8 ms·

Can we do gambling ads next? We banned tobacco ads and then seemingly forgot the lesson that it's actually bad to let advertisers shove addictive and self-destr

Can we do gambling ads next? We banned tobacco ads and then seemingly forgot the lesson that it's actually bad to let advertisers shove addictive and self-destructive products in the publics face, including to former addicts at risk of relapse.

optimalsolver 2y ago
>Can we do gambling ads next? As long as we ban ads for stock trading platforms (i.e. gambling for the professional classes) at the same time.
- jsheard 2y ago
  I don't disagree, but stock trading ads are in some ways already more strictly regulated than gambling ads here. Gambling ads are required to have a vague "please gamble responsibly" statement, but ads for CFD trading platforms are required to have a prominent warning stating the exact percentage of their accounts which lose money (often >75%). The gambling ads don't have to tell you the real odds of coming out ahead. e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KM_zuudkSnY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KM_zuudkSnY
- stego-tech 2y ago
  I think a fair and reasonable advertisement policy is to ban all advertisements during "children's programming hours", or 0800 to 1600 when school is not in session. During "Prime Time" hours of 0500-0800 and 1600-2300, adverts should be limited to luxury goods (e.g., fashion), government PSAs, and non-addictive goods or services (NO drugs, NO tobacco, NO gambling, and NO stock trading, to name but a few). Between 2300 and 0400, allow "free reign" on subscription channels but still bar "vice" or addiction ads. We've got a century of data showing laissez-faire approaches to advertising results in maximum harm to a society, and ample recent data from the internet age showing how dark patterns in psychology are exploited by advertisers to drive outcomes. We have to do better, and the UK's step is at least an attempt to stem the harm. I can't fault entities from at least trying to do better.
  - chgs 2y ago
    Daytime tv is all about brainwashing wealthy retired people. Still not as bad as those weird country which advertise prescription medicine
  - alexchamberlain 2y ago
    I wonder what proportion of children are still watching mainstream TV? My son (4) mainly watches Disney+ and Netflix.
    - fn-mote 2y ago
      Choosing streaming services will be correlated to income. Netflix (medium $) and Disney+ (high $$). The less wealthy are watching YouTube with ads included.
  - lmm 2y ago
    Children are the people least able to destroy their own lives through spending, so that feels pretty backwards. I think it's generally accepted that people who grow up around e.g. alcohol tend to have a healthier relationship with it than people who are suddenly exposed to it as an adult.
    - BehindBlueEyes 2y ago
      But they are among the most impressionable and it is effective to target the parents via kids nagging them.
  - BehindBlueEyes 2y ago
    Add to your list to ban medical advertisement to the vice and addiction bar. Do you feel like your knee itches sometime? You may have BSitis, ask your doctor if our product is right for you... Replace all these with a generic, if you feel sick, go see a doctor, that's what they are for if needed.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- iamacyborg 2y ago
  Wait until you hear about how CFD trading is legal in large parts of the world.
  - throwaway2037 2y ago
    Is the payout on a CFD the same as a future or forward?
- datavirtue 2y ago
  Irrelevant. Stocks are a share of a company. The have book value and intrinsic value. Freedom to buy and sell is essential. Of course, crypto speculation is something different altogether. Maybe you were thinking about all the poor schleps buying Bitcoin for $100k? Even then, your chances of winning are around 50/50 and no one is forcing you to cash out.
- hermitcrab 2y ago
