3 ms·

> few of the biggest ones do not want to accelerate electrification bad enough to threaten parts of their industry/economy right now Do you see the problem? Th

by mrtksn 2y ago

> few of the biggest ones do not want to accelerate electrification bad enough to threaten parts of their industry/economy right now Do you see the problem? Those in control screw up and they expect to get bailed out by forcing people to buy their inferior and expensive products. > The Ukraine war is the most clear-cut aggressor/victim situation It's actually not that clear cut and if you apply the same filters for both of the countries you will see it. Try testing for internationally recognized borders and the situation is same for the Israeli invasion and Russian invasion. Test for separatist movements and you will find very similar things, test for minorities getting attacked and you will see that its quite similar. Not the same but when you pick something like "Russia must respect the internationally recognized borders" and you don't apply the same for Israel then you are a hypocrite, you are not doing it from standpoint of a principle but due to your own interest and if you are doing it out of your own interest people start asking why I'm paying for it? Where's my cut if this thing pans out? > The non-private jets are a much bigger problem actually I don't know if that's true or not but you ask people to sacrifice their comfort for a common cause, then everyone should do it. > Because the people inside those borders don't want other people with no capital wandering But then people start noticing that it's not the poor immigrants who want to work who buys al the properties. Some people want the poor stopped at the border and the rich welcomed. Others want different things, a lot of people don't want oligarchs buying all that property and leave it empty. > I'd say the economy is not great, not terrible In the case of the US elections, there were many opinion polls showing that people are not satisfied with the economy. They are also not satisfied with many other things related to the economy. Just yesterday someone killed an insurance CEO at a filthy rich location and so many people were cheering for the killer.

ponector 2y ago
> It's actually not that clear cut and if you apply the same filters for both of the countries you will see it. Pretty much clear. Unless you watch Russia Today everyday. If you throw away tons of Russian lies it is clear expansion invasion. Russians did this many times. Annexation of Poland, Finland, Baltic states and more recent annexation of Ichkeria and occupation of Georgia.
- mrtksn 2y ago
  >Pretty much clear. Unless you watch Russia Today everyday. If you throw away tons of Russian lies it is clear expansion invasion. You are misrepresenting my argument. I don't say that Russian are innocent, I say that Israel is just as guilty.
- nopurpose 2y ago
  How is it "expansion invasion" if peace terms offered by Russia, which are now public knowledge with recent documents leak, shortly after invastion didn't include any new territories for Russia? Ukraine walked away from that offer.
  - ponector 2y ago
    It was a bluff to make a weaker Ukraine. Just a reminder to that moment: 1.Russia sponsored separatist movement in Donbass with money, weapons and agents. 2. Russia directly occupied Crimea while lying they do not. 3. Russia signed a Budapest memorandum to respect Ukrainian independence and sovereignty in the existing borders and restrain to use force against it. 4. Russia signed a series of Minsk peace treaties. Why you think that they really offered a peace in a good faith? History of modern Russia, USSR and empire show any peace treaty or other international documents with nothing, just a waste of the paper. Russians always lie. That's putty western world are blind because Russian bribes are too good to miss.
  - flerchin 2y ago
    What is this?
  - myrmidon 2y ago
    Those peace terms included Russia getting to annex Crimea, stationing troops in Donbas (eastern Ukraine), Ukraine retreating all of their troops, Ukraine being neutral (permanently non-allied). In return, Ukraine would have gotten some guarantor states safekeeping its newly drawn borders (but Russia would have been able to veto any action of those guarantor states in case someone, possibly Russia, attacked the Ukraine again). This seems a bit of a complete joke to me? Can you explain, why, exactly, Ukraine should have taken that offer? This is basically "I give you everything we are currently fighting over, in return I get an absolutely worthless promise from a serial liar". No deal.
myrmidon 2y ago
> Try testing for internationally recognized borders and the situation is same for the Israeli invasion and Russian invasion. I do not understand your point. Ukraine has borders that were recognized by Russia itself (Budapest Memorandum). They violated those borders when they annexed Crimea-- their excuse: those people want to be part of our empire-- ok. 8 years later they marched on Kyiv-- whats even the excuse for that? Do you think the people in Kyiv want to be liberated from their president, and governed by some Russian oligarch? If Russia is in a similar situation than Israel, then were are the massive acts of terrorism against Russian citizens comparable to October 7th? Where are the missiles fired towards Moscow, before 2014?
- mrtksn 2y ago
  I don't know why you interpret my comment like that, I don't support Russia, I say that Israel is just like Russia from that standpoint. Are you by any chance assuming that Israel is absolutely innocent, therefore I must be claiming that Russia must be also innocent? It's the other way around, they are both aggressor and invaders. Anyone claiming that countries shouldn't invade other countries and respect the internationally recognized borders then should support Ukraine and Palestine.
  - myrmidon 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - mrtksn 2y ago
      They should have solved it before 7th of October and if that was not possible they shouldn't have been committing AI assisted genocide. Sometimes you screw up with your intelligence and diplomacy, you take a hit and this still doesn't give you a right to genocide. The same for the Palestinians BTW, you screw up lose a war get occupied and you still don'y get right to do terror attacks. I'm actually fan of Israel, It's a country I want to visit a lot and I actually admire the things they achieved in that barely livable land. Which makes me extra sad too see into what they have turned.
data_maan 2y ago
> Not the same but when you pick something like "Russia must respect the internationally recognized borders" and you don't apply the same for Israel then you are a hypocrite Ahem... You're suggesting that Ukraine killed over a thousand Russians and took them hostage, and thereby provoked a war? That would actually be the correct analogy. No, Russia simply invaded because it felt it could. The situation is very different to Israel and Gaza and you're deliberately leaving out the fine details that make the difference.
- dunekid 2y ago
  >Ahem... You're suggesting that Ukraine killed over a thousand Russians and took them hostage, and thereby provoked a war? Maybe, just maybe you could have a look at what Gaza was like before the said event. It was blockaded by Sea, Air and Land. It was oppressed and occupied, not to mention the settler terrorism in West Bank. It is a myopic view to hold that it was peace before the Oct 7 incident.

