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> Did you send in your comment via fax? Fax was invented in the 1800s: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fax https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fax The 1968 Steve M

> Did you send in your comment via fax? Fax was invented in the 1800s: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fax https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fax The 1968 Steve McQueen movie Bullitt used a fax machine to send a photograph of suspect. It's a pre-1970s invention, as is the modem: the Bell 101 was released in 1958. Edit: the authors of the book do say that the mainstreaming of computers and the Internet is one of the post-1970s innovations. > Also in what way are "refinements" not technological innovation? e.g. modern cars are massively safer, more reliable and comfortable. But not a new invention. The Model T started production in 1908: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Model_T https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Model_T By the late 1920s, more that 80% of US households had at least one car; by the 1960s it was something like 160 cars per 100 households (i.e., most had at least two cars). It was by the 1930s that society had already been transformed by the automobile, regardless of how "safer, more reliable and comfortable" (or not) they were: * https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/2924825 https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/2924825 For safety, the four biggest factors were seat belts, airbags, ABS and crumple zones, all of which were invented in the 1970s or before: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-lock_braking_system#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-lock_braking_system#Histo... * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbag#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbag#History * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seat_belt#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seat_belt#History * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crumple_zone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crumple_zone Comfort: AC was invented by Willis Carrier in the early 1900s, and put into air cars by the 1950s: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_air_conditioning https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_air_conditioning For reliability/efficiency, fuel injection was in cars by the 1950s: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_injection https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_injection

wqaatwt 2y ago
> Fax was invented in the 1800s: Offices didn't have them until the late 60s or 70s which is what matters. It's like saying that people could make video calls back in the 30s... > the four biggest factors Yet there were almost 2x more fatalities per same distance driven back in 1980 and almost 4x in 1970
- throw0101c 2y ago
  > Offices didn't have them until the late 60s or 70s which is what matters. Yes, which goes to the point of the book: the major innovation and mainstreaming of technology occurred "until the late 60s or 70s". You're making the same point as the book is. Also: photocopiers, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xerography https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xerography Edit: the authors of the book do say that the mainstreaming of computers and the Internet is one of the post-1970s innovations.
  - wqaatwt 2y ago
    I really can’t tell if you’re being obtuse? Since this is getting really silly.. The only reason I mentioned fax is because that’s a thing that only became widespread after all innovation had supposedly stopped. BUT it already has been obsolete for decades and replaced by more advanced technologies. > the authors of the book do say That’s like saying that there wasn’t much innovation in the late 1800s besides electricity.. Yes if you exclude the area there has been the most progress in your point might have some very superficial merit Computers and internet transformed plenty of those devices that were apparently already perfected by the 70s. Except devices like TVs have almost nothing in common with their equivalent from back then besides the name and the fact that they show pictures. So television and CRTs weren’t real inventions either? They are basically the same thing as film projectors and those were a thing back in the 1890s. Really if we think about it almost nothing worth mentioning was invented after 1899..
scotty79 2y ago
How can you know what things are getting invented today if it takes 100 years of refinements for it to blossom into common knowledge and use? We can say we just invented quantum computers and AGI if the fax was supposedly invented in 1800. In hundred years people are gonna argue with their AI that yeah, all that singularity is nice but it was actually invented 100 years ago, so stagnation all around.
- throw0101c 2y ago
  > How can you know what things are getting invented today if it takes 100 years of refinements for it to blossom into common knowledge and use? A good portion of the things mentioned in the book (photography, radio (vacuum tube), telephone, television, cars, refrigerators (and AC generally), vaccines, washing machines, trains, trams, subways, automobiles, airplanes (piston and jet/turbine), rocketry and satellites, etc) were invented and available in the fifty years between 1870 and 1920, and completed mainstreaming/saturation in the fifty years between 1920 and 1970. There were some things that were invented in the 1920-70 time period: penicillin, CT scan, MRI scans, notable car refinements (fuel injection, crumple zones, seat belts, ABS, airbags), computers, transistors, modems, microwaves, fax/photocopiers. Besides the Internet and maybe smartphones, what new classes of device were created post-1970s that had a major technological, sociological, or medical effect on society? @cperciva mentioned Li-ion batteries in a comment as well.
  - njtransit 2y ago
    Bioengineering will obviously be a large technological force moving forward. Quick vaccine development and targeting cancer seems like the tip of the iceberg. Technological advancement in semi-conductors has enabled human-like AI models.
    - throw0101c 2y ago
      We'll see if any of these show in statistics like average life spans and mortality rates. We'll see if AI helps in productivity (e.g., per capita GDP): the book shows data that says that computers and the Internet had effects, but they were done by 2004 (book was published in 2016, and had numbers until 2014).