  There is an important difference. With stocks, the punter wins on average. With gambling, the punter loses on average. You can still lose all your money on stocks, with a combination of bad choices and bad luck. But it is much easier to lose it on the horses.
  - shric 2y ago
    The punter does not win on average with stocks due to fees and spread.
    - hermitcrab 2y ago
      IIRC average stock market returns have historically been around 7% per year. Index funds charge around 1% per year. My stock ISAs have gone up pretty much every year (after inflation and fees).
      - rfrey 2y ago
        Putting your money into an index fund is the exact opposite of what is being advertised, e.g. trading platforms optimized for day trading, complete with blinkenlighten and "learn to trade" mini courses teaching technical indicators and other voodoo nonsense.
        hermitcrab 2y ago
        There is a reason they spend loads of money on ads trying to get you into day trading. ;0)
      - lmm 2y ago
        > Index funds charge around 1% per year. You're getting ripped off, you should be paying a small fraction of that.
        hermitcrab 2y ago
        Vanguard UK charge 0.06% to 0.6% per year on their index funds: https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/what-we-offer/all-products https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/what-we-offer/all-product... Plus a 0.15% account fee: https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/what-we-offer/fees-explained https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/what-we-offer/fees-explai... Most others charge more.
jonplackett 2y ago
The warnings for gambling ads are particularly infuriating. Like what would anyone think of a smoking warning of “when the fun stops, stop”
manojlds 2y ago
It's interesting that one of the tax free investment/savings choices in the UK is basically a lottery.
- thom 2y ago
  You’re not risking any capital though, if you mean Premium Bonds.
  - anotheracc88 2y ago
    Even better, pay that money into a pension and buy a lottery ticket.
    - hinkley 2y ago
      Pensions sort of already are a lottery. Can’t collect if you’re dead. Live to 95 and they help a lot. Though inflation will still getcha in the end.
      - anotheracc88 2y ago
        Yes if you choose annuity but you can also buy those with regular cash so it's as relevant here as price of tea. Pensions are more tax efficient and offer a better option of investments (companies) than what is effectively fiat interest going into a lottery pool. If you have cash in premium bonds you might die young then pay inheritance tax. Better give your kids cash earlier to live off or invest to avoid this, and so they can over-stuff their pensions ;). Not many people think that far ahead (60 year horizon)
        hinkley 2y ago
        Some young adults in my life have grandparents who just hit this point, and are trying to set up gifting money to the grandkids in the form of brokerage accounts.
      - petesergeant 2y ago
cynicalsecurity 2y ago
The business is probably owned by some rich and influential chap who eagerly shares with the right people in the parliament.
ashconnor 2y ago
Considering Labour's connection to gambling companies [0] probably not. [0] https://www.theguardian.com/society/article/2024/jun/28/tory-betting-scandal-labour-gambling-industry-regulation https://www.theguardian.com/society/article/2024/jun/28/tory...
- hermitcrab 2y ago
  Indeed. It has been heavily covered in Private Eye, as well. Labour is deeply in hock to the gambling industry. So much for "gambling is the curse of the working class".
  - Der_Einzige 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - hermitcrab 2y ago
      >luckily my country voted with guns to refuse to recognize the authority of your tyrannical monarchy And how is that going?
      - Der_Einzige 2y ago