by mrtksn 2y ago

ponector 2y ago

> It's actually not that clear cut and if you apply the same filters for both of the countries you will see it. Pretty much clear. Unless you watch Russia Today everyday. If you throw away tons of Russian lies it is clear expansion invasion. Russians did this many times. Annexation of Poland, Finland, Baltic states and more recent annexation of Ichkeria and occupation of Georgia.

mrtksn 2y ago
>Pretty much clear. Unless you watch Russia Today everyday. If you throw away tons of Russian lies it is clear expansion invasion. You are misrepresenting my argument. I don't say that Russian are innocent, I say that Israel is just as guilty.
nopurpose 2y ago
How is it "expansion invasion" if peace terms offered by Russia, which are now public knowledge with recent documents leak, shortly after invastion didn't include any new territories for Russia? Ukraine walked away from that offer.
- ponector 2y ago
  It was a bluff to make a weaker Ukraine. Just a reminder to that moment: 1.Russia sponsored separatist movement in Donbass with money, weapons and agents. 2. Russia directly occupied Crimea while lying they do not. 3. Russia signed a Budapest memorandum to respect Ukrainian independence and sovereignty in the existing borders and restrain to use force against it. 4. Russia signed a series of Minsk peace treaties. Why you think that they really offered a peace in a good faith? History of modern Russia, USSR and empire show any peace treaty or other international documents with nothing, just a waste of the paper. Russians always lie. That's putty western world are blind because Russian bribes are too good to miss.
- flerchin 2y ago
  What is this?
- myrmidon 2y ago
  Those peace terms included Russia getting to annex Crimea, stationing troops in Donbas (eastern Ukraine), Ukraine retreating all of their troops, Ukraine being neutral (permanently non-allied). In return, Ukraine would have gotten some guarantor states safekeeping its newly drawn borders (but Russia would have been able to veto any action of those guarantor states in case someone, possibly Russia, attacked the Ukraine again). This seems a bit of a complete joke to me? Can you explain, why, exactly, Ukraine should have taken that offer? This is basically "I give you everything we are currently fighting over, in return I get an absolutely worthless promise from a serial liar". No deal.

myrmidon 2y ago

> Try testing for internationally recognized borders and the situation is same for the Israeli invasion and Russian invasion. I do not understand your point. Ukraine has borders that were recognized by Russia itself (Budapest Memorandum). They violated those borders when they annexed Crimea-- their excuse: those people want to be part of our empire-- ok. 8 years later they marched on Kyiv-- whats even the excuse for that? Do you think the people in Kyiv want to be liberated from their president, and governed by some Russian oligarch? If Russia is in a similar situation than Israel, then were are the massive acts of terrorism against Russian citizens comparable to October 7th? Where are the missiles fired towards Moscow, before 2014?

mrtksn 2y ago
I don't know why you interpret my comment like that, I don't support Russia, I say that Israel is just like Russia from that standpoint. Are you by any chance assuming that Israel is absolutely innocent, therefore I must be claiming that Russia must be also innocent? It's the other way around, they are both aggressor and invaders. Anyone claiming that countries shouldn't invade other countries and respect the internationally recognized borders then should support Ukraine and Palestine.
- myrmidon 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - mrtksn 2y ago
    They should have solved it before 7th of October and if that was not possible they shouldn't have been committing AI assisted genocide. Sometimes you screw up with your intelligence and diplomacy, you take a hit and this still doesn't give you a right to genocide. The same for the Palestinians BTW, you screw up lose a war get occupied and you still don'y get right to do terror attacks. I'm actually fan of Israel, It's a country I want to visit a lot and I actually admire the things they achieved in that barely livable land. Which makes me extra sad too see into what they have turned.

data_maan 2y ago

> Not the same but when you pick something like "Russia must respect the internationally recognized borders" and you don't apply the same for Israel then you are a hypocrite Ahem... You're suggesting that Ukraine killed over a thousand Russians and took them hostage, and thereby provoked a war? That would actually be the correct analogy. No, Russia simply invaded because it felt it could. The situation is very different to Israel and Gaza and you're deliberately leaving out the fine details that make the difference.

dunekid 2y ago
>Ahem... You're suggesting that Ukraine killed over a thousand Russians and took them hostage, and thereby provoked a war? Maybe, just maybe you could have a look at what Gaza was like before the said event. It was blockaded by Sea, Air and Land. It was oppressed and occupied, not to mention the settler terrorism in West Bank. It is a myopic view to hold that it was peace before the Oct 7 incident.