7 ms·

Ham Radio All-in-One-Cable

232 points by CTOSian 2y ago

LandoCalrissian 2y ago
Oh that is cool, I have a really janky setup to do packet radio with my handheld and this would be awesome for that.
genewitch 2y ago
slick and useful. Probably won't work out of the box with repeaterbook software (android) because he firmwared his interfaces to report something that normal ones do not and i couldn't be assed to reverse it. I don't know that repeaterbook has anything to do with it actually, but there's android software that uses your GPS and a bluetooth module to control your VHF/UHF radios, you can use it to automatically change repeaters as you're driving or whatever - based on repeaterbook's database.
- kQq9oHeAz6wLLS 2y ago
  That software sounds cool, what's it called and where do I get it?
  - genewitch 2y ago
    https://www.zbm2.com/BlueCAT/index.html https://www.zbm2.com/BlueCAT/index.html is the hardware. the software is repeaterbook - there's a toggle in the app to use the blueCAT device - which is the one i never could find the time to reverse to figure out why i couldn't use any BT-Serial device!
transcriptase 2y ago
Very neat! I’m consistently surprised with how the last 20 years of software and hardware improvement has only barely made it to amateur/cb radio. 8kb firmware limits. Noise reduction circuits that still do the same amount of nothing they did when implemented in the 70s. Flaky serial interfaces that need various cables and custom drivers for every make and model. CBs using the same 70s form factor and still costing $150-300 for the cheapest with SSB, which is currently the only modulation worth using unless you want to listen to a bunch of old guys in Atlanta yelling gibberish sunrise to sunset. You can argue there’s no market, but put even a crappy CB into an enclosure that would fit most phone mounts, package it with a decent magnet antenna, and not price it as if you have no competition (because you won’t)… and the sales would be incredible. The UVK8 has non-hams buying a bunch because they’re cheap and only barely customizable, just to receive and not transmit. Cobra, Uniden et al haven’t innovated since the 90s, but people are still buying them.
- RF_Savage 2y ago
  UV-K5 does cost 1/10 to 1/20 as much as the handhelds did 20years ago. CB's seem niche and to this day the handhelds don't seem to go much below 100usd in price. Just not enough volume I guess.
- Dalewyn 2y ago
  The vast majority of the world's electronics run on 1960s and 70s technology, it's not just ham radio. Bloody nobody cares about bleeding silicon from Intel (or TSMC for that matter), everyone cares whether Analog Devices is still making that one chip they released to market 50 years ago (or if they have a drop-in replacement if not). And just so people don't get the wrong idea: It's not that improvements are shunned. It's that recertifying with new and improved advancements costs time and money that nobody wants to justify.
  - Suppafly 2y ago
    >The vast majority of the world's electronics run on 1960s and 70s technology, it's not just ham radio. Yeah it's crazy how little modern tech has made it to different niches. I was looking into metal detecting a few years ago, and there is basically no technology to any of them, even the expensive ones. You'd assume they'd have fancy android powered devices with gps and stuff, but no it's the same basic circuitry they've had for decades.
    - Cthulhu_ 2y ago
      The base circuitry for detecting metal probably hasn't changed much (at least not for amateur prices), but there are apparently modern metal detectors with app integration and gps and the like: https://apps.apple.com/be/app/go-terrain/id1419674707 https://apps.apple.com/be/app/go-terrain/id1419674707
    - dzdt 2y ago
      Huh. Now you are making me picture a metal detector design with an array of overlapping current loops and a fancy deconvolution software on top that gives you an image (probably very fuzzy but still an image) of what magnetic source its detecting. Could be pretty cool!
dylan604 2y ago
Just because I had never seen the ordering a custom PCB, I followed this steps on ordering one for this. Heavens to Murgatroyd! that's crazy cheap.
- Geezus_42 2y ago
  Not for long...
  - ElectRabbit 2y ago
