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As long as privacy-related misconducts are considered petty offenses, these things will just continue. Governments fail to see the implications because the virt

by kleiba 2y ago

As long as privacy-related misconducts are considered petty offenses, these things will just continue. Governments fail to see the implications because the virtual world is too difficult for them to understand. As long as there are no laws that actually get enforced, your privacy isn't worth anything.

imiric 2y ago
The problem isn't with governments. It's with people. Most people don't care about their privacy. Even if they do, the majority of that group don't care enough to give up the conveniences they get in exchange for it. This leaves a small group of people to fight for protecting their privacy, as well as of those who don't care about it. This is an uphill battle against trillion-dollar corporations and the governments they're in symbiosis with. Some governments do make an effort, but it's too little, and too ineffective to matter in the grand scheme of things. I wouldn't expect this to improve, and can easily see it getting worse. I hope I'm just being pessimistic.
- treyd 2y ago
  I've more recently found that "laypeople" really do care about their privacy and but are unaware about what data it's possible for corporations to collect. They do rightfully uncomfortable when they have their questions answered, but feel powerless to be able to do anything about it.
  - imiric 2y ago
    That hasn't been my experience. Maybe that was the case 10+ years ago, but most people these days understand what they're giving up when using these services. The argument then becomes "I have nothing to hide", "I only use it occasionally", "What's the worst that could happen?", etc. It all boils down to them valuing the experience they're getting over their privacy. I've had these conversations with both technical and nontechnical people, and in nearly all cases I've had to argue in favor of privacy. I've yet to convince anyone to change their habits. I share and empathize with the feeling of powerlessness, but most people will choose convenience, user experience, etc. over privacy, even when there are reasonable alternatives. Hell, I will sacrifice my own privacy if a service is indispensable and there's no alternative. We can't expect people who value it less to do otherwise.
  - Arch-TK 2y ago
    In my experience, trying to tell an average person the kinds of things that companies can do with their data, which the companies themselves have admitted to and written into privacy policies, just gets you labelled as a conspiracy theorist. The things companies can, will and promise to do with your data are sometimes so far fetched that people assume they're impossible. At least this was the case 5 years ago, haven't tried persuading anyone in recent years.

by kleiba 2y ago

imiric 2y ago

The problem isn't with governments. It's with people. Most people don't care about their privacy. Even if they do, the majority of that group don't care enough to give up the conveniences they get in exchange for it. This leaves a small group of people to fight for protecting their privacy, as well as of those who don't care about it. This is an uphill battle against trillion-dollar corporations and the governments they're in symbiosis with. Some governments do make an effort, but it's too little, and too ineffective to matter in the grand scheme of things. I wouldn't expect this to improve, and can easily see it getting worse. I hope I'm just being pessimistic.

treyd 2y ago
I've more recently found that "laypeople" really do care about their privacy and but are unaware about what data it's possible for corporations to collect. They do rightfully uncomfortable when they have their questions answered, but feel powerless to be able to do anything about it.
- imiric 2y ago
  That hasn't been my experience. Maybe that was the case 10+ years ago, but most people these days understand what they're giving up when using these services. The argument then becomes "I have nothing to hide", "I only use it occasionally", "What's the worst that could happen?", etc. It all boils down to them valuing the experience they're getting over their privacy. I've had these conversations with both technical and nontechnical people, and in nearly all cases I've had to argue in favor of privacy. I've yet to convince anyone to change their habits. I share and empathize with the feeling of powerlessness, but most people will choose convenience, user experience, etc. over privacy, even when there are reasonable alternatives. Hell, I will sacrifice my own privacy if a service is indispensable and there's no alternative. We can't expect people who value it less to do otherwise.
- Arch-TK 2y ago
  In my experience, trying to tell an average person the kinds of things that companies can do with their data, which the companies themselves have admitted to and written into privacy policies, just gets you labelled as a conspiracy theorist. The things companies can, will and promise to do with your data are sometimes so far fetched that people assume they're impossible. At least this was the case 5 years ago, haven't tried persuading anyone in recent years.