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Compared to CEO's directing their companies to legally murder people ("law abiding citizens") instead?

tptacek 2y ago
This is logic that makes sense inside of filter bubbles on the Internet that I think most people --- most people are not in any one particular filter bubble and certainly not this one --- would find absolutely repellant. To put it in perspective: it is literally the logic used by people who shoot up abortion clinics.
s1artibartfast 2y ago
How do you feel about murdering doctors who demand pay for treatment, citizens that vote against single payer, or people that fail to donate to your gofundme?
- vundercind 2y ago
  All of those are extremely different situations, so what are you getting at?
  - s1artibartfast 2y ago
    I see them as essentially the same. All of these people are choosing their financial interests over your health. People are dying from their inaction.
    - vundercind 2y ago
      I can’t begin to relate to seeing someone with a median income failing to donate to some particular go-fund-me as the same as choosing to head an organization that makes more money when people don’t get the health care they need, and overseeing operations that did that even more recklessly than the industry standard. One has taken on a business relationship already and is taking people’s money then screwing them, at a mass scale. The other just didn’t donate to a gofundme that may not even be legit and for someone they have no connection to. Similar reaction for the other examples. I’m baffled that they look similar to anybody at all. [edit] hold on, ok, another angle that may clear up why I’m confused: if my health insurer denies my legit claim, should I be more, less, or equally angry with the leadership of that company, or with every single person in the country who fails to donate to my resulting gofundme? I’m immediately inclined to wish horrible things on one of these groups, and to find the idea of wishing horrible things on the other confusing and repulsive.
      - s1artibartfast 2y ago
        There are laws enacted by our elected government (Democrats under Obama) that say exactly how much overhead is acceptable for a health insurance company, and all business expenses and CEO pay comes out of that portion. If they collect too much in premiums to and their profits exceed that percent, they have to refund the insurance members. Health insurance has a fixed profit margin on claims paid. Denying claims costs them money. Pay 10 billion in claims and they make 2 billion. Deny half the claims and they make half as much. look up that ACA 85/15 law
        justinclift 2y ago
        Not sure how this is relevant?
        s1artibartfast 2y ago
        Because they arent murdering or killing people to make money. The less they pay out, the less they make. Because there is a clear legal understanding of how much profit is acceptable.
        justinclift 2y ago
        > Because they arent murdering or killing people to make money. Ahhh. I guess you're not aware of stuff like this? https://www.newsweek.com/hospitals-are-reporting-more-insurance-denials-ai-driving-them-1977706 https://www.newsweek.com/hospitals-are-reporting-more-insura...
        tptacek 2y ago
        This is the second time on this thread you've pasted this Newsweek link as a rebuttal. I don't understand why you think it rebuts either argument.
        justinclift 2y ago

This is logic that makes sense inside of filter bubbles on the Internet that I think most people --- most people are not in any one particular filter bubble and certainly not this one --- would find absolutely repellant. To put it in perspective: it is literally the logic used by people who shoot up abortion clinics.

s1artibartfast 2y ago

How do you feel about murdering doctors who demand pay for treatment, citizens that vote against single payer, or people that fail to donate to your gofundme?

vundercind 2y ago
All of those are extremely different situations, so what are you getting at?
- s1artibartfast 2y ago
  I see them as essentially the same. All of these people are choosing their financial interests over your health. People are dying from their inaction.
  - vundercind 2y ago
    I can’t begin to relate to seeing someone with a median income failing to donate to some particular go-fund-me as the same as choosing to head an organization that makes more money when people don’t get the health care they need, and overseeing operations that did that even more recklessly than the industry standard. One has taken on a business relationship already and is taking people’s money then screwing them, at a mass scale. The other just didn’t donate to a gofundme that may not even be legit and for someone they have no connection to. Similar reaction for the other examples. I’m baffled that they look similar to anybody at all. [edit] hold on, ok, another angle that may clear up why I’m confused: if my health insurer denies my legit claim, should I be more, less, or equally angry with the leadership of that company, or with every single person in the country who fails to donate to my resulting gofundme? I’m immediately inclined to wish horrible things on one of these groups, and to find the idea of wishing horrible things on the other confusing and repulsive.
    - s1artibartfast 2y ago
      There are laws enacted by our elected government (Democrats under Obama) that say exactly how much overhead is acceptable for a health insurance company, and all business expenses and CEO pay comes out of that portion. If they collect too much in premiums to and their profits exceed that percent, they have to refund the insurance members. Health insurance has a fixed profit margin on claims paid. Denying claims costs them money. Pay 10 billion in claims and they make 2 billion. Deny half the claims and they make half as much. look up that ACA 85/15 law
      - justinclift 2y ago
        Not sure how this is relevant?
        s1artibartfast 2y ago
        Because they arent murdering or killing people to make money. The less they pay out, the less they make. Because there is a clear legal understanding of how much profit is acceptable.
        justinclift 2y ago
        > Because they arent murdering or killing people to make money. Ahhh. I guess you're not aware of stuff like this? https://www.newsweek.com/hospitals-are-reporting-more-insurance-denials-ai-driving-them-1977706 https://www.newsweek.com/hospitals-are-reporting-more-insura...
        tptacek 2y ago
        This is the second time on this thread you've pasted this Newsweek link as a rebuttal. I don't understand why you think it rebuts either argument.
        justinclift 2y ago