4 ms·

This has been bothering me as well. HN has gotten into a habit of shitting all over new ideas, innovations and technology start-ups. It's not just android or iO

by prayag 14y ago

This has been bothering me as well. HN has gotten into a habit of shitting all over new ideas, innovations and technology start-ups. It's not just android or iOS, nor is it about taking VC money or not. It's about trying to do something different and showing promise. If you do that a large part of HN community will just shit all over you. This is very different from the community a few years or even a few months ago. These people are trying to disrupt a market that solely belongs to big players (MS, Sony and Nintendo), shouldn't we be happy that a smaller player is trying to enter the tough market. That deserves some applause and a pat on the back, doesn't it?

mindstab 14y ago
I agree wholeheartedly and that's why I was so shocked and sad and dismayed to read the comment thread here. It seems like the spirit of HN is drying up and dying. :( Community growth is hard to manage and HN has done amazingly well avoiding previous pitfalls like falling to trolls but now it looks like something new and more subtle is befalling it. :/
- alttab 14y ago
  I agree and disagree. First, the original thread was overtly negative and that surprised me. I even commented in that thread saying as much. Generally, I think the HN community got that one wrong, and its obvious too because they got $1million in less than 24 hours which is more than anyone can say for half the projects that get posted here. And on that note, the negativity, it seems to me, is largely due to the ballooning of this community and a bunch of half-baked, unoriginal, crowded-market ideas with uninspired product designs being posted. It seems everyone thinks that just because they use NodeJS, mustache, coffeescript and want to take a bottom-up approach to X for Y and apply to YC that makes them an entrepreneur. While these people are embarking on a learning process a "black cup of coffee" never hurt anyone.
  - prayag 14y ago
    > is largely due to the ballooning of this community and a bunch of half-baked, unoriginal, crowded-market ideas with uninspired product designs being posted. It seems everyone thinks that just because they use NodeJS, mustache, coffeescript and want to take a bottom-up approach to X for Y and apply to YC that makes them an entrepreneur. But what's wrong with that? If this doesn't make them an entrepreneur what does? There is no magic to becoming an entrepreneur. It's not an elite group of people who have to pass a trial by fire. Everyone who wants to change things can be an entrepreneur. Anyone with a project and who big dreams for the project.It doesn't require a college degree, any connections or any credentials. If anyone comes to me and tells me he is an entrepreneur I expect myself to be supportive. It's hard to do this and if we don't support each other who will?
    - alttab 14y ago
      Honest criticism is supporting. People don't come to HN for positive feedback only. Their users certainly won't be so nice. Shitting on half baked ideas in my mind is a public service. I'm saying that it isn't negative, and that saying "looks cool" and "keep up the Great work" isn't nearly as helpful as "I would never use much less pay for this and here is why". My point is that if people think constructive feedback is negative and they get butt hurt over their poorly received Show HN post, they probably aren't fit for entrepreneurial endeavors. That's all.... Just man up.
      - prayag 14y ago
        > My point is that if people think constructive feedback is negative and they get butt hurt over their poorly received Show HN post, they probably aren't fit for entrepreneurial endeavors. Constructive criticism is fair but most of the comments are straight on aggressive and in most cases not greatly useful or constructive. Many of them are pedantic. In fact, in my opinion most insightful comments are almost always the comments that don't paint the picture in black and white and take everything into consideration. It's almost obvious if you think of it. The smartest people understand and deal with nuances. > Just man up. While this is true and most people should not take the a stranger on the internet too seriously. However, what most entrepreneurs do is hard. Trying to change the way things work. Most people give it all they have and still fail. What is wrong with being a little supportive? Why not help out a fellow hacker/entrepreneur/community member? Criticism and friendliness are not mutually exclusive.
johnrob 14y ago
I've noticed this trend as well. It's hard to miss for anyone who's lurked here longer than two years. That said, I think I know what the culprit is: money. Check out the headlines on the front page. How many titles contain a '$'? Yesterday I saw some big numbers: 100M for github, 20M for stripe, 10M for someone else, plus kayak IPO numbers. Today we've got kickstarter. As a community, we've become obsessed with money. Bootstrapping revenue, angel rounds, VC funding, acquisitions, IPOs, croudfunding, etc. When people focus on money they get upset. There are a myriad of reasons for this, but the quick version is that it's human nature and basically unavoidable. So, in short: we think too much about money, and as a consequence we're grumpy.
- andreyf 14y ago
  I also noticed the slew of $$$-related articles lately. I wonder if that's just a coincidence or a real trend.
  - johnrob 14y ago
    Number of startups is way up, number of financial events is up, number of links on the home page is still 30 ;)
    - georgespencer 14y ago
      I think the point is that because the number of startups & startup-related financial events are higher, those 30 stories contain more startup-related financial event stories than previously.
      - shasta 14y ago
        What's the difference between your post and its parent?
        georgespencer 14y ago
        OP (parent's parent) suggested that there are more startups now and therefore more startup finance stories as a result. Parent suggested that despite this there are only ever thirty articles on the front page at a time, so we shouldn't see more finance ones. I pointed out that this just means that the ratio of finance stories within that thirty is likely to be higher.
Tsagadai 14y ago
I think there is an increasing number of people here who have either stopped thinking big or never started. Disruption is becoming just a business meme like synergy and teamwork. Some people fear change and while the community here seems to embrace change there are many who are really, really scared by the idea of their world shifting. Kickstarter is a great place to raise some money for an interesting project. Get a couple of like minded hackers on side, write a decent proposal and demo a product and you too can get a cool million. I'm sure that is terrifying for a lot of people here. They are afraid because its a threat to their dreams of making it or the way they 'made it'. They are afraid because they don't have any ideas. They are afraid because they have a choice. I love the little guys who are trying to upset the big players. I genuinely adore some of the players out there at the moment who are thinking big and trying to do or make wholly new things. It's fantastic to see that sort of creativity finally getting attention and funding. But I don't think everyone shares my enthusiasm. I think some people are just pretending and playing at being the type of person they wish they were.