    JLCPCB is super cheap for 100 years now. They are expanding for offering their crazy prices now even for 6 layers and higher.
    - jjkaczor 2y ago
      I think they are referring to the upcoming tariff implementation from the US...
      - cruffle_duffle 2y ago
        Which will never happen because it would be incredibly unpopular. It’s all just political posturing.
        nemomarx 2y ago
        last time around he did get tariffs on steel, and one of my favorite small US manufacturers stopped being able to make computer cases because input costs rose too much. I wouldn't get too optimistic basically. even some tariffs might cut off options.
  - HeyLaughingBoy 2y ago
    Even with 100% tariffs they will still be dirt cheap.
- jjkaczor 2y ago
AnarchismIsCool 2y ago
I don't mean to be a downer, but I'm so fucking tired of these things. We don't need yet another way of doing AF sound card injection into shitty walkie talkies, we need an open, accessible, quality SDR transmitter that can handle digital inputs directly. I've messed with plenty of systems like this, these antiquated radios are not designed for this and you have to spend a lot of time fiddling with the gain stages to get them to function at all. Even if you get it working, it'll still be wildly less capable than something that can do direct encoding, you lose a ton of range when doing AFSK compared to basically any other encoding scheme. It's basically the equivalent of setting up a 3d printer gantry to hit the keys on your keyboard to send messages. And before anyone complains, yes, I'm actively working on an open XC7Z010/AD9363 based HT for this. Essentially a Silvus but not $20k for $100 in components.
- mschuster91 2y ago
  > We don't need yet another way of doing AF sound card injection into shitty walkie talkies, we need an open, accessible, quality SDR transmitter that can handle digital inputs directly. You might want to look into the ADALM-PLUTO [1]. The ham club I'm in uses it together with a beefy PA to make TV broadcasts to the QO-100 amsat. [1] https://www.analog.com/en/resources/evaluation-hardware-and-software/evaluation-boards-kits/adalm-pluto.html https://www.analog.com/en/resources/evaluation-hardware-and-...
  - anthomtb 2y ago
    Am I missing something or is that ADALM-PLUTO a really good deal? Its going for $195 direct from AD. Half the frequency range of a USRP but 15% of the price. I was going to hold off on my SDR hobby until a few more gray hairs and $$$ came into my life but might need to pull the trigger on that guy (yes I know you can get an rtl-sdr for like $30).
    - mschuster91 2y ago
      It's only got 7 dBm / 5 mW worth of TX power. You'll still need a dedicated power amplifier or multiple - not sure, antenna/PA isn't my specialty - if you wish to communicate with anything more than a few feet away from you. Also, its frequency range officially begins at 325 MHz. That's usable enough for the 70cm ham radio range, but practically useless for anything on the longer bands without a hack [1] that will only give you the 2m and 4m bands. On the other hand... you don't want to go below the 2m range on a handheld anyway, antenna length can be a real pain. ETA: WiMo sells a transverter but it'll cost you about the same amount of money that you'd have to shell out for the Pluto... and still only 50 mW of TX power. Given that our club station has a PA stage that can blast out the full allowed 750W on 160m, that's quite a difference... [1] https://www.rtl-sdr.com/adalm-pluto-sdr-hack-tune-70-mhz-to-6-ghz-and-gqrx-install/ https://www.rtl-sdr.com/adalm-pluto-sdr-hack-tune-70-mhz-to-... [2] https://www.wimo.com/de/dxpatrol-charon-hf-transverter-for-adalm-pluto https://www.wimo.com/de/dxpatrol-charon-hf-transverter-for-a...
golem14 2y ago
I really would like to have a simple re-implementation of ye olde TNC-2s that had a small eprom and a kiss mode TNC with a fricking BBS on ax-25 that worked like a charm. They existed I believe around 1988-1990ish. I mean, yes, this cable works with direwolf, but then I need to have a full linux system running, which I could do without for the purpose of an emergency comms system. I just found https://github.com/cheponis/KISS-TNC2 https://github.com/cheponis/KISS-TNC2, but I think this is just the KISS mode, not the AX25 stuff. I found https://www.ir3ip.net/iw3fqg/doc/wa8ded.htm https://www.ir3ip.net/iw3fqg/doc/wa8ded.htm which I think describes the TNC2S software I was running many years ago. Any other pointers would be great.