        USD is making every other country look and feel poor with how strong it is right now, vs… brexit, so it’s going great! The UK is the sick man of Europe.
- fakedang 2y ago
  Funny how you can buy British politicians for dirt cheap. In India or the US, it would take at least $100k-200k to get a single politician's attention at the bare minimum, while in the UK you can influence party positions for 25k quid.
  - saagarjha 2y ago
    I don't have enough experience about India to comment on that but in the US the amount of money it takes to influence a politician is quite low.
LeoPanthera 2y ago
It's interesting that the UK has banned gambling ads online, but not on TV. Combined with the fact that they regulate cryptocurrencies as gambling, that's why you get no UK crypto ads online. For example, the PayPal UK front page doesn't even mention that you can buy crypto there.
- zakki 2y ago
  Do you have the link that regulate crypto as gambling in UK? I tried Google it but no luck.
  - exe34 2y ago
    wait if crypto is gambling, then they don't tax the proceeds, right? but I'm pretty sure they tax it as capital gains..... so it's gambling for advertising purposes but capital investment for tax purposes... I suppose the law is an ass.
  - frereubu 2y ago
    This isn't true. OP may be confusing things like this - https://www.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/licensees-and-businesses/guide/page/blockchain-technology-and-crypto-assets https://www.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/licensees-and-business... - as saying that crypto is regulated as gambling, but it's not.
- rgblambda 2y ago
  Maybe this is blurring the line between online and TV, but TV streaming services definitely have gambling ads. A gambling ad literally just came on the Channel 4 player in front of me as I started typing this.
- thenickdude 2y ago
  You can buy crypto on PayPal?? Our New Zealand version doesn't mention it either.
  - LeoPanthera 2y ago
    Not in New Zealand. The USA, the UK, and Luxembourg only.
andrepd 2y ago
I'm not in the UK, but yeah it's nothing short of fucking disgusting how plastered TV is with these incessant gambling ads. "Gamble on slots on your phone while you're in the metro, the hairdresser, the dentist!" they shout, at kids and adults alike, 2 times every minute on every commercial break. Disgusting.
dzonga 2y ago
i was going to comment on this. gambling ads of all kinds, sky-bet, sky vegas casino + whatever in their hydra form. in depressed places like luton - you see how gambling has destroyed the little that remained. ban gambling companies from sponsoring sports teams, from being associated with sports teams etc.
- hermitcrab 2y ago
  It is very noticeable that the gambling shops are clustered around the poorest parts of every town. I grew up near a gambling shop. You would see the punters desparately trying to eek out every last puff on their roll-up cigarettes, while the gambling shop owner would drive up in his Rolls Royce.
b800h 2y ago
Or massive vaping ads on the side of school buses.
surgical_fire 2y ago
I wonder if a prohibition to have gambling ads on TV would affect the Premier League teams that have gambling sponsorships
gwbas1c 2y ago
Let's just ban all ads!
- thanksgiving 2y ago
  A good start would be a ban on ads based on who is viewing the ad vs what the content surrounding the ad is... So, Casper mattress wants to have an ad spot in a podcast or a YouTube video in the video itself? That's ok. YouTube wants to include an ad about a mattress in a video about home renovation? Also ok. Stack overflow wants to show an ad for GitHub? Is ok to me. YouTube wants to show an ad about Casper mattress based on whether someone has clicked on an ad about mattresses before? Banned! This alone would be a great start.
  - Nullabillity 2y ago
    Or... just get rid of them all.
  - gwbas1c 2y ago
    I was joking, but I think you make my point better.
benatkin 2y ago
Sarcasm I hope...
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