wqaatwt 2y ago

> Fax was invented in the 1800s: Offices didn't have them until the late 60s or 70s which is what matters. It's like saying that people could make video calls back in the 30s... > the four biggest factors Yet there were almost 2x more fatalities per same distance driven back in 1980 and almost 4x in 1970

throw0101c 2y ago
> Offices didn't have them until the late 60s or 70s which is what matters. Yes, which goes to the point of the book: the major innovation and mainstreaming of technology occurred "until the late 60s or 70s". You're making the same point as the book is. Also: photocopiers, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xerography https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xerography Edit: the authors of the book do say that the mainstreaming of computers and the Internet is one of the post-1970s innovations.
- wqaatwt 2y ago
  I really can’t tell if you’re being obtuse? Since this is getting really silly.. The only reason I mentioned fax is because that’s a thing that only became widespread after all innovation had supposedly stopped. BUT it already has been obsolete for decades and replaced by more advanced technologies. > the authors of the book do say That’s like saying that there wasn’t much innovation in the late 1800s besides electricity.. Yes if you exclude the area there has been the most progress in your point might have some very superficial merit Computers and internet transformed plenty of those devices that were apparently already perfected by the 70s. Except devices like TVs have almost nothing in common with their equivalent from back then besides the name and the fact that they show pictures. So television and CRTs weren’t real inventions either? They are basically the same thing as film projectors and those were a thing back in the 1890s. Really if we think about it almost nothing worth mentioning was invented after 1899..

scotty79 2y ago

How can you know what things are getting invented today if it takes 100 years of refinements for it to blossom into common knowledge and use? We can say we just invented quantum computers and AGI if the fax was supposedly invented in 1800. In hundred years people are gonna argue with their AI that yeah, all that singularity is nice but it was actually invented 100 years ago, so stagnation all around.

throw0101c 2y ago
> How can you know what things are getting invented today if it takes 100 years of refinements for it to blossom into common knowledge and use? A good portion of the things mentioned in the book (photography, radio (vacuum tube), telephone, television, cars, refrigerators (and AC generally), vaccines, washing machines, trains, trams, subways, automobiles, airplanes (piston and jet/turbine), rocketry and satellites, etc) were invented and available in the fifty years between 1870 and 1920, and completed mainstreaming/saturation in the fifty years between 1920 and 1970. There were some things that were invented in the 1920-70 time period: penicillin, CT scan, MRI scans, notable car refinements (fuel injection, crumple zones, seat belts, ABS, airbags), computers, transistors, modems, microwaves, fax/photocopiers. Besides the Internet and maybe smartphones, what new classes of device were created post-1970s that had a major technological, sociological, or medical effect on society? @cperciva mentioned Li-ion batteries in a comment as well.
- njtransit 2y ago
  Bioengineering will obviously be a large technological force moving forward. Quick vaccine development and targeting cancer seems like the tip of the iceberg. Technological advancement in semi-conductors has enabled human-like AI models.
  - throw0101c 2y ago
    We'll see if any of these show in statistics like average life spans and mortality rates. We'll see if AI helps in productivity (e.g., per capita GDP): the book shows data that says that computers and the Internet had effects, but they were done by 2004 (book was published in 2016, and had numbers until 2014).