- justanother 2y ago
  I have one of these in the garage. I think they're 6502-based with the OS on EPROM, or at least that's what I vaguely recall from last time I had mine opened-up about 20 years ago. I can dump the ROM if it'd help.
  - kmbfjr 2y ago
    Likely a Zilog Z-80 CPU with 28C256 eeprom.
  - golem14 2y ago
    Many thanks for the offer! I have a few old ones, too. I'm sure I have seen .bin files with dumps. Maybe here: https://home.snafu.de/wahlm/tfdownload.html https://home.snafu.de/wahlm/tfdownload.html There was some bad blood between Wa8DED and NORDLINK/TheNET about copying, maybe best to contact WA8DED directly, or the NORDLINK guys. https://w5yi-vec.org/W5YI_Reports/1988/1988-06-01_W5YI_report.pdf https://w5yi-vec.org/W5YI_Reports/1988/1988-06-01_W5YI_repor... Then again, maybe it would be better to jump on the LoRA bandwagon and make something similar work with meshtastic: https://github.com/TheCommsChannel/TC2-BBS-mesh https://github.com/TheCommsChannel/TC2-BBS-mesh
ElectRabbit 2y ago
Great project! But in the name of god: let this awful old AFSK APRS sleep away. In Europe LoRa APRS is super popular and Semtech is flooding the market with super cheap radio ICs. They are extremely hobbist friendly.
Hasz 2y ago
Someone build a bunch and sell me one. at $60 for 5, I would be happy to pay $30 for a single one.
- bnpxft 2y ago
  NA6D has them for sale: https://na6d.com/products/aioc-ham-radio-all-in-one-cable https://na6d.com/products/aioc-ham-radio-all-in-one-cable Also as a kit for cheaper https://na6d.com/products/aioc-ham-radio-all-in-one-cable-unsoldered https://na6d.com/products/aioc-ham-radio-all-in-one-cable-un...
tonymet 2y ago
I've been a HAM for 5 years and the hobby is constantly evolving and expanding. There are many HAM hackers like this who produce custom radios, antennas, tools . If you are a software engineer looking to tinker with hardware, HAM radio has many practical and social applications. It's also a tremendously broad hobby with many modes, bands, hobbies, tools, devices. Like most hobbies today it's up to us to take over and build the next generation.
soupfordummies 2y ago
Weird kinda unrelated question but I bet someone in this thread has the answer: When I was researching the Flipper Zero a year or so ago someone mentioned, "I'm not sure about buying one, it seems like a cool gadget that I'll play with and then end up in a drawer like the [product x]" I looked up [product x] at the time and it seemed pretty neat. Like a USB or computer card that could get radio and TV signals and some other stuff. However, I can't find this [product x] again despite scouring bookmarks, reading through reddit/HN topics, etc. Any ideas?
- DrillShopper 2y ago
  RTL-SDR?
- boneitis 2y ago
  The HackRF usually comes to mind every time I mess around with my Flipper Zero. (Other items I often hear mentioned in the same conversations are the ADALM PLUTO and the pricey USRP line of radios. Or, "rtl2832u" might be a key term that helps you further narrow down a search more aligned with the sibling comment, though the rtl2832u is a cheap, receive-only device.) There are the units branded by Great Scott Gadgets (the company belonging to the guy that designed HackRF). And alternately, chinese clones were obtainable for significantly cheaper. I don't know what the climate looks like these days of getting a hold of these radios.
- ianburrell 2y ago
  RTL-SDR is the basic SDR (software defined radio). RTL-SDR.com and NooElec are the best brands. There are better ones but they depend on what you want to use them for.
ianburrell 2y ago
There is Open Headset Interconnect Standard, https://ohis.org/ https://ohis.org/, for standard headset connection using RJ-45. But I can't tell if anyone uses it. I wonder if could make boards like this for different adapters. I sort of wonder if USB Audio would be a better way to connect headsets. Go from standard audio ports or headset ports to USB, and then USB with these connectors. The hard part is what to with the PTT pin. I guess the downside is power.

