment ecosystem, I'd think that I'm being trolled. I lived through the age of setuptools.py, and while it was not good, at least there was only one approach really. Now we have a bazillion approaches that are all good, and zero consensus on what to use. Each individual tool is much better than what we had before, but the landscape has become so fractured that as a whole it's a complete shitshow.
      - no_wizard 2y ago
        Rust has no GUI game yet, and it’s the last heavy bastion of C++. Therefore, I think it’s because so many Rust programmers were C++ programmers they would like to move another major stronghold over. Pure speculation though.
        short_sells_poo 2y ago
        The first project I built to learn rust - we are talking 2018 - was an ECS. I was speaking of personal experience in that particular jibe :) Happily, I haven't yet been afflicted by a strong urge to build python packaging tools and inshallah I will escape this dreadful fate.
  - djbusby 2y ago

faster 2y ago

Why `source .venv/bin/activate` with direnv? I use `layout python` in my .envrc and direnv activates the venv on entry to the directory.

rtpg 2y ago
`layout python` means that the venv is managed by the layout script in direnv, but when sourcing manually I can create it with uv (or pyenv, because I sometimes need to pin the python version) and then just add the source line. `layout python` is great when that just works. I have trouble juggling various Python version effectively with direnv's layout script (I _know_ I'm doing something wrong, but I can just set up a virtual env as a one time operation so...) (I also like sourcing bceause I know _exactly_ what's happening, as I know more about the activation scripts than the layout script direnv provides. But that's just a personal thing)