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> They use the same digital masters for the digital release and for vinyl. With all due respect, you don't know what you're talking about. If the engineers you

> They use the same digital masters for the digital release and for vinyl. With all due respect, you don't know what you're talking about. If the engineers you know do that, you don't know good engineers. edit: I can't reply to tekla's comment, so I'm editing here. It's frustrating on Hacker News for an expert - like myself, who has sat in on dozens of mastering sessions - to be disputed by someone who "knows some people." I'll clarify further. Do some engineers use the same mixes for vinyl as they do for digital? Sure. They're not good engineers. Or the customer hasn't paid enough (it's usually about $60-$100 per song to master per format). Vinyl is a drastically different medium than digital - of course - and any decent engineer will 100% mix differently and accordingly. If there are artists reading this and your engineer is using the same mix, fire them. You're paying a lot to press to vinyl so do the followthrough and get vinyl-specific mastering. Here's a good article from an engineer I have worked with many times on why mastering for vinyl is different: https://www.oregonlive.com/music/2014/11/does_vinyl_really_sound_better.html https://www.oregonlive.com/music/2014/11/does_vinyl_really_s...

tekla 2y ago
/shrug. He said/she said standoff is always fun, with a mix of insults. People who are the type to buy vinyls will buy them no matter what, as long as its not obviously a bad press. Why would any sound engineer bother to do extra work for such a low volume, high chance of losing money, PITA to work with medium, unless they were some sort of super artist.
unvs 2y ago
I'm a good engineer. I've done tons of mixes for records released both digitally and on vinyl or even tape. I never create different mixes for the formats - but I work with great mastering engineers and cutters who will create different masters for each format.
- superultra 2y ago
  Thanks for commenting. I'm curious why you wouldn't master specifically to the format. There are so many nuances to vinyl with mistakes that can deeply impact sales when the job isn't done right. For my own part, we had to recut the lacquers on a vinyl release five times to get it right, because the nature of the mix created a middling sound that bounced the needle around and caused intense surface sound. Once we solved that problem, the pressings sounded great. Obviously with cassettes the profit margin isn't there to justify the additional expense of mastering, and to my ears cassette mastering rarely sounds different than the digital master (maybe some slightly different leveling). I believe NAC actually has a mastering guide to master to cassettes kicking around. But...not sure anyone follows it. Just to be honest, I don't doubt you're a great engineer. But if you weren't mastering specific to format...I wouldn't hire you. Increasingly we've gone to vinyl-exclusive engineers on bigger projects, because it's so crucial to get the sound right at the start and poor vinyl mastering can cause problems months down the manufacturing line that are costly.
  - unvs 2y ago
    Are you confusing mixing and mastering, maybe? I just said that I don't MIX to different targets. I create the best mix I can, checking phase to mono every step of the way, then I deliver my mix to a mastering engineer who will create a master for digital as well as a master for vinyl. The vinyl master will sometimes be more agressively summed to mono in the bass if we're dealing with too much information in that registry. My point is you don't have to mix to different formats if your mix is good. Good mastering engineers and lacquer cutters will sort the rest for you! Maybe we just misunderstood eachother?
    - superultra 2y ago
      In the parent comment I was talking about mastering and you responding about mixing, so I assumed you meant mastering. Yes, there is always a single mix at least in my experience. That gets delivered to a mastering engineer who, imho, if they’re a good engineer, will master for vinyl and digital separately from the originally supplied mix. It is likely that some mastering engineers might create a digital master and then engineer for vinyl from that digital master but that’s not good engineering. But yes I think we are on the same page and agree! A single mix. And from that mix are multiple master cuts specific to format.

tekla 2y ago

/shrug. He said/she said standoff is always fun, with a mix of insults. People who are the type to buy vinyls will buy them no matter what, as long as its not obviously a bad press. Why would any sound engineer bother to do extra work for such a low volume, high chance of losing money, PITA to work with medium, unless they were some sort of super artist.

unvs 2y ago

I'm a good engineer. I've done tons of mixes for records released both digitally and on vinyl or even tape. I never create different mixes for the formats - but I work with great mastering engineers and cutters who will create different masters for each format.

superultra 2y ago
Thanks for commenting. I'm curious why you wouldn't master specifically to the format. There are so many nuances to vinyl with mistakes that can deeply impact sales when the job isn't done right. For my own part, we had to recut the lacquers on a vinyl release five times to get it right, because the nature of the mix created a middling sound that bounced the needle around and caused intense surface sound. Once we solved that problem, the pressings sounded great. Obviously with cassettes the profit margin isn't there to justify the additional expense of mastering, and to my ears cassette mastering rarely sounds different than the digital master (maybe some slightly different leveling). I believe NAC actually has a mastering guide to master to cassettes kicking around. But...not sure anyone follows it. Just to be honest, I don't doubt you're a great engineer. But if you weren't mastering specific to format...I wouldn't hire you. Increasingly we've gone to vinyl-exclusive engineers on bigger projects, because it's so crucial to get the sound right at the start and poor vinyl mastering can cause problems months down the manufacturing line that are costly.
- unvs 2y ago
  Are you confusing mixing and mastering, maybe? I just said that I don't MIX to different targets. I create the best mix I can, checking phase to mono every step of the way, then I deliver my mix to a mastering engineer who will create a master for digital as well as a master for vinyl. The vinyl master will sometimes be more agressively summed to mono in the bass if we're dealing with too much information in that registry. My point is you don't have to mix to different formats if your mix is good. Good mastering engineers and lacquer cutters will sort the rest for you! Maybe we just misunderstood eachother?
  - superultra 2y ago
    In the parent comment I was talking about mastering and you responding about mixing, so I assumed you meant mastering. Yes, there is always a single mix at least in my experience. That gets delivered to a mastering engineer who, imho, if they’re a good engineer, will master for vinyl and digital separately from the originally supplied mix. It is likely that some mastering engineers might create a digital master and then engineer for vinyl from that digital master but that’s not good engineering. But yes I think we are on the same page and agree! A single mix. And from that mix are multiple master cuts specific to format.