6 ms·

Reasons why OUYA is a bad idea (at best)

32 points by nemo1618 14y ago

rokhayakebe 14y ago
This post describes the "Captivity of Negativity"
- waterlesscloud 14y ago
  Then there's the slamming of mobile game developers "People who do exist are the hacks who are responsible for the 99 cent garbage you see flooding the iPhone and Android app stores."
  - batiudrami 14y ago
    Mobile games are garbage. They, at best, are pay-for flash games, and at worst, are a small fraction of a game designed to push you into paying money to unlock features which are a near unfeasible grind to unlock normally (if it's even possible). The only way they shine is Draw Something/Words With Friends-style turn-based multiplayer, and even then they still suffer from the issues I noted above. I have far more fun playing Pokemon on an emulator on my phone than I've had with any mobile game to date.
    - rje 14y ago
      You may not enjoy them, but it's dismissive and incorrect to label the entire set as 'garbage'. Offhand, here are some mobile games that I have played that are in no way garbage: * Superbrothers: Sword and Sworcery * Waking Mars * Shadowgun * Infinity Blade/Infinity Blade II * Hero Academy * Magic 2013: Duel of the Planeswalkers * Aralon * Great Little War Game * Space Invaders Infinity Gene * Shadow Era Pokemon is an amazing game and one of the most popular ever made, so saying you've had more fun with it than another game isn't saying much at all.
kposehn 14y ago
I do agree that there is something about OUYA that makes me hesitate to plonk down my $99 for a console. However, I'm not sure it is all the reasons outlined by the article.
untog 14y ago
I don't disagree with any of the points raised. I think the counter to all of them is that the console costs $99. It's quite possible to have a speculative purchase of it on the basis that it might work out, but even if it doesn't, it's a perfectly hackable box you could maybe use as a media centre. The bigger fear to my mind is that despite taking all the money, they'll somehow never ship a product. Certainly, they are not obliged to by the terms of Kickstarter. I'm sure they will, though.
TimJRobinson 14y ago
A lot of the same arguments were made about the wii when it first came out (specs are crap, no good games, controllers are unconventional so games have to be recoded for them), it still did quite well. Though even if everything else fails I'll still enjoy it as a $99 media streamer.
- eostyx 14y ago
  Exactly the same as my sentiment. Why are all these gaming tech "pundits" jumping on the internet hate bandwagon. It stifles innovation and is regressive. There's no telling if this will be a success because that's entirely up to the developers/community/designers that may or may not lead it. I donated because I want to see that consoles by definition not need to be the latest and greatest (I have my PC for that and most people will have extensive "fanboy" wars over the next console put out by either Sony or MS). Not only that but I support the idea that Android could be THE entry level to game development. It could be an amazing learning tool for beginners, everywhere. I'm starting to hate using HN... Anyone found good alternatives?
hello_asdf 14y ago
This blog seemed rather negative about the system, but I'm still excited to see how OUYA turns out. I know that I can hook up a box to a tv, and program for it. Most programmers know that. However, it's the idea that you're programming for a standalone console that just makes me want to code.
ekianjo 14y ago
This is a crap of a post if I ever see one. It's easy to see the huge amount of bias in the lines. I need to say before writing further that I am not interested in the OUYA stuff, but I'm curious to see how it does, and there's probably some kind of market for it. "1. android game list not compatible" : There are several apps on Android which enable games working with touchscreen only to be translated to physical controls by simulating touch pressure at precise points on the screen. Of course, this wouldnt work for Angry birds of game such as that, but there are a number of games for which this approach will work. "2. The Android Game Library is Extremely Lackluster" : Yeah, maybe. But apparently there's some significant profit happening from a bunch of game creators, if not they would have stopped making games for Android a long time ago. "3. Indies Will Not Fill the Void" : Why not? We have seen Braid on Ubuntu store even though it's a tiny portion of the market for games. There will be support from Indies. Porting something to the OUYA will be something fairly easy since the hardware is standard and the environment is already one people are familiar with. Cost of porting will be very low, I believe. "4. The Userbase Problem" : They already solved this partly by : - adopting Android and therefore benefiting from Android market games - ensuring ports would be easy to make with standard hardware and environment, as my previous point. - and it seems, at least from Kickstarter, that there is some strong market interest for it, at least for a niche market. "5. Some Things Just Don't Scale" : Author focuses on online capabilities, but just like on other consoles, you dont need online to enjoy great single player games like Limbo or Braid. "6. Games are Moving Away From the TV" : Yeah, so what? There will still be always a market for TV-games. It's not like everyone is going to stop playing games on a big screen. There will be a market for it. Noone is ever considering that the games' market will be 100% mobile in the years to come. It may be decreasing because of the old business model as well, and the lack of innovation on home-based consoles. "7. Android Specs Move too Fast" : Yeah, and so do hardware specs for PCs, yet games usually support a wide range of hardware capabilities, to be able to run in different resolutions and different processors, while still remaining playable. I don't see the big deal there. And nothing prevents them for updating the OUYA every 2 years or something while still keeping game compatibility, something impossible with current consoles. I can't believe someone claiming to be a developper in the game industry wrote that post. Seriously.
