3 ms·

Actually, implementing vector layers and a shape tool is my next planned project after 3.0, so we'll hopefully get that first. :) I've worked on 21+ year old i

Actually, implementing vector layers and a shape tool is my next planned project after 3.0, so we'll hopefully get that first. :) I've worked on 21+ year old issues, so I'm well aware of longstanding requests. For instance, I helped to implement built-in editable text outline options - another commonly searched for question about GIMP. The time we spent on that could have been spent on a number of other issues, and fixing each of those issues would have saved time for some users and annoyed others who'd prefer we'd work on something else. Feedback from more users is always good, and I have watched Photoshop users work with GIMP. The immediate sticking points from those people were multi-selection, NDE, and a full CMYK mode - the text tool wasn't as big of a deal to those particular users as it is for you. That doesn't mean we don't want to make the UX better there, just that certain features are not equally important to everyone.

James_K 2y ago
And it's great that you're doing that, but what if you get hit by a bus? Does the issue just go back into the "never gonna happen" bin? Why do you think it took 20 years to get started on implementing this, and what have you done to ensure that won't happen again? Also, you should implement a raster shape tool before you try to implement a vector one. You'll get the feature out much faster that way.
- asddubs 2y ago
  This comment strikes me as non-constructive. What do you actually want this person to do? Clone themselves? Yes, gimp needs more people working on it to get features out faster. Berating the people actually doing the work until they also quit is certainly not helping
  - James_K 2y ago
    Well there are other people working on GIMP. Perhaps someone should look into what they've been doing for the past 20 years. It seems fairly unlikely to me that they didn't have time to do this, so there must be some other cause to the problem which it might be possible to address. And if the problem has already been solved, it might be good to know how that happened to avoid regressing back to the old state. I think it's productive to try and diagnose the cause of issues like this.
    - asddubs 2y ago
      "Perhaps someone should audit these volunteers working on a project for free" It's always easy to handwave away any complexities in a project you know nothing about. It'd be one thing if you had concrete criticisms rather than just going in circles about how you're generally unhappy to an overly patient volunteer, but if your only suggestion is "someone should figure out what's going on", you might as well say nothing.
      - James_K 2y ago
        I think they would be happy to participate in some kind of audit. They surely want to organise their contributions in such a way as to produce the most benefit to the project. As for suggesting someone figure it out, I don't know why it happens and I would like to know. This is why I ask. I think knowing could benefit others and potentially also benefit me.
- cmyk_student 2y ago
  I imagine another volunteer would come along, just like I did. That's the nature of an open source community project. Since I started, I've seen more developers join and work on their niche (building pipelines, text tool, plug-ins, etc). I know that one of the behind-the-scenes things that Jehan (the maintainer) has been working on is establishing a foundation in partnership with GNOME. This will allow for easier methods of accepting donations, and developer grants to fund more sustained developer work. That obviously takes away from his coding time (and he's a much, much better programmer than I am!), but long term it will be very beneficial. Part of the GIMP 3.0 delay is due to those kinds of set-up work, where it's not immediately visible but will speed up future development. For the shape tool, I think it'll be fairly quick once vector layers are implemented. At a high level, we'd just need to have some predefined vector layer shapes that users could manipulate. The functionality is there (one example: https://fosstodon.org/@CmykStudent/112063520232390856 https://fosstodon.org/@CmykStudent/112063520232390856), the UI would be the sticking point.
  - James_K 2y ago
    A foundation definitely seems like a solution here. It worked well for Blender. I just wonder if such a central organisation is truly necessary. Perhaps block-chain is the solution. /s At any rate, I'm glad to see GIMP is starting to take it's role as the flagship of FOSS more seriously.

James_K 2y ago

And it's great that you're doing that, but what if you get hit by a bus? Does the issue just go back into the "never gonna happen" bin? Why do you think it took 20 years to get started on implementing this, and what have you done to ensure that won't happen again? Also, you should implement a raster shape tool before you try to implement a vector one. You'll get the feature out much faster that way.

asddubs 2y ago
This comment strikes me as non-constructive. What do you actually want this person to do? Clone themselves? Yes, gimp needs more people working on it to get features out faster. Berating the people actually doing the work until they also quit is certainly not helping
- James_K 2y ago
  Well there are other people working on GIMP. Perhaps someone should look into what they've been doing for the past 20 years. It seems fairly unlikely to me that they didn't have time to do this, so there must be some other cause to the problem which it might be possible to address. And if the problem has already been solved, it might be good to know how that happened to avoid regressing back to the old state. I think it's productive to try and diagnose the cause of issues like this.
  - asddubs 2y ago
    "Perhaps someone should audit these volunteers working on a project for free" It's always easy to handwave away any complexities in a project you know nothing about. It'd be one thing if you had concrete criticisms rather than just going in circles about how you're generally unhappy to an overly patient volunteer, but if your only suggestion is "someone should figure out what's going on", you might as well say nothing.
    - James_K 2y ago
      I think they would be happy to participate in some kind of audit. They surely want to organise their contributions in such a way as to produce the most benefit to the project. As for suggesting someone figure it out, I don't know why it happens and I would like to know. This is why I ask. I think knowing could benefit others and potentially also benefit me.
cmyk_student 2y ago
I imagine another volunteer would come along, just like I did. That's the nature of an open source community project. Since I started, I've seen more developers join and work on their niche (building pipelines, text tool, plug-ins, etc). I know that one of the behind-the-scenes things that Jehan (the maintainer) has been working on is establishing a foundation in partnership with GNOME. This will allow for easier methods of accepting donations, and developer grants to fund more sustained developer work. That obviously takes away from his coding time (and he's a much, much better programmer than I am!), but long term it will be very beneficial. Part of the GIMP 3.0 delay is due to those kinds of set-up work, where it's not immediately visible but will speed up future development. For the shape tool, I think it'll be fairly quick once vector layers are implemented. At a high level, we'd just need to have some predefined vector layer shapes that users could manipulate. The functionality is there (one example: https://fosstodon.org/@CmykStudent/112063520232390856 https://fosstodon.org/@CmykStudent/112063520232390856), the UI would be the sticking point.
- James_K 2y ago
  A foundation definitely seems like a solution here. It worked well for Blender. I just wonder if such a central organisation is truly necessary. Perhaps block-chain is the solution. /s At any rate, I'm glad to see GIMP is starting to take it's role as the flagship of FOSS more seriously.