optimalsolver 2y ago

>Can we do gambling ads next? As long as we ban ads for stock trading platforms (i.e. gambling for the professional classes) at the same time.

jsheard 2y ago
I don't disagree, but stock trading ads are in some ways already more strictly regulated than gambling ads here. Gambling ads are required to have a vague "please gamble responsibly" statement, but ads for CFD trading platforms are required to have a prominent warning stating the exact percentage of their accounts which lose money (often >75%). The gambling ads don't have to tell you the real odds of coming out ahead. e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KM_zuudkSnY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KM_zuudkSnY
stego-tech 2y ago
I think a fair and reasonable advertisement policy is to ban all advertisements during "children's programming hours", or 0800 to 1600 when school is not in session. During "Prime Time" hours of 0500-0800 and 1600-2300, adverts should be limited to luxury goods (e.g., fashion), government PSAs, and non-addictive goods or services (NO drugs, NO tobacco, NO gambling, and NO stock trading, to name but a few). Between 2300 and 0400, allow "free reign" on subscription channels but still bar "vice" or addiction ads. We've got a century of data showing laissez-faire approaches to advertising results in maximum harm to a society, and ample recent data from the internet age showing how dark patterns in psychology are exploited by advertisers to drive outcomes. We have to do better, and the UK's step is at least an attempt to stem the harm. I can't fault entities from at least trying to do better.
- chgs 2y ago
  Daytime tv is all about brainwashing wealthy retired people. Still not as bad as those weird country which advertise prescription medicine
- alexchamberlain 2y ago
  I wonder what proportion of children are still watching mainstream TV? My son (4) mainly watches Disney+ and Netflix.
  - fn-mote 2y ago
    Choosing streaming services will be correlated to income. Netflix (medium $) and Disney+ (high $$). The less wealthy are watching YouTube with ads included.
- lmm 2y ago
  Children are the people least able to destroy their own lives through spending, so that feels pretty backwards. I think it's generally accepted that people who grow up around e.g. alcohol tend to have a healthier relationship with it than people who are suddenly exposed to it as an adult.
  - BehindBlueEyes 2y ago
    But they are among the most impressionable and it is effective to target the parents via kids nagging them.
- BehindBlueEyes 2y ago
  Add to your list to ban medical advertisement to the vice and addiction bar. Do you feel like your knee itches sometime? You may have BSitis, ask your doctor if our product is right for you... Replace all these with a generic, if you feel sick, go see a doctor, that's what they are for if needed.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
iamacyborg 2y ago
Wait until you hear about how CFD trading is legal in large parts of the world.
- throwaway2037 2y ago
  Is the payout on a CFD the same as a future or forward?
datavirtue 2y ago
Irrelevant. Stocks are a share of a company. The have book value and intrinsic value. Freedom to buy and sell is essential. Of course, crypto speculation is something different altogether. Maybe you were thinking about all the poor schleps buying Bitcoin for $100k? Even then, your chances of winning are around 50/50 and no one is forcing you to cash out.
hermitcrab 2y ago
There is an important difference. With stocks, the punter wins on average. With gambling, the punter loses on average. You can still lose all your money on stocks, with a combination of bad choices and bad luck. But it is much easier to lose it on the horses.
- shric 2y ago
  The punter does not win on average with stocks due to fees and spread.
  - hermitcrab 2y ago
    IIRC average stock market returns have historically been around 7% per year. Index funds charge around 1% per year. My stock ISAs have gone up pretty much every year (after inflation and fees).
    - rfrey 2y ago
      Putting your money into an index fund is the exact opposite of what is being advertised, e.g. trading platforms optimized for day trading, complete with blinkenlighten and "learn to trade" mini courses teaching technical indicators and other voodoo nonsense.
      - hermitcrab 2y ago
        There is a reason they spend loads of money on ads trying to get you into day trading. ;0)
    - lmm 2y ago
      > Index funds charge around 1% per year. You're getting ripped off, you should be paying a small fraction of that.
      - hermitcrab 2y ago
        Vanguard UK charge 0.06% to 0.6% per year on their index funds: https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/what-we-offer/all-products https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/what-we-offer/all-product... Plus a 0.15% account fee: https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/what-we-offer/fees-explained https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/what-we-offer/fees-explai... Most others charge more.

jonplackett 2y ago

The warnings for gambling ads are particularly infuriating. Like what would anyone think of a smoking warning of “when the fun stops, stop”

manojlds 2y ago

It's interesting that one of the tax free investment/savings choices in the UK is basically a lottery.

thom 2y ago
You’re not risking any capital though, if you mean Premium Bonds.
- anotheracc88 2y ago
  Even better, pay that money into a pension and buy a lottery ticket.
  - hinkley 2y ago
    Pensions sort of already are a lottery. Can’t collect if you’re dead. Live to 95 and they help a lot. Though inflation will still getcha in the end.
    - anotheracc88 2y ago
      Yes if you choose annuity but you can also buy those with regular cash so it's as relevant here as price of tea. Pensions are more tax efficient and offer a better option of investments (companies) than what is effectively fiat interest going into a lottery pool. If you have cash in premium bonds you might die young then pay inheritance tax. Better give your kids cash earlier to live off or invest to avoid this, and so they can over-stuff their pensions ;). Not many people think that far ahead (60 year horizon)
      - hinkley 2y ago
        Some young adults in my life have grandparents who just hit this point, and are trying to set up gifting money to the grandkids in the form of brokerage accounts.
    - petesergeant 2y ago

cynicalsecurity 2y ago

The business is probably owned by some rich and influential chap who eagerly shares with the right people in the parliament.

ashconnor 2y ago

Considering Labour's connection to gambling companies [0] probably not. [0] https://www.theguardian.com/society/article/2024/jun/28/tory-betting-scandal-labour-gambling-industry-regulation https://www.theguardian.com/society/article/2024/jun/28/tory...