232 points by CTOSian 2y ago

Oh that is cool, I have a really janky setup to do packet radio with my handheld and this would be awesome for that.

slick and useful. Probably won't work out of the box with repeaterbook software (android) because he firmwared his interfaces to report something that normal ones do not and i couldn't be assed to reverse it. I don't know that repeaterbook has anything to do with it actually, but there's android software that uses your GPS and a bluetooth module to control your VHF/UHF radios, you can use it to automatically change repeaters as you're driving or whatever - based on repeaterbook's database.

kQq9oHeAz6wLLS 2y ago
That software sounds cool, what's it called and where do I get it?
- genewitch 2y ago
  https://www.zbm2.com/BlueCAT/index.html https://www.zbm2.com/BlueCAT/index.html is the hardware. the software is repeaterbook - there's a toggle in the app to use the blueCAT device - which is the one i never could find the time to reverse to figure out why i couldn't use any BT-Serial device!

transcriptase 2y ago

Very neat! I’m consistently surprised with how the last 20 years of software and hardware improvement has only barely made it to amateur/cb radio. 8kb firmware limits. Noise reduction circuits that still do the same amount of nothing they did when implemented in the 70s. Flaky serial interfaces that need various cables and custom drivers for every make and model. CBs using the same 70s form factor and still costing $150-300 for the cheapest with SSB, which is currently the only modulation worth using unless you want to listen to a bunch of old guys in Atlanta yelling gibberish sunrise to sunset. You can argue there’s no market, but put even a crappy CB into an enclosure that would fit most phone mounts, package it with a decent magnet antenna, and not price it as if you have no competition (because you won’t)… and the sales would be incredible. The UVK8 has non-hams buying a bunch because they’re cheap and only barely customizable, just to receive and not transmit. Cobra, Uniden et al haven’t innovated since the 90s, but people are still buying them.

RF_Savage 2y ago
UV-K5 does cost 1/10 to 1/20 as much as the handhelds did 20years ago. CB's seem niche and to this day the handhelds don't seem to go much below 100usd in price. Just not enough volume I guess.
Dalewyn 2y ago
The vast majority of the world's electronics run on 1960s and 70s technology, it's not just ham radio. Bloody nobody cares about bleeding silicon from Intel (or TSMC for that matter), everyone cares whether Analog Devices is still making that one chip they released to market 50 years ago (or if they have a drop-in replacement if not). And just so people don't get the wrong idea: It's not that improvements are shunned. It's that recertifying with new and improved advancements costs time and money that nobody wants to justify.
- Suppafly 2y ago
  >The vast majority of the world's electronics run on 1960s and 70s technology, it's not just ham radio. Yeah it's crazy how little modern tech has made it to different niches. I was looking into metal detecting a few years ago, and there is basically no technology to any of them, even the expensive ones. You'd assume they'd have fancy android powered devices with gps and stuff, but no it's the same basic circuitry they've had for decades.
  - Cthulhu_ 2y ago
    The base circuitry for detecting metal probably hasn't changed much (at least not for amateur prices), but there are apparently modern metal detectors with app integration and gps and the like: https://apps.apple.com/be/app/go-terrain/id1419674707 https://apps.apple.com/be/app/go-terrain/id1419674707
  - dzdt 2y ago
    Huh. Now you are making me picture a metal detector design with an array of overlapping current loops and a fancy deconvolution software on top that gives you an image (probably very fuzzy but still an image) of what magnetic source its detecting. Could be pretty cool!

dylan604 2y ago

Just because I had never seen the ordering a custom PCB, I followed this steps on ordering one for this. Heavens to Murgatroyd! that's crazy cheap.

