6 ms·

DC Uber Amendment Shelved

99 points by esonderegger 14y ago

ChuckMcM 14y ago
Ah representative government in action, gotta love it.
- eli 14y ago
  The issue is that DC taxi drivers are actually a relatively important voting bloc. (I wish the DC Tech scene could get political support like that.) But it's also a bad time to go around picking fights. Support for local government is pretty low. Two DC Council members have been forced out of office in as many months due to legal problems (and, remarkably, neither of them was Marion Barry). Just this morning I heard on the radio that one of the mayor's aides was indicted for campaign finance fraud.
  - ChuckMcM 14y ago
    100% agree, the cab drivers want their legislation, Uber and the livery services want theirs, people talk, people argue, stories are presented, arguments are made, elected representatives weigh personal gain against public good against prior commitments. Its an amazingly convoluted interconnected and jumbled system, but when everyone is engaged its also rather beautiful.
    - Nrsolis 14y ago
      Uh, I used to live in the DC area so take this comment in that spirit: The Local DC City government is one of the most dysfunctional, corrupt, and ineffective local governments of a large metropolitan area. There is nothing pretty about how "governing" gets done in DC. Go take a taxi ride in DC and tell me about your experience. For grins, try and get a LEGAL taxi ride from Union Station at 2am that conforms to the taxi regulations. For bigger grins, try and get some action/resolution to the blatantly illegal behavior of taxi drivers from the Taxi Commission that was the subject of this whole effort. In DC, you really can't do better than the Taxi Commission as an example of regulatory capture.
      - ChuckMcM 14y ago
        I am aware as they say. I used to play a game with my kids (invented by a friend of mine) where we replaced the phrase 'The Government' with 'my neighbor', and 'our Government' with 'We'. We used to joke you get out of your government what you put in. So if your local government is corrupt and dysfunctional, then you don't have the best folks in place so you need to replace them. And replacing them requires that the community to engage. Its actually easier at the local level than the national level, and the national level draws from the local level. What most people don't understand is that you can often volunteer at your local government. You can be on commissions or focus groups or elsewhere. If you have the time it can be worthwhile, and with the right attitude, enjoyable. Don't try to fix everything at once, but just start making things better. The change can be remarkable, one person doing a standup job for 'free' can be a powerful motivation for a lot of people around them.
        Nrsolis 14y ago
        SO... We actually did try to fix the local government. We put Adrian Fenty in office and gave him free reign to get DC government working properly. Of course, when he tried to fix public education (via Michelle Rhee) he ran smack into the buzzsaw that was the teachers union that steadfastly refused to take any responsibility for actually teaching students. Now we have another set of bought-and-paid-for charlatans. Just like they want. And there's the rub really: if you come into government and try to actually change things, you're going to upset an entire class of people that benefit from things staying exactly as they are. In many cases, they outnumber you. They are organized around protecting the status quo. The idea that a single person can mobilize to change things is quaint but RARELY how you get real change. It takes a sustained effort, over many many years to change ANYTHING in government. As an example, only RECENTLY did they get actual METERS in the cabs in DC. Think about that. It took something like 10 years from start to finish to legislate meters in the taxis. When I was there, there was a minor scandal surounding taxi drivers bribing the vehicle inspectors with $100 bills in the ashtrays to pass the vehicles. Think about that. We had criminals serving on the police force. It's an entire city built on giving city jobs to people who vote in your candidate. Mr. Smith Goes to Washington is just a fantasy.
JPKab 14y ago
As an Uber rider in the DC area, I'm so happy this was defeated. It's a great service, and I think it will really end up benefiting taxi drivers at the expense of the taxi dispatch offices, which are terrible at their job due to their practice of dispatching drivers based on kickbacks rather than proximity to pick up.
tomjen3 14y ago
For now. They will no doubt try again tomorrow. On a personal note, shit like this is why I hate society.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
wavephorm 14y ago
Washington DC politicians are exposed as corrupt public figureheads representing a government-protected cartel of incumbent corporations? And this is news to some people?
compsciphd 14y ago
what I'm surprised about is that travelling in a lincoln town car is considered luxurious! This is the standard livery cab service in NYC (which is used a lot by people who aren't considered wealthy).
- untog 14y ago
  A town car in New York is considered luxurious when compared to a yellow cab, which is exactly the same arrangement as in DC.
  - Nrsolis 14y ago
    NO. I live in NYC now and the taxi service is WAY better than the service in DC. For one thing, if you make a complaint against a driver in NYC, there is going to be some action taken. Not so in DC. That said, I used Uber almost exclusively in both locations.
    - untog 14y ago
      I live in NYC too, and what you just said doesn't really relate to what I'm saying. A livery cab is luxurious when compared to a yellow cab, and commands a price accordingly.
      - Nrsolis 14y ago
        I think YOU are missing MY point; namely, that a taxi in NYC is WAY better than a taxi in DC. For one thing, a taxi in NYC is more likely to be safe, recently inspected, and driven by someone who fears retaliation from authorities if he breaks the rules. In DC, you're guaranteed almost the exact opposite. In NYC, Uber is a nice-to-have. In DC, Uber is almost your only option.
        JPKab 14y ago
        DC taxis are a nightmare. The funny part is the contrast that you can have when you take an Uber car to a destination and then hail a taxi to get back. When I cracked the back window in the taxi cab since he wasn't using his air conditioning, he promptly rolled it back up and locked the window. He said nothing. The price for the ride was actually more in the taxi, because he very sneakily took a longer route "by accident" by missing an exit for the quick route and then taking the next exit on the longer route.
guelo 14y ago
Sounds like Uber was up to shenanigans when they whipped up the internet rage machine. There was some conversation going on between Uber and Cheh, I don't think we're getting the full story here.
- SatvikBeri 14y ago
  Both Uber and Cheh say that there was some conversation. Cheh claims that Uber endorsed the $15 minimum, Uber says they never endorsed any sort of price-fixing. Given that this amendment would have severely hurt Uber, I'm definitely inclined to believe them over Cheh on this.
  - jbooth 14y ago
    It sounds from the article like Uber had a $15 minimum already. Now they're dropping it to $12, in "apparent defiance". Looks like 'earned media' to me, free mentions in the press for throwing a fit.
    - dljsjr 14y ago
      The thing is that the $15 minimum would have applied to all of the services that Uber offers, not just their town cars. This would have an impact on the rollout of UberX to the area, which has a minimum fare of $10. http://blog.uber.com/2012/07/03/sf-vehicle-choice/ http://blog.uber.com/2012/07/03/sf-vehicle-choice/
      - deleted 14y ago
        [deleted]
      - twelve45 14y ago
        Exactly. This was an attack on the new "Uber X" service which will more directly compete with regular cabs. (Frankly the only reason I even take cabs anymore is the cost of the regular Uber service.)
    - imgabe 14y ago
jacoblyles 14y ago
It's nice to win the battle, but the war of over regulation and crony capitalism is far from over. We need to elect representatives that understand that markets work, that change is good, and that not every existing interest should be protected by the government for eternity.
- noarchy 14y ago
  I cheer for that possibility, but the outlook is gloomy. The taxi industry is so heavily regulated in many major cities, that they might as well make the drivers government employees. The supply of medallions/plates are very limited (drivers don't even own the car, in many cases, having to lease from one of the cartel members that have a medallion), and they often can't set their own fares. It has to be one of the least-free markets in North America.