- rje 14y ago
Danieru 14y ago
OUYA is a startup. A startup's job is to explore new markets at a high risk. Maybe that is too abstract, I'll reword it. A startup's job is to overcome challenges and create the non-obvious. Each of those 'reasons' are just challenges that OUYA will have to overcome to succeed. The reasons do not make OUYA a bad idea, but rather a hard idea.
drivebyacct2 14y ago
This post is so bad, I have a paragraph response to each one and I'm too damn lazy to type them. The only one worthy of discussion is the first one. It seems like this publicity could be an easy way to help solve this problem if they do it right.
kerryfalk 14y ago
I hate to add another "this is why HN is going down the tube" post so I'm going to try and be very constructive here. There are naysayers for every idea. For new ideas there are more of them than when the ideas are established. Every new product sucks. All of them. Some suck less. But the good ones improve with time. I do not want to be part of a community that rallies against people trying to do great things with passion and change the status quo. To me as a gamer and a guy who learned to do basic HTML as a pre-teen because he loved games and learned to hack at games with others far more experience than me this seems like an absolutely brilliant idea. If I were 13 again, I would be figuring out how to build games for OUYA if for nothing else than to be cool among my group of friends. This comment comes from the gut and is not as analytical as some of my others but this post does not belong here. OUYA team, I salute you. I don't care about the shortcomings of your initial product, I think your idea is sound and it seems there are thousands of people who seem to agree.
- maratd 14y ago
  I'm sorry, but your impassioned and eloquent post is wasted on the garbage you're responding to. If it was a well thought-out critique, it might be warranted, but the author couldn't even be bothered to proof read. There are horrible spelling and grammar mistakes throughout the entire article. And I'm not being picky. If I have to stop and think about what words are missing from your sentence so that I can understand it, I'm not going to bother thinking about what ideas the sentence actually tries to convey.
  - jdechambeau 14y ago
    I'm not seeing any typos or missing words. Could you point out a couple for me?
    - maratd 14y ago
      > They claim their console will "open" and "hackable". > ... speaker seems to say the word "television" a disturbing amount of time, as ... > How many existing Android games will be play well with this thing > It spend far more when it launched the original Xbox. > I can only hope the OUYA people do intend to make good on their promises, rather than just taking the money and running. A few choice selections that still remain. Not to mention all the mind crushing run-on sentences! I had a better writing style in the 5th grade. Look, I'm starting to sound like a grammar Nazi, but this guy makes me want to reach into the screen and punch him. Google Translate can do a better job.
saket123 14y ago
Common posters..lighten up..this is a start-up trying to be really bold and are making some cool stuff. Isn't that what's a start up is about. For me this post criticizes sprit and innovativeness and hence is a bad one.
postfuturist 14y ago
Refutations: 1. A lot of games already support the Sony Experia Play gamepad layout which is extremely similar to this controller. I own that phone, there are plenty of games. This is just plain wrong. 2. Nonsense, plenty of fantastic games. Maybe not XBOX 360 / PS3 level of library, but is that necessary for success? I think not. 3. Yeah, there's junk, but there are also a lot of gems. So what, that's what ratings are for. Plenty of crap available on all game systems. This isn't competing on having specific games, but being an open platform. Expensive dev-kit not required. People actually like that, even if they don't use it. I love low-budget indie games. Lots of other people do, too. 4. Android already has great games. The games are already there, or trivially easy to port. A lot of developers added support to the Sony Experia Play after the fact when that came out. There's a good chance all those games will work on day 1 on OUYA. 5. No real compelling argument here. Android is an open system for networked games, they can work however they work. What's not economically feasible about games running their own servers or having multiple competing server services. These already exist in the PC game world. 6. Well the success of current consoles suggest that lots of people still do (and will continue) to game in their living rooms staring at their giant HD screen. I do. 7. Specs moving too fast? The XBOX 360 is dramatically "behind" in specs (not to mention the Wii), but as we already know, the tech specs of game systems aren't really much of a limiting factor in creating enjoyable experiences.. Hell, lots of people love games made for radically out-of-date consoles. Who is going to be writing games in 2 years for Android that doesn't run on current best-in-class android devices? Idiots, that's who. 8. We'll see...
portmanteaufu 14y ago
It's obvious that the OUYA benefits from the existing Android ecosystem, but what I'm really looking forward to is the benefit that the Android ecosystem will get from the OUYA. If the OUYA experiences even moderate success it will draw a lot of neat games into the marketplace for people with a mobile device to enjoy.
chaostheory 14y ago
I think the author fails to see that OUYA isn't made to replace the Xboxes, Wiis, and PS's of the world. OUYA is not for the mainstream. OUYA is a cool and cheap experiment. It's a cheap TV gaming box for hackers and developers akin to the venerable GP32 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GP32 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GP32

