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I think Stockholm syndrome is an apt description of this condition. Maybe it happens because breaking the vicious cycle requires a person stuck in such predicam

I think Stockholm syndrome is an apt description of this condition. Maybe it happens because breaking the vicious cycle requires a person stuck in such predicament to acknowledge that their time, and to an extent their person, is a resource in the sad, neo-liberal sense. Usually people have more heroic visions of their person and possibly this is where the honor and pride narratives stem from, such as "I pulled a 10th all-niter in a row ant helped the company make 0.1% more in profits" or "I can't betray my employer". Another factor is that with a work schedule like that there is simply no time for a person to look for and apply for other positions, so suddenly quitting is a much harder decision to make without a fallback plan.

pyre 14y ago
The other problem is the this seems endemic in Japanese culture. I would expect that her next employer might look unfavorably on her 'betraying' her previous employer (though I don't have experience to know for sure).
- pmiller2 14y ago
  What next employer? How does one even go about finding a new job while working hours like that? Unless she gets fired, I don't expect she'd even have the time to conduct a job search if she wanted to.
  - hkmurakami 14y ago
    You basically have no choice but to use your "paid vacation" days to conduct a job search. If you're based in Tokyo, switching jobs is much easier because (a) there are a lot of companies in general there, (b) the culture of the companies are a little more westernized than the rest of the country, and (c) you have the option of going to a foreign national company.
    - kalleboo 14y ago
      I've also Tokyo seems more westernized in both culture and business, I guess due to offices having a lot of competition from foreign headquarters? Sadly, my girlfriend lives in Kagoshima, at the ass-end of backwardness. Convincing her parents that I'm not going to murder their daughter is going to be hard enough! (Japanese news media's treatment of foreigners is rivaled only by Fox News I think). As a white, european male, it's been enlightening being at this end of racism.
      - hkmurakami 14y ago
        I do think that's a factor. Also, in general Tokyo has a lot of cultural influence from the west, (having a decent number of foreign professionals there probably helps) and its inhabitants exhibit more western tendencies as a result. I think it's primarily at the individual level, rather than the corporate level though. Kagoshima is so close to Okinawa, that I imagine there is some cultural undertones that have permeated from the controversies regarding the US Army's isolated (but still brutal) incidences of poor behavior. (iirc they were the subject of the relocation of the Futenma base as well?) Kyuushuu people are pretty oldschool from what I understand. At least you're caucasian though, you would be truly doomed if you were non-Japanese & non-White. At least they treat you as if you're going to murder their daughter, rather than treating you as an untouchable :(
hkmurakami 14y ago
It's just generically incredibly difficult to switch jobs mid-career in Japan. The vast majority of hiring is done w.r.t new grads, who are then groomed (read: brainwashed) into drinking the company coolaid. There are four options I can think of: 1. You are a bonafide superstar and manage to switch into a solid company (my boss when I was in Japan managed to do this). 2. You become a contract worker. 3. You go to a smaller (less prestigious, usually lower pay, less stable) company. 4. You go to a "foreign national" company (European/American companies' Tokyo office)
- kalleboo 14y ago
  Exactly, switching jobs is generally not an option. Sadly for many japanese, they see suicide as an easier out than trying to find a new job. Long hours and no vacation also clearly lead to depression. I'd rather see my gf drop down to a part-time job (baito) than give up completely.
  - hkmurakami 14y ago
    I can never forget my friend/coworker telling me over dinner back in 2010, "I now know what those guys who jump into trains must have felt like."
- justinhj 14y ago
  Does this loyalty work both ways in Japan? Are you more likely to work your whole life at one company, or are layoffs as rife as they are in the US?
  - kalleboo 14y ago
    For many many years it has been. People'd get picked up fresh from college and they'd be part of the companies "family". Nowadays, especially after the financial crisis... not so much. Companies now only hire part-timers so they can fire them at will. Youth unemployment is skyrocketing as in many other countries.
  - hkmurakami 14y ago

pyre 14y ago

The other problem is the this seems endemic in Japanese culture. I would expect that her next employer might look unfavorably on her 'betraying' her previous employer (though I don't have experience to know for sure).

pmiller2 14y ago
What next employer? How does one even go about finding a new job while working hours like that? Unless she gets fired, I don't expect she'd even have the time to conduct a job search if she wanted to.
- hkmurakami 14y ago
  You basically have no choice but to use your "paid vacation" days to conduct a job search. If you're based in Tokyo, switching jobs is much easier because (a) there are a lot of companies in general there, (b) the culture of the companies are a little more westernized than the rest of the country, and (c) you have the option of going to a foreign national company.
  - kalleboo 14y ago
    I've also Tokyo seems more westernized in both culture and business, I guess due to offices having a lot of competition from foreign headquarters? Sadly, my girlfriend lives in Kagoshima, at the ass-end of backwardness. Convincing her parents that I'm not going to murder their daughter is going to be hard enough! (Japanese news media's treatment of foreigners is rivaled only by Fox News I think). As a white, european male, it's been enlightening being at this end of racism.
    - hkmurakami 14y ago
      I do think that's a factor. Also, in general Tokyo has a lot of cultural influence from the west, (having a decent number of foreign professionals there probably helps) and its inhabitants exhibit more western tendencies as a result. I think it's primarily at the individual level, rather than the corporate level though. Kagoshima is so close to Okinawa, that I imagine there is some cultural undertones that have permeated from the controversies regarding the US Army's isolated (but still brutal) incidences of poor behavior. (iirc they were the subject of the relocation of the Futenma base as well?) Kyuushuu people are pretty oldschool from what I understand. At least you're caucasian though, you would be truly doomed if you were non-Japanese & non-White. At least they treat you as if you're going to murder their daughter, rather than treating you as an untouchable :(

hkmurakami 14y ago

It's just generically incredibly difficult to switch jobs mid-career in Japan. The vast majority of hiring is done w.r.t new grads, who are then groomed (read: brainwashed) into drinking the company coolaid. There are four options I can think of: 1. You are a bonafide superstar and manage to switch into a solid company (my boss when I was in Japan managed to do this). 2. You become a contract worker. 3. You go to a smaller (less prestigious, usually lower pay, less stable) company. 4. You go to a "foreign national" company (European/American companies' Tokyo office)

kalleboo 14y ago
Exactly, switching jobs is generally not an option. Sadly for many japanese, they see suicide as an easier out than trying to find a new job. Long hours and no vacation also clearly lead to depression. I'd rather see my gf drop down to a part-time job (baito) than give up completely.
- hkmurakami 14y ago
  I can never forget my friend/coworker telling me over dinner back in 2010, "I now know what those guys who jump into trains must have felt like."
justinhj 14y ago
Does this loyalty work both ways in Japan? Are you more likely to work your whole life at one company, or are layoffs as rife as they are in the US?
- kalleboo 14y ago
  For many many years it has been. People'd get picked up fresh from college and they'd be part of the companies "family". Nowadays, especially after the financial crisis... not so much. Companies now only hire part-timers so they can fire them at will. Youth unemployment is skyrocketing as in many other countries.
- hkmurakami 14y ago