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US officials urge Americans to use encrypted apps amid unprecedented cyberattack

41 points by leotravis10 2y ago

ano-ther 2y ago
> Our suggestion, what we have told folks internally, is not new here: encryption is your friend, whether it’s on text messaging or if you have the capacity to use encrypted voice communication. Solid advice. But how do I get encrypted voice communication? Are Signal‘s or WhatsApp‘s calls encrypted? Also, they sound so much worse than an old-fashioned call.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > how do I get encrypted voice communication? Are Signal‘s or WhatsApp‘s calls encrypted? Yes [1][2]. Also FaceTime audio [3]. I find the latter better quality than standard calls. [1] https://support.signal.org/hc/en-us/articles/360007060492-Voice-or-Video-Calling https://support.signal.org/hc/en-us/articles/360007060492-Vo... [2] https://faq.whatsapp.com/820124435853543 https://faq.whatsapp.com/820124435853543 [3] https://support.apple.com/guide/security/facetime-security-seca331c55cd/web https://support.apple.com/guide/security/facetime-security-s...
- longitudinal93 2y ago
  I told all my contacts (including family) not to bother calling me unless it's over Signal, almost ten years ago. It has really cut a lot of crap from my life.
- jeroenhd 2y ago
  WhatsApp and Signal will strongly reduce bandwidth if you're routing your call through their servers. You can disable that (which does expose your IP address to the other side) and let standard P2P traffic do its thing. You'll still need good net neutrality laws for the calls to be of any useful quality (RIP video calling in the US for the next four years or more I guess) but the bandwidth problem is usually artificial. Even Telegram has encrypted phone calls. Hell, even SIP+RTP, which regular modern calling is based on, has encryption capabilities. Of course your phone won't ever do that by default (your government wouldn't like phones they can't wiretap at all) but in theory we don't even need to drop the phone number system to get privacy back.
JumpCrisscross 2y ago
We may have the momentum to E2E encrypt our phone network. Mistrust of the “deep state” in the White House. Penetration demonstration by an adversary. Common use of encrypted apps making the switch less extreme.
fragmede 2y ago
Not that you shouldn't do better with opsec in your daily life, but with the amount of data China has on Americans in the form of Temu and AliExpress orders, nevermind TikTok viewing habits, what's the threat model? If I make Winnie the Pooh jokes about dear leader on the phone, am I getting abducted from the west and sent to the steppes of Tibet? Why would they bother? Again, yes, do have better opsec and use something encrypted, I'm just not sure who's a bigger threat, five eyes governments who have boots on the ground, or the CCP, half the world away.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > not sure who's a bigger threat, five eyes governments who have boots on the ground, or the CCP, half the world away One, you're comparing intelligence agencies working for elected governments with one working for a dictator. Two, every operation needs disposable boots on the ground. If they do their job correctly, you should never know you were part of a scheme. The right person happened to be at the right place at the right time to be helpful to you in a time of need, and you may not have thought of whatever you told or gave them as being consequential. (Or you knew it was consequential but fell for their front. It's easier to scam someone when they're an open book to you.) If this isn't intuitive, try flipping the board. What would the Five Eyes do with a personal dossier on every Chinese national? How could they make someone innocent's life a living nightmare in order to get something they want that happens to be near them?
  - lazide 2y ago
    What happens when you go against someone like Trump - who also has that info. Or you happen to be in one of the ‘bad’ classes for the next government?
    - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
      > What happens when you go against someone like Trump - who also has that info Yes, enemies closer are more problematic than enemies further. That doesn’t mean enemies farther are harmless. Also, no, he doesn't. To get those data Trump et al would need to go through our courts. No such limits on foreign intelligence. Similarly, American intel doesn't need to respect Chinese laws, conventions or even expectations when it manages compromised/assets overseas.
AnimalMuppet 2y ago
After the war against encryption by investigative agencies (because it makes their jobs harder), this is... different. Maybe we actually do need protection against people spying on us, when the people spying on us aren't them?
- LinuxBender 2y ago
  Maybe the war on encryption was just a show to make people think they can not monitor WhatsApp or Signal. Now they give up and push people to those platforms. Would that qualify me as a conspiracy theorist and if so what kind of nickname do I get? I hope it rhymes with Bender. I have skin thicker than my skull so I hope people give me a good one.
pcunite 2y ago
Why is this not front page?