hermitcrab 2y ago
Indeed. It has been heavily covered in Private Eye, as well. Labour is deeply in hock to the gambling industry. So much for "gambling is the curse of the working class".
- Der_Einzige 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - hermitcrab 2y ago
    >luckily my country voted with guns to refuse to recognize the authority of your tyrannical monarchy And how is that going?
    - Der_Einzige 2y ago
      USD is making every other country look and feel poor with how strong it is right now, vs… brexit, so it’s going great! The UK is the sick man of Europe.
fakedang 2y ago
Funny how you can buy British politicians for dirt cheap. In India or the US, it would take at least $100k-200k to get a single politician's attention at the bare minimum, while in the UK you can influence party positions for 25k quid.
- saagarjha 2y ago
  I don't have enough experience about India to comment on that but in the US the amount of money it takes to influence a politician is quite low.

LeoPanthera 2y ago

It's interesting that the UK has banned gambling ads online, but not on TV. Combined with the fact that they regulate cryptocurrencies as gambling, that's why you get no UK crypto ads online. For example, the PayPal UK front page doesn't even mention that you can buy crypto there.

zakki 2y ago
Do you have the link that regulate crypto as gambling in UK? I tried Google it but no luck.
- exe34 2y ago
  wait if crypto is gambling, then they don't tax the proceeds, right? but I'm pretty sure they tax it as capital gains..... so it's gambling for advertising purposes but capital investment for tax purposes... I suppose the law is an ass.
- frereubu 2y ago
  This isn't true. OP may be confusing things like this - https://www.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/licensees-and-businesses/guide/page/blockchain-technology-and-crypto-assets https://www.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/licensees-and-business... - as saying that crypto is regulated as gambling, but it's not.
rgblambda 2y ago
Maybe this is blurring the line between online and TV, but TV streaming services definitely have gambling ads. A gambling ad literally just came on the Channel 4 player in front of me as I started typing this.
thenickdude 2y ago
You can buy crypto on PayPal?? Our New Zealand version doesn't mention it either.
- LeoPanthera 2y ago
  Not in New Zealand. The USA, the UK, and Luxembourg only.

andrepd 2y ago

I'm not in the UK, but yeah it's nothing short of fucking disgusting how plastered TV is with these incessant gambling ads. "Gamble on slots on your phone while you're in the metro, the hairdresser, the dentist!" they shout, at kids and adults alike, 2 times every minute on every commercial break. Disgusting.

dzonga 2y ago

i was going to comment on this. gambling ads of all kinds, sky-bet, sky vegas casino + whatever in their hydra form. in depressed places like luton - you see how gambling has destroyed the little that remained. ban gambling companies from sponsoring sports teams, from being associated with sports teams etc.

hermitcrab 2y ago
It is very noticeable that the gambling shops are clustered around the poorest parts of every town. I grew up near a gambling shop. You would see the punters desparately trying to eek out every last puff on their roll-up cigarettes, while the gambling shop owner would drive up in his Rolls Royce.

b800h 2y ago

Or massive vaping ads on the side of school buses.

surgical_fire 2y ago

I wonder if a prohibition to have gambling ads on TV would affect the Premier League teams that have gambling sponsorships

gwbas1c 2y ago

Let's just ban all ads!

thanksgiving 2y ago
A good start would be a ban on ads based on who is viewing the ad vs what the content surrounding the ad is... So, Casper mattress wants to have an ad spot in a podcast or a YouTube video in the video itself? That's ok. YouTube wants to include an ad about a mattress in a video about home renovation? Also ok. Stack overflow wants to show an ad for GitHub? Is ok to me. YouTube wants to show an ad about Casper mattress based on whether someone has clicked on an ad about mattresses before? Banned! This alone would be a great start.
- Nullabillity 2y ago
  Or... just get rid of them all.
- gwbas1c 2y ago
  I was joking, but I think you make my point better.

benatkin 2y ago

Sarcasm I hope...

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]