Geezus_42 2y ago
Not for long...
- ElectRabbit 2y ago
  JLCPCB is super cheap for 100 years now. They are expanding for offering their crazy prices now even for 6 layers and higher.
  - jjkaczor 2y ago
    I think they are referring to the upcoming tariff implementation from the US...
    - cruffle_duffle 2y ago
      Which will never happen because it would be incredibly unpopular. It’s all just political posturing.
      - nemomarx 2y ago
        last time around he did get tariffs on steel, and one of my favorite small US manufacturers stopped being able to make computer cases because input costs rose too much. I wouldn't get too optimistic basically. even some tariffs might cut off options.
- HeyLaughingBoy 2y ago
  Even with 100% tariffs they will still be dirt cheap.
jjkaczor 2y ago

AnarchismIsCool 2y ago

I don't mean to be a downer, but I'm so fucking tired of these things. We don't need yet another way of doing AF sound card injection into shitty walkie talkies, we need an open, accessible, quality SDR transmitter that can handle digital inputs directly. I've messed with plenty of systems like this, these antiquated radios are not designed for this and you have to spend a lot of time fiddling with the gain stages to get them to function at all. Even if you get it working, it'll still be wildly less capable than something that can do direct encoding, you lose a ton of range when doing AFSK compared to basically any other encoding scheme. It's basically the equivalent of setting up a 3d printer gantry to hit the keys on your keyboard to send messages. And before anyone complains, yes, I'm actively working on an open XC7Z010/AD9363 based HT for this. Essentially a Silvus but not $20k for $100 in components.

mschuster91 2y ago
> We don't need yet another way of doing AF sound card injection into shitty walkie talkies, we need an open, accessible, quality SDR transmitter that can handle digital inputs directly. You might want to look into the ADALM-PLUTO [1]. The ham club I'm in uses it together with a beefy PA to make TV broadcasts to the QO-100 amsat. [1] https://www.analog.com/en/resources/evaluation-hardware-and-software/evaluation-boards-kits/adalm-pluto.html https://www.analog.com/en/resources/evaluation-hardware-and-...
- anthomtb 2y ago
  Am I missing something or is that ADALM-PLUTO a really good deal? Its going for $195 direct from AD. Half the frequency range of a USRP but 15% of the price. I was going to hold off on my SDR hobby until a few more gray hairs and $$$ came into my life but might need to pull the trigger on that guy (yes I know you can get an rtl-sdr for like $30).
  - mschuster91 2y ago
    It's only got 7 dBm / 5 mW worth of TX power. You'll still need a dedicated power amplifier or multiple - not sure, antenna/PA isn't my specialty - if you wish to communicate with anything more than a few feet away from you. Also, its frequency range officially begins at 325 MHz. That's usable enough for the 70cm ham radio range, but practically useless for anything on the longer bands without a hack [1] that will only give you the 2m and 4m bands. On the other hand... you don't want to go below the 2m range on a handheld anyway, antenna length can be a real pain. ETA: WiMo sells a transverter but it'll cost you about the same amount of money that you'd have to shell out for the Pluto... and still only 50 mW of TX power. Given that our club station has a PA stage that can blast out the full allowed 750W on 160m, that's quite a difference... [1] https://www.rtl-sdr.com/adalm-pluto-sdr-hack-tune-70-mhz-to-6-ghz-and-gqrx-install/ https://www.rtl-sdr.com/adalm-pluto-sdr-hack-tune-70-mhz-to-... [2] https://www.wimo.com/de/dxpatrol-charon-hf-transverter-for-adalm-pluto https://www.wimo.com/de/dxpatrol-charon-hf-transverter-for-a...

golem14 2y ago

I really would like to have a simple re-implementation of ye olde TNC-2s that had a small eprom and a kiss mode TNC with a fricking BBS on ax-25 that worked like a charm. They existed I believe around 1988-1990ish. I mean, yes, this cable works with direwolf, but then I need to have a full linux system running, which I could do without for the purpose of an emergency comms system. I just found https://github.com/cheponis/KISS-TNC2 https://github.com/cheponis/KISS-TNC2, but I think this is just the KISS mode, not the AX25 stuff. I found https://www.ir3ip.net/iw3fqg/doc/wa8ded.htm https://www.ir3ip.net/iw3fqg/doc/wa8ded.htm which I think describes the TNC2S software I was running many years ago. Any other pointers would be great.