41 points by leotravis10 2y ago

> Our suggestion, what we have told folks internally, is not new here: encryption is your friend, whether it’s on text messaging or if you have the capacity to use encrypted voice communication. Solid advice. But how do I get encrypted voice communication? Are Signal‘s or WhatsApp‘s calls encrypted? Also, they sound so much worse than an old-fashioned call.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> how do I get encrypted voice communication? Are Signal‘s or WhatsApp‘s calls encrypted? Yes [1][2]. Also FaceTime audio [3]. I find the latter better quality than standard calls. [1] https://support.signal.org/hc/en-us/articles/360007060492-Voice-or-Video-Calling https://support.signal.org/hc/en-us/articles/360007060492-Vo... [2] https://faq.whatsapp.com/820124435853543 https://faq.whatsapp.com/820124435853543 [3] https://support.apple.com/guide/security/facetime-security-seca331c55cd/web https://support.apple.com/guide/security/facetime-security-s...
longitudinal93 2y ago
I told all my contacts (including family) not to bother calling me unless it's over Signal, almost ten years ago. It has really cut a lot of crap from my life.
jeroenhd 2y ago
WhatsApp and Signal will strongly reduce bandwidth if you're routing your call through their servers. You can disable that (which does expose your IP address to the other side) and let standard P2P traffic do its thing. You'll still need good net neutrality laws for the calls to be of any useful quality (RIP video calling in the US for the next four years or more I guess) but the bandwidth problem is usually artificial. Even Telegram has encrypted phone calls. Hell, even SIP+RTP, which regular modern calling is based on, has encryption capabilities. Of course your phone won't ever do that by default (your government wouldn't like phones they can't wiretap at all) but in theory we don't even need to drop the phone number system to get privacy back.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago

We may have the momentum to E2E encrypt our phone network. Mistrust of the “deep state” in the White House. Penetration demonstration by an adversary. Common use of encrypted apps making the switch less extreme.

fragmede 2y ago

Not that you shouldn't do better with opsec in your daily life, but with the amount of data China has on Americans in the form of Temu and AliExpress orders, nevermind TikTok viewing habits, what's the threat model? If I make Winnie the Pooh jokes about dear leader on the phone, am I getting abducted from the west and sent to the steppes of Tibet? Why would they bother? Again, yes, do have better opsec and use something encrypted, I'm just not sure who's a bigger threat, five eyes governments who have boots on the ground, or the CCP, half the world away.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> not sure who's a bigger threat, five eyes governments who have boots on the ground, or the CCP, half the world away One, you're comparing intelligence agencies working for elected governments with one working for a dictator. Two, every operation needs disposable boots on the ground. If they do their job correctly, you should never know you were part of a scheme. The right person happened to be at the right place at the right time to be helpful to you in a time of need, and you may not have thought of whatever you told or gave them as being consequential. (Or you knew it was consequential but fell for their front. It's easier to scam someone when they're an open book to you.) If this isn't intuitive, try flipping the board. What would the Five Eyes do with a personal dossier on every Chinese national? How could they make someone innocent's life a living nightmare in order to get something they want that happens to be near them?
- lazide 2y ago
  What happens when you go against someone like Trump - who also has that info. Or you happen to be in one of the ‘bad’ classes for the next government?
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > What happens when you go against someone like Trump - who also has that info Yes, enemies closer are more problematic than enemies further. That doesn’t mean enemies farther are harmless. Also, no, he doesn't. To get those data Trump et al would need to go through our courts. No such limits on foreign intelligence. Similarly, American intel doesn't need to respect Chinese laws, conventions or even expectations when it manages compromised/assets overseas.

AnimalMuppet 2y ago

After the war against encryption by investigative agencies (because it makes their jobs harder), this is... different. Maybe we actually do need protection against people spying on us, when the people spying on us aren't them?

LinuxBender 2y ago
Maybe the war on encryption was just a show to make people think they can not monitor WhatsApp or Signal. Now they give up and push people to those platforms. Would that qualify me as a conspiracy theorist and if so what kind of nickname do I get? I hope it rhymes with Bender. I have skin thicker than my skull so I hope people give me a good one.

pcunite 2y ago

Why is this not front page?