99 points by esonderegger 14y ago

ChuckMcM 14y ago

Ah representative government in action, gotta love it.

eli 14y ago
The issue is that DC taxi drivers are actually a relatively important voting bloc. (I wish the DC Tech scene could get political support like that.) But it's also a bad time to go around picking fights. Support for local government is pretty low. Two DC Council members have been forced out of office in as many months due to legal problems (and, remarkably, neither of them was Marion Barry). Just this morning I heard on the radio that one of the mayor's aides was indicted for campaign finance fraud.
- ChuckMcM 14y ago
  100% agree, the cab drivers want their legislation, Uber and the livery services want theirs, people talk, people argue, stories are presented, arguments are made, elected representatives weigh personal gain against public good against prior commitments. Its an amazingly convoluted interconnected and jumbled system, but when everyone is engaged its also rather beautiful.
  - Nrsolis 14y ago
    Uh, I used to live in the DC area so take this comment in that spirit: The Local DC City government is one of the most dysfunctional, corrupt, and ineffective local governments of a large metropolitan area. There is nothing pretty about how "governing" gets done in DC. Go take a taxi ride in DC and tell me about your experience. For grins, try and get a LEGAL taxi ride from Union Station at 2am that conforms to the taxi regulations. For bigger grins, try and get some action/resolution to the blatantly illegal behavior of taxi drivers from the Taxi Commission that was the subject of this whole effort. In DC, you really can't do better than the Taxi Commission as an example of regulatory capture.
    - ChuckMcM 14y ago
      I am aware as they say. I used to play a game with my kids (invented by a friend of mine) where we replaced the phrase 'The Government' with 'my neighbor', and 'our Government' with 'We'. We used to joke you get out of your government what you put in. So if your local government is corrupt and dysfunctional, then you don't have the best folks in place so you need to replace them. And replacing them requires that the community to engage. Its actually easier at the local level than the national level, and the national level draws from the local level. What most people don't understand is that you can often volunteer at your local government. You can be on commissions or focus groups or elsewhere. If you have the time it can be worthwhile, and with the right attitude, enjoyable. Don't try to fix everything at once, but just start making things better. The change can be remarkable, one person doing a standup job for 'free' can be a powerful motivation for a lot of people around them.
      - Nrsolis 14y ago
        SO... We actually did try to fix the local government. We put Adrian Fenty in office and gave him free reign to get DC government working properly. Of course, when he tried to fix public education (via Michelle Rhee) he ran smack into the buzzsaw that was the teachers union that steadfastly refused to take any responsibility for actually teaching students. Now we have another set of bought-and-paid-for charlatans. Just like they want. And there's the rub really: if you come into government and try to actually change things, you're going to upset an entire class of people that benefit from things staying exactly as they are. In many cases, they outnumber you. They are organized around protecting the status quo. The idea that a single person can mobilize to change things is quaint but RARELY how you get real change. It takes a sustained effort, over many many years to change ANYTHING in government. As an example, only RECENTLY did they get actual METERS in the cabs in DC. Think about that. It took something like 10 years from start to finish to legislate meters in the taxis. When I was there, there was a minor scandal surounding taxi drivers bribing the vehicle inspectors with $100 bills in the ashtrays to pass the vehicles. Think about that. We had criminals serving on the police force. It's an entire city built on giving city jobs to people who vote in your candidate. Mr. Smith Goes to Washington is just a fantasy.