justanother 2y ago
I have one of these in the garage. I think they're 6502-based with the OS on EPROM, or at least that's what I vaguely recall from last time I had mine opened-up about 20 years ago. I can dump the ROM if it'd help.
- kmbfjr 2y ago
  Likely a Zilog Z-80 CPU with 28C256 eeprom.
- golem14 2y ago
  Many thanks for the offer! I have a few old ones, too. I'm sure I have seen .bin files with dumps. Maybe here: https://home.snafu.de/wahlm/tfdownload.html https://home.snafu.de/wahlm/tfdownload.html There was some bad blood between Wa8DED and NORDLINK/TheNET about copying, maybe best to contact WA8DED directly, or the NORDLINK guys. https://w5yi-vec.org/W5YI_Reports/1988/1988-06-01_W5YI_report.pdf https://w5yi-vec.org/W5YI_Reports/1988/1988-06-01_W5YI_repor... Then again, maybe it would be better to jump on the LoRA bandwagon and make something similar work with meshtastic: https://github.com/TheCommsChannel/TC2-BBS-mesh https://github.com/TheCommsChannel/TC2-BBS-mesh

ElectRabbit 2y ago

Great project! But in the name of god: let this awful old AFSK APRS sleep away. In Europe LoRa APRS is super popular and Semtech is flooding the market with super cheap radio ICs. They are extremely hobbist friendly.

Hasz 2y ago

Someone build a bunch and sell me one. at $60 for 5, I would be happy to pay $30 for a single one.

bnpxft 2y ago
NA6D has them for sale: https://na6d.com/products/aioc-ham-radio-all-in-one-cable https://na6d.com/products/aioc-ham-radio-all-in-one-cable Also as a kit for cheaper https://na6d.com/products/aioc-ham-radio-all-in-one-cable-unsoldered https://na6d.com/products/aioc-ham-radio-all-in-one-cable-un...

tonymet 2y ago

I've been a HAM for 5 years and the hobby is constantly evolving and expanding. There are many HAM hackers like this who produce custom radios, antennas, tools . If you are a software engineer looking to tinker with hardware, HAM radio has many practical and social applications. It's also a tremendously broad hobby with many modes, bands, hobbies, tools, devices. Like most hobbies today it's up to us to take over and build the next generation.

soupfordummies 2y ago

Weird kinda unrelated question but I bet someone in this thread has the answer: When I was researching the Flipper Zero a year or so ago someone mentioned, "I'm not sure about buying one, it seems like a cool gadget that I'll play with and then end up in a drawer like the [product x]" I looked up [product x] at the time and it seemed pretty neat. Like a USB or computer card that could get radio and TV signals and some other stuff. However, I can't find this [product x] again despite scouring bookmarks, reading through reddit/HN topics, etc. Any ideas?

DrillShopper 2y ago
RTL-SDR?
boneitis 2y ago
The HackRF usually comes to mind every time I mess around with my Flipper Zero. (Other items I often hear mentioned in the same conversations are the ADALM PLUTO and the pricey USRP line of radios. Or, "rtl2832u" might be a key term that helps you further narrow down a search more aligned with the sibling comment, though the rtl2832u is a cheap, receive-only device.) There are the units branded by Great Scott Gadgets (the company belonging to the guy that designed HackRF). And alternately, chinese clones were obtainable for significantly cheaper. I don't know what the climate looks like these days of getting a hold of these radios.
ianburrell 2y ago
RTL-SDR is the basic SDR (software defined radio). RTL-SDR.com and NooElec are the best brands. There are better ones but they depend on what you want to use them for.

ianburrell 2y ago

There is Open Headset Interconnect Standard, https://ohis.org/ https://ohis.org/, for standard headset connection using RJ-45. But I can't tell if anyone uses it. I wonder if could make boards like this for different adapters. I sort of wonder if USB Audio would be a better way to connect headsets. Go from standard audio ports or headset ports to USB, and then USB with these connectors. The hard part is what to with the PTT pin. I guess the downside is power.