32 points by nemo1618 14y ago

rokhayakebe 14y ago

This post describes the "Captivity of Negativity"

waterlesscloud 14y ago
Then there's the slamming of mobile game developers "People who do exist are the hacks who are responsible for the 99 cent garbage you see flooding the iPhone and Android app stores."
- batiudrami 14y ago
  Mobile games are garbage. They, at best, are pay-for flash games, and at worst, are a small fraction of a game designed to push you into paying money to unlock features which are a near unfeasible grind to unlock normally (if it's even possible). The only way they shine is Draw Something/Words With Friends-style turn-based multiplayer, and even then they still suffer from the issues I noted above. I have far more fun playing Pokemon on an emulator on my phone than I've had with any mobile game to date.
  - rje 14y ago
    You may not enjoy them, but it's dismissive and incorrect to label the entire set as 'garbage'. Offhand, here are some mobile games that I have played that are in no way garbage: * Superbrothers: Sword and Sworcery * Waking Mars * Shadowgun * Infinity Blade/Infinity Blade II * Hero Academy * Magic 2013: Duel of the Planeswalkers * Aralon * Great Little War Game * Space Invaders Infinity Gene * Shadow Era Pokemon is an amazing game and one of the most popular ever made, so saying you've had more fun with it than another game isn't saying much at all.

kposehn 14y ago

I do agree that there is something about OUYA that makes me hesitate to plonk down my $99 for a console. However, I'm not sure it is all the reasons outlined by the article.

untog 14y ago

I don't disagree with any of the points raised. I think the counter to all of them is that the console costs $99. It's quite possible to have a speculative purchase of it on the basis that it might work out, but even if it doesn't, it's a perfectly hackable box you could maybe use as a media centre. The bigger fear to my mind is that despite taking all the money, they'll somehow never ship a product. Certainly, they are not obliged to by the terms of Kickstarter. I'm sure they will, though.