JPKab 14y ago

As an Uber rider in the DC area, I'm so happy this was defeated. It's a great service, and I think it will really end up benefiting taxi drivers at the expense of the taxi dispatch offices, which are terrible at their job due to their practice of dispatching drivers based on kickbacks rather than proximity to pick up.

tomjen3 14y ago

For now. They will no doubt try again tomorrow. On a personal note, shit like this is why I hate society.

deleted 14y ago
[deleted]

wavephorm 14y ago

Washington DC politicians are exposed as corrupt public figureheads representing a government-protected cartel of incumbent corporations? And this is news to some people?

compsciphd 14y ago

what I'm surprised about is that travelling in a lincoln town car is considered luxurious! This is the standard livery cab service in NYC (which is used a lot by people who aren't considered wealthy).

untog 14y ago
A town car in New York is considered luxurious when compared to a yellow cab, which is exactly the same arrangement as in DC.
- Nrsolis 14y ago
  NO. I live in NYC now and the taxi service is WAY better than the service in DC. For one thing, if you make a complaint against a driver in NYC, there is going to be some action taken. Not so in DC. That said, I used Uber almost exclusively in both locations.
  - untog 14y ago
    I live in NYC too, and what you just said doesn't really relate to what I'm saying. A livery cab is luxurious when compared to a yellow cab, and commands a price accordingly.
    - Nrsolis 14y ago
      I think YOU are missing MY point; namely, that a taxi in NYC is WAY better than a taxi in DC. For one thing, a taxi in NYC is more likely to be safe, recently inspected, and driven by someone who fears retaliation from authorities if he breaks the rules. In DC, you're guaranteed almost the exact opposite. In NYC, Uber is a nice-to-have. In DC, Uber is almost your only option.
      - JPKab 14y ago
        DC taxis are a nightmare. The funny part is the contrast that you can have when you take an Uber car to a destination and then hail a taxi to get back. When I cracked the back window in the taxi cab since he wasn't using his air conditioning, he promptly rolled it back up and locked the window. He said nothing. The price for the ride was actually more in the taxi, because he very sneakily took a longer route "by accident" by missing an exit for the quick route and then taking the next exit on the longer route.

guelo 14y ago

Sounds like Uber was up to shenanigans when they whipped up the internet rage machine. There was some conversation going on between Uber and Cheh, I don't think we're getting the full story here.

SatvikBeri 14y ago
Both Uber and Cheh say that there was some conversation. Cheh claims that Uber endorsed the $15 minimum, Uber says they never endorsed any sort of price-fixing. Given that this amendment would have severely hurt Uber, I'm definitely inclined to believe them over Cheh on this.
- jbooth 14y ago
  It sounds from the article like Uber had a $15 minimum already. Now they're dropping it to $12, in "apparent defiance". Looks like 'earned media' to me, free mentions in the press for throwing a fit.
  - dljsjr 14y ago
    The thing is that the $15 minimum would have applied to all of the services that Uber offers, not just their town cars. This would have an impact on the rollout of UberX to the area, which has a minimum fare of $10. http://blog.uber.com/2012/07/03/sf-vehicle-choice/ http://blog.uber.com/2012/07/03/sf-vehicle-choice/
    - deleted 14y ago
      [deleted]
    - twelve45 14y ago
      Exactly. This was an attack on the new "Uber X" service which will more directly compete with regular cabs. (Frankly the only reason I even take cabs anymore is the cost of the regular Uber service.)
  - imgabe 14y ago

jacoblyles 14y ago

It's nice to win the battle, but the war of over regulation and crony capitalism is far from over. We need to elect representatives that understand that markets work, that change is good, and that not every existing interest should be protected by the government for eternity.

noarchy 14y ago
I cheer for that possibility, but the outlook is gloomy. The taxi industry is so heavily regulated in many major cities, that they might as well make the drivers government employees. The supply of medallions/plates are very limited (drivers don't even own the car, in many cases, having to lease from one of the cartel members that have a medallion), and they often can't set their own fares. It has to be one of the least-free markets in North America.