by prayag 14y ago

mindstab 14y ago

I agree wholeheartedly and that's why I was so shocked and sad and dismayed to read the comment thread here. It seems like the spirit of HN is drying up and dying. :( Community growth is hard to manage and HN has done amazingly well avoiding previous pitfalls like falling to trolls but now it looks like something new and more subtle is befalling it. :/

alttab 14y ago
I agree and disagree. First, the original thread was overtly negative and that surprised me. I even commented in that thread saying as much. Generally, I think the HN community got that one wrong, and its obvious too because they got $1million in less than 24 hours which is more than anyone can say for half the projects that get posted here. And on that note, the negativity, it seems to me, is largely due to the ballooning of this community and a bunch of half-baked, unoriginal, crowded-market ideas with uninspired product designs being posted. It seems everyone thinks that just because they use NodeJS, mustache, coffeescript and want to take a bottom-up approach to X for Y and apply to YC that makes them an entrepreneur. While these people are embarking on a learning process a "black cup of coffee" never hurt anyone.
- prayag 14y ago
  > is largely due to the ballooning of this community and a bunch of half-baked, unoriginal, crowded-market ideas with uninspired product designs being posted. It seems everyone thinks that just because they use NodeJS, mustache, coffeescript and want to take a bottom-up approach to X for Y and apply to YC that makes them an entrepreneur. But what's wrong with that? If this doesn't make them an entrepreneur what does? There is no magic to becoming an entrepreneur. It's not an elite group of people who have to pass a trial by fire. Everyone who wants to change things can be an entrepreneur. Anyone with a project and who big dreams for the project.It doesn't require a college degree, any connections or any credentials. If anyone comes to me and tells me he is an entrepreneur I expect myself to be supportive. It's hard to do this and if we don't support each other who will?
  - alttab 14y ago
    Honest criticism is supporting. People don't come to HN for positive feedback only. Their users certainly won't be so nice. Shitting on half baked ideas in my mind is a public service. I'm saying that it isn't negative, and that saying "looks cool" and "keep up the Great work" isn't nearly as helpful as "I would never use much less pay for this and here is why". My point is that if people think constructive feedback is negative and they get butt hurt over their poorly received Show HN post, they probably aren't fit for entrepreneurial endeavors. That's all.... Just man up.
    - prayag 14y ago
      > My point is that if people think constructive feedback is negative and they get butt hurt over their poorly received Show HN post, they probably aren't fit for entrepreneurial endeavors. Constructive criticism is fair but most of the comments are straight on aggressive and in most cases not greatly useful or constructive. Many of them are pedantic. In fact, in my opinion most insightful comments are almost always the comments that don't paint the picture in black and white and take everything into consideration. It's almost obvious if you think of it. The smartest people understand and deal with nuances. > Just man up. While this is true and most people should not take the a stranger on the internet too seriously. However, what most entrepreneurs do is hard. Trying to change the way things work. Most people give it all they have and still fail. What is wrong with being a little supportive? Why not help out a fellow hacker/entrepreneur/community member? Criticism and friendliness are not mutually exclusive.

johnrob 14y ago

I've noticed this trend as well. It's hard to miss for anyone who's lurked here longer than two years. That said, I think I know what the culprit is: money. Check out the headlines on the front page. How many titles contain a '$'? Yesterday I saw some big numbers: 100M for github, 20M for stripe, 10M for someone else, plus kayak IPO numbers. Today we've got kickstarter. As a community, we've become obsessed with money. Bootstrapping revenue, angel rounds, VC funding, acquisitions, IPOs, croudfunding, etc. When people focus on money they get upset. There are a myriad of reasons for this, but the quick version is that it's human nature and basically unavoidable. So, in short: we think too much about money, and as a consequence we're grumpy.

andreyf 14y ago
I also noticed the slew of $$$-related articles lately. I wonder if that's just a coincidence or a real trend.
- johnrob 14y ago
  Number of startups is way up, number of financial events is up, number of links on the home page is still 30 ;)
  - georgespencer 14y ago
    I think the point is that because the number of startups & startup-related financial events are higher, those 30 stories contain more startup-related financial event stories than previously.
    - shasta 14y ago
      What's the difference between your post and its parent?
      - georgespencer 14y ago
        OP (parent's parent) suggested that there are more startups now and therefore more startup finance stories as a result. Parent suggested that despite this there are only ever thirty articles on the front page at a time, so we shouldn't see more finance ones. I pointed out that this just means that the ratio of finance stories within that thirty is likely to be higher.

Tsagadai 14y ago

I think there is an increasing number of people here who have either stopped thinking big or never started. Disruption is becoming just a business meme like synergy and teamwork. Some people fear change and while the community here seems to embrace change there are many who are really, really scared by the idea of their world shifting. Kickstarter is a great place to raise some money for an interesting project. Get a couple of like minded hackers on side, write a decent proposal and demo a product and you too can get a cool million. I'm sure that is terrifying for a lot of people here. They are afraid because its a threat to their dreams of making it or the way they 'made it'. They are afraid because they don't have any ideas. They are afraid because they have a choice. I love the little guys who are trying to upset the big players. I genuinely adore some of the players out there at the moment who are thinking big and trying to do or make wholly new things. It's fantastic to see that sort of creativity finally getting attention and funding. But I don't think everyone shares my enthusiasm. I think some people are just pretending and playing at being the type of person they wish they were.