TimJRobinson 14y ago

A lot of the same arguments were made about the wii when it first came out (specs are crap, no good games, controllers are unconventional so games have to be recoded for them), it still did quite well. Though even if everything else fails I'll still enjoy it as a $99 media streamer.

eostyx 14y ago
Exactly the same as my sentiment. Why are all these gaming tech "pundits" jumping on the internet hate bandwagon. It stifles innovation and is regressive. There's no telling if this will be a success because that's entirely up to the developers/community/designers that may or may not lead it. I donated because I want to see that consoles by definition not need to be the latest and greatest (I have my PC for that and most people will have extensive "fanboy" wars over the next console put out by either Sony or MS). Not only that but I support the idea that Android could be THE entry level to game development. It could be an amazing learning tool for beginners, everywhere. I'm starting to hate using HN... Anyone found good alternatives?

hello_asdf 14y ago

This blog seemed rather negative about the system, but I'm still excited to see how OUYA turns out. I know that I can hook up a box to a tv, and program for it. Most programmers know that. However, it's the idea that you're programming for a standalone console that just makes me want to code.

ekianjo 14y ago

This is a crap of a post if I ever see one. It's easy to see the huge amount of bias in the lines. I need to say before writing further that I am not interested in the OUYA stuff, but I'm curious to see how it does, and there's probably some kind of market for it. "1. android game list not compatible" : There are several apps on Android which enable games working with touchscreen only to be translated to physical controls by simulating touch pressure at precise points on the screen. Of course, this wouldnt work for Angry birds of game such as that, but there are a number of games for which this approach will work. "2. The Android Game Library is Extremely Lackluster" : Yeah, maybe. But apparently there's some significant profit happening from a bunch of game creators, if not they would have stopped making games for Android a long time ago. "3. Indies Will Not Fill the Void" : Why not? We have seen Braid on Ubuntu store even though it's a tiny portion of the market for games. There will be support from Indies. Porting something to the OUYA will be something fairly easy since the hardware is standard and the environment is already one people are familiar with. Cost of porting will be very low, I believe. "4. The Userbase Problem" : They already solved this partly by : - adopting Android and therefore benefiting from Android market games - ensuring ports would be easy to make with standard hardware and environment, as my previous point. - and it seems, at least from Kickstarter, that there is some strong market interest for it, at least for a niche market. "5. Some Things Just Don't Scale" : Author focuses on online capabilities, but just like on other consoles, you dont need online to enjoy great single player games like Limbo or Braid. "6. Games are Moving Away From the TV" : Yeah, so what? There will still be always a market for TV-games. It's not like everyone is going to stop playing games on a big screen. There will be a market for it. Noone is ever considering that the games' market will be 100% mobile in the years to come. It may be decreasing because of the old business model as well, and the lack of innovation on home-based consoles. "7. Android Specs Move too Fast" : Yeah, and so do hardware specs for PCs, yet games usually support a wide range of hardware capabilities, to be able to run in different resolutions and different processors, while still remaining playable. I don't see the big deal there. And nothing prevents them for updating the OUYA every 2 years or something while still keeping game compatibility, something impossible with current consoles. I can't believe someone claiming to be a developper in the game industry wrote that post. Seriously.

rje 14y ago

Danieru 14y ago

OUYA is a startup. A startup's job is to explore new markets at a high risk. Maybe that is too abstract, I'll reword it. A startup's job is to overcome challenges and create the non-obvious. Each of those 'reasons' are just challenges that OUYA will have to overcome to succeed. The reasons do not make OUYA a bad idea, but rather a hard idea.

drivebyacct2 14y ago

This post is so bad, I have a paragraph response to each one and I'm too damn lazy to type them. The only one worthy of discussion is the first one. It seems like this publicity could be an easy way to help solve this problem if they do it right.

