3 ms·

Also being issued on a major US holiday- when many are on PTO- does not help with the look.

alganet 2y ago
During carnival we brazillians often take 3 or 4 days leave. Would it be fair during that time if I asked you to hold your PRs, bug tickets and work in general because we're on paid leave? On-call rotation exists for those reasons. Otherwise, all countries would need to respect all other countries holidays. In fact, we're not even aware of most US holidays. It is likely to be a coincidence.
- lmm 2y ago
  > Would it be fair during that time if I asked you to hold your PRs, bug tickets and work in general because we're on paid leave? Yes. That's completely normal for companies that do business with Brazil.
  - alganet 2y ago
    Sorry, my example was bad. In fact, your example is perfect. We're not talking about business. CAs are different. In security and infrastructure, there's always someone working on holidays. The larger the organization, higher are the chances that some kind of rotation exists.
- bogota 2y ago
  Have you never worked at a multinational company?
  - alganet 2y ago
    I did, multiple times with multiple countries. All of them had some sort of call rotation. Someone was always at the helm, _specially_ in infrastructure and security. There are whole startups designed to solve this, like PagerDuty. I am now very curious to understand where your question comes from. There must be some misunderstanding here. You never went on-call or seen a friend do it?
    - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
      > You never went on-call or seen a friend do it? Red herring [1]. OP said it’s malicious or incompetent to release this on a U.S. holiday weekend. You asked if similar consideration would be given to Brazil. Multiple people chimed in that it would. You’re now pivoting to on-call capacity. Any amount of on-call capacity can be saturated. That’s why competent multinationals avoid releasing while markets they’re likely to impact are sleeping or drunk. This is a high-level scheduling operation, however, so it’s reasonable for those lower in the organisation to be unaware why an update is being pushed next Tuesday instead of this. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_herring https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_herring
      - alganet 2y ago
        You can totally ignore the red herring and focus on the first part. In the end I was just paraphrasing the comment I replied to. Rotations exist, specially in large organizations, or when there's shared responsibility. Now we're talking nonsense about "you said, he said", this conversation makes no sense. I am much less invested in this than you think.
        JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > Rotations exist Straw man [1]. Nobody claimed otherwise. Rotation or always-on isn’t a substitute for being aware of your customers. Good culture permeate this throughout the organisation. Competent ones have someone at the top ensuring controls are followed. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man
        alganet 2y ago
        Sorry, I lost the track. Can you explain the point you made precisely, in the context of the original subject?
- noirbot 2y ago
  For as big a country as Brazil? Totally. I've worked at companies that had minor code freezes for all sorts of holidays in countries we had a big client presence in, specifically to avoid releasing changes to client that wouldn't have engineers in-office to adapt to them.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > we're not even aware of most US holidays You’re not. Someone above you should be. Otherwise that’s incompetence.
- move-on-by 2y ago
  My comment is not about how all work should stop during US holidays. What I’m attempting to refer to, is that _if_ this was done with malicious intent, then maybe the hope was that doing it during a holiday would reduce response time or allow it to fly under the radar. Of course, as you say, just because it was a holiday does not inherently mean it’s malicious, it has plausible deniability.
  - alganet 2y ago
    What I actually said is that I believe that the notion of a holiday "hiding" these activities is naive. I don't think it makes any difference. I don't know if there's a rotation or another system. I think there are probably multiple across different parties responsible for maintaining CA trust.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]

During carnival we brazillians often take 3 or 4 days leave. Would it be fair during that time if I asked you to hold your PRs, bug tickets and work in general because we're on paid leave? On-call rotation exists for those reasons. Otherwise, all countries would need to respect all other countries holidays. In fact, we're not even aware of most US holidays. It is likely to be a coincidence.

lmm 2y ago
> Would it be fair during that time if I asked you to hold your PRs, bug tickets and work in general because we're on paid leave? Yes. That's completely normal for companies that do business with Brazil.
- alganet 2y ago
  Sorry, my example was bad. In fact, your example is perfect. We're not talking about business. CAs are different. In security and infrastructure, there's always someone working on holidays. The larger the organization, higher are the chances that some kind of rotation exists.
bogota 2y ago
Have you never worked at a multinational company?
- alganet 2y ago
  I did, multiple times with multiple countries. All of them had some sort of call rotation. Someone was always at the helm, _specially_ in infrastructure and security. There are whole startups designed to solve this, like PagerDuty. I am now very curious to understand where your question comes from. There must be some misunderstanding here. You never went on-call or seen a friend do it?
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > You never went on-call or seen a friend do it? Red herring [1]. OP said it’s malicious or incompetent to release this on a U.S. holiday weekend. You asked if similar consideration would be given to Brazil. Multiple people chimed in that it would. You’re now pivoting to on-call capacity. Any amount of on-call capacity can be saturated. That’s why competent multinationals avoid releasing while markets they’re likely to impact are sleeping or drunk. This is a high-level scheduling operation, however, so it’s reasonable for those lower in the organisation to be unaware why an update is being pushed next Tuesday instead of this. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_herring https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_herring
    - alganet 2y ago
      You can totally ignore the red herring and focus on the first part. In the end I was just paraphrasing the comment I replied to. Rotations exist, specially in large organizations, or when there's shared responsibility. Now we're talking nonsense about "you said, he said", this conversation makes no sense. I am much less invested in this than you think.
      - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > Rotations exist Straw man [1]. Nobody claimed otherwise. Rotation or always-on isn’t a substitute for being aware of your customers. Good culture permeate this throughout the organisation. Competent ones have someone at the top ensuring controls are followed. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man
        alganet 2y ago
        Sorry, I lost the track. Can you explain the point you made precisely, in the context of the original subject?
noirbot 2y ago
For as big a country as Brazil? Totally. I've worked at companies that had minor code freezes for all sorts of holidays in countries we had a big client presence in, specifically to avoid releasing changes to client that wouldn't have engineers in-office to adapt to them.
JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> we're not even aware of most US holidays You’re not. Someone above you should be. Otherwise that’s incompetence.
move-on-by 2y ago
My comment is not about how all work should stop during US holidays. What I’m attempting to refer to, is that _if_ this was done with malicious intent, then maybe the hope was that doing it during a holiday would reduce response time or allow it to fly under the radar. Of course, as you say, just because it was a holiday does not inherently mean it’s malicious, it has plausible deniability.
- alganet 2y ago
  What I actually said is that I believe that the notion of a holiday "hiding" these activities is naive. I don't think it makes any difference. I don't know if there's a rotation or another system. I think there are probably multiple across different parties responsible for maintaining CA trust.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]