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“Hundreds of artists provide unpaid labor through bug testing, feedback and experimental work for the program for a $150B valued company” This is a hilarious b
by aabhay 2y ago
“Hundreds of artists provide unpaid labor through bug testing, feedback and experimental work for the program for a $150B valued company”
This is a hilarious basis for protest
- dyauspitr 2y agoSo stupid. I realize artists are panicking but this angle just makes them look like Luddite villains.
- willio58 2y agoI highly recommend reading about luddites! This Smithsonian article covers the topic well: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/what-the-luddites-really-fought-against-264412/ https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/what-the-luddites-rea... Basically luddites were never the bad ones, they were protestors against abusive working conditions. They did sabotage the owners of the mills that paid them so poorly, sometimes by destroying machinery, but it was really an underground labor movement that’s super cool to learn about.
- CamperBob2 2y agoNo, there was nothing "super cool" about the Luddites. Stop trying to rehabilitate these thugs. Failing that, do it someplace other than a site called "Hacker News."
- yyuugg 2y agoLuddites were highly educated, skilled workers whose work was being replaced by machines. They just wanted to operate the machines and share in the increased productivity. There's absolutely no parallels here, to AI. A machine that is taking work from highly skilled labor ohhhh wait
- pineaux 2y ago[flagged]
- CamperBob2 2y agoIf a machine can take your work, perhaps you weren't as "highly skilled" as you thought you were.
- yyuugg 2y ago[dead]
- dyauspitr 2y agoSounds like your idea of a machine is a little outdated.
- CamperBob2 2y agoOr your idea of a human being. We're primates that make and use tools. AI is a tool, so we'll make it and use it. What we won't do is compete with it. We have better things to do.
- weweersdfsd 2y agoThere's nothing wrong with resisting bad working conditions, unfair pay, or getting replaced by a machine without adequate social safety nets in place. If businesses decide to replace workers with AI, then it's also their collective responsibility to pay for their retraining, or if that isn't possible their social security.
- HPsquared 2y agoSurely the morality depends on how they go about their protest.
- sensanaty 2y agoThe Luddite "thugs" were the ones that were getting murdered by the people they were protesting against, a protest which happened because they were about to be replaced while already working in extremely dangerous conditions with terrible compensation. It's telling that the AI sycophants side with the group that was actually murdering people, however.
- CamperBob2 2y agoa protest which happened because they were about to be replaced while already working in extremely dangerous conditions with terrible compensation. Gee. Being "replaced" in a job like that sounds like a good career move to me. The system that prevailed up to that point didn't give them many options, of course... but neither would their response to it. Sabotage doesn't bring progress, no matter who told you that it did, or how much you want to believe it.
- willio58 2y agoAgain I really hope you read about the luddites rather than draw conclusions from surface-level observations of them. Not only were they essentially one of the first organized labor protestors, they also protested against the poor quality of the products made by the machines. This is why they were extremely popular among most people who lived during this time, and would be sheltered by people unrelated to the workers of the mills. Someone who made quality garments for their town was put out of business by a mill mass-producing terrible quality products. It’s almost the first echoes of what we see coming over from Amazon/Temu now.
- whamlastxmas 2y agoPart of the hacker ethos is being counter to mainstream and challenging authority. Luddites fit in with that perfectly.
- CamperBob2 2y agoTaking out your frustrations on the hardware isn't part of any hacker ethos I'm familiar with. I guess times have changed.
- willio58 2y agoIf you think the luddites were attacking the hardware because they were afraid of technology you’re mistaken. Please read the article I linked, it explains how the luddites’ motives are completely misunderstood by most people. This misunderstanding is furthered by people using the term Luddite as a pejorative. But this is somewhat like using the term “Black Panther” as a pejorative.
- atoav 2y agoOr like cool activists that made a stupid-but-rich corp accept them despite their obvious activist goals — who knows. You assume they changed their mind, there is no data point for that as of now.
- Blahah 2y agoUnless they volunteered precisely so that they would have early access and could leak it, which would be sensible.
- pineaux 2y agoWhich is what they did. So openAI was tricked, boohoo. Should be applauded here on h@x0rn3wz
- hulitu 2y ago> > unpaid labor through bug testing, feedback and experimental work for the program for a $150B valued company” > This is a hilarious basis for protest Of course. Every CEO works for free these days. /s
- esperent 2y agoA huge company is using unpaid artist's labour to create tools that will reduce the potential for these and all future artists to get any paid work at all in the future. It seems like signing up as the volunteer with the goal of derailing the company as much as possible is a highly valid form of ptotest.
- Ratelman 2y agoThere are better ways to protest than violating a legally binding agreement - seems more like an emotional reaction than a properly thought through protest.
- bryant 2y agoIn fairness, some of the most effective protests have gone much further than that — they've broken laws. (See basically every civil rights protest) Breaking contracts seems tame by comparison.
- Ratelman 2y agoFair point - and I suppose we are on HACKERnews - and they are OPENAI, so helping them be more open is an effective form of protest.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- Retr0id 2y agoThe most effective forms of protest usually are illegal
- Ratelman 2y agoTrue, true - didn't think that one through
- HPsquared 2y agoIt's risky though, if the protest is annoying or damaging enough (antisocial behaviour basically) it can actively turn people away from your position. As in "Oh these are a bunch of insane/evil/violent etc people and that type of person tends to have this type of view, I as a good person do not have these kinds of views"
- yyuugg 2y ago"We are doing labor, and are not being fairly compensated for our labor" is a hilarious basis? How so?
- andersa 2y agoThey are free to stop doing it for free? I don't understand.
- yyuugg 2y agoMaybe they object to the idea that anyone's labor should be used, for free, to enrich the wealthy. I don't think that's a terrible stance to have, abstractly. I dunno if that was the case here.
- moi2388 2y agoThen they simply should not have opted in. I didn’t?
- esperent 2y agoThey opted in with the express purpose of protesting, it seems.
- rat9988 2y agoYou mean sabotaging.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- meheleventyone 2y agoSomeone linked the actual open letter above: https://huggingface.co/spaces/PR-Puppets/PR-Puppet-Sora https://huggingface.co/spaces/PR-Puppets/PR-Puppet-Sora If you read it they state quite clearly that they feel like their participation was different than they expected it to be and that's why they are upset.
- yread 2y agoYeah, hilarious. Now lets go back to working on open source so that corporations can use it and openai can train on it
- pineaux 2y agoHilariously correct you mean?
- benreesman 2y agoA lot of people refused to hang out with Diddy even if they could put their finger on exactly why. I know more than most, but the sexual assault allegations and shady restructuring and abuse of the the political process and the multiple firings for financial fraud and, well a lot of stuff, that’s all public record. Matt Gaetz got run out of DC for less.