kerryfalk 14y ago

I hate to add another "this is why HN is going down the tube" post so I'm going to try and be very constructive here. There are naysayers for every idea. For new ideas there are more of them than when the ideas are established. Every new product sucks. All of them. Some suck less. But the good ones improve with time. I do not want to be part of a community that rallies against people trying to do great things with passion and change the status quo. To me as a gamer and a guy who learned to do basic HTML as a pre-teen because he loved games and learned to hack at games with others far more experience than me this seems like an absolutely brilliant idea. If I were 13 again, I would be figuring out how to build games for OUYA if for nothing else than to be cool among my group of friends. This comment comes from the gut and is not as analytical as some of my others but this post does not belong here. OUYA team, I salute you. I don't care about the shortcomings of your initial product, I think your idea is sound and it seems there are thousands of people who seem to agree.

maratd 14y ago
I'm sorry, but your impassioned and eloquent post is wasted on the garbage you're responding to. If it was a well thought-out critique, it might be warranted, but the author couldn't even be bothered to proof read. There are horrible spelling and grammar mistakes throughout the entire article. And I'm not being picky. If I have to stop and think about what words are missing from your sentence so that I can understand it, I'm not going to bother thinking about what ideas the sentence actually tries to convey.
- jdechambeau 14y ago
  I'm not seeing any typos or missing words. Could you point out a couple for me?
  - maratd 14y ago
    > They claim their console will "open" and "hackable". > ... speaker seems to say the word "television" a disturbing amount of time, as ... > How many existing Android games will be play well with this thing > It spend far more when it launched the original Xbox. > I can only hope the OUYA people do intend to make good on their promises, rather than just taking the money and running. A few choice selections that still remain. Not to mention all the mind crushing run-on sentences! I had a better writing style in the 5th grade. Look, I'm starting to sound like a grammar Nazi, but this guy makes me want to reach into the screen and punch him. Google Translate can do a better job.

saket123 14y ago

Common posters..lighten up..this is a start-up trying to be really bold and are making some cool stuff. Isn't that what's a start up is about. For me this post criticizes sprit and innovativeness and hence is a bad one.

postfuturist 14y ago

Refutations: 1. A lot of games already support the Sony Experia Play gamepad layout which is extremely similar to this controller. I own that phone, there are plenty of games. This is just plain wrong. 2. Nonsense, plenty of fantastic games. Maybe not XBOX 360 / PS3 level of library, but is that necessary for success? I think not. 3. Yeah, there's junk, but there are also a lot of gems. So what, that's what ratings are for. Plenty of crap available on all game systems. This isn't competing on having specific games, but being an open platform. Expensive dev-kit not required. People actually like that, even if they don't use it. I love low-budget indie games. Lots of other people do, too. 4. Android already has great games. The games are already there, or trivially easy to port. A lot of developers added support to the Sony Experia Play after the fact when that came out. There's a good chance all those games will work on day 1 on OUYA. 5. No real compelling argument here. Android is an open system for networked games, they can work however they work. What's not economically feasible about games running their own servers or having multiple competing server services. These already exist in the PC game world. 6. Well the success of current consoles suggest that lots of people still do (and will continue) to game in their living rooms staring at their giant HD screen. I do. 7. Specs moving too fast? The XBOX 360 is dramatically "behind" in specs (not to mention the Wii), but as we already know, the tech specs of game systems aren't really much of a limiting factor in creating enjoyable experiences.. Hell, lots of people love games made for radically out-of-date consoles. Who is going to be writing games in 2 years for Android that doesn't run on current best-in-class android devices? Idiots, that's who. 8. We'll see...

portmanteaufu 14y ago

It's obvious that the OUYA benefits from the existing Android ecosystem, but what I'm really looking forward to is the benefit that the Android ecosystem will get from the OUYA. If the OUYA experiences even moderate success it will draw a lot of neat games into the marketplace for people with a mobile device to enjoy.

chaostheory 14y ago

I think the author fails to see that OUYA isn't made to replace the Xboxes, Wiis, and PS's of the world. OUYA is not for the mainstream. OUYA is a cool and cheap experiment. It's a cheap TV gaming box for hackers and developers akin to the venerable GP32 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GP32 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GP32