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I don’t think that LibreOffice not being in the browser is necessarily a blocker in itself. For something like an advanced office suite, where you don’t want to

I don’t think that LibreOffice not being in the browser is necessarily a blocker in itself. For something like an advanced office suite, where you don’t want to have browser toolbars/tabs/etc eating up valuable screen space that could be going to app palettes and such instead, not being chained to a browser is a boon. Besides that, when software serves a purpose well, people do not hesitate to download and install it. If need to install an app causes significant user dropoff, I’d say that’s an indictment of the app’s functionality/UX/etc. It basically means that the value the app provides isn’t worth an extremely minor one-time inconvenience, which is a pretty low bar to clear.

dangus 2y ago
Huge problem. How do I view a document on my phone with LibreOffice? How do I show my document to a client with an unknown different environment? The web is universal. I’m pretty sure half of all Internet traffic is on phones. Just look at the kind of business Google Workspaces and Office 365 are doing. Heck, LibreOffice has an OSS competitor on the web with OnlyOffice.
- cosmic_cheese 2y ago
  By installing the corresponding mobile apps. If access without a dedicated app is important, export a PDF. I really don’t like treating web access as a requirement if only because it adds enormous complexity to an already-complex project and brings much higher recurring expenses to keep the hosted service online. Neither are conducive to a free product that’s so highly reliant on volunteered time and donations. Web apps work best as closed, paid SaaSes funded by VCs, where complexity and overhead can be papered over by money.
  - dangus 2y ago
    I think this view that web apps are unnecessary is really naive to the way that people prefer to work in the modern world. Google's office suite commands a 44% marketshare and is essentially a web-only platform on desktops. If you haven't been paying attention, yes, that means it has surpassed Office 365 in marketshare. The market spoke loudly about how it wants to work when Google took the #1 spot away from Microsoft by making documents accessible and simple to anyone with a web browser. Online documents are a liberating experience where the benefits are obvious. There's no more losing files and forgetting to save, no more passing files back and forth, no more worries about multiple devices. Online document editing "just works" Someone who wants to use LibreOffice in a modern way like this is just SOL. Someone who doesn't own a desktop computer can't use it. Tablet and smartphone users are stuck with a third party solution that utilizes the codebase but isn't really LibreOffice, and it's a 3 star-reviewed app with the top review complaining about how easy it is to permanently lose work. Web apps are all over the open source ecosystem. They aren't just reserved for big money VCs. I would argue that LibreOffice's own history was made possible by sponsorship by a very big company (Oracle) and that OnlyOffice being developed by a rather small company pokes a big hole in the idea that web apps work best aas closed paid SaaS products. Obviously, OnlyOffice is able to be a sustainable business while offering a compelling self-hosted community solution. I also think of Bitwarden as a success story for making modern web and desktop software that is both fully open source and hosted in the cloud in a way that makes it easy for users. I personally think that the document foundation just "doesn't get it" and isn't really prioritizing giving LibreOffice the modern overhaul it desperately needs. OnlyOffice is what LibreOffice would look like if The Document Foundation had their priorities straight.
    - cosmic_cheese 2y ago
      People may value the online aspect of GSuite, but the big brand name recognition along with being associated with Gmail (which was already beloved by then) probably did a lot of heavy lifting in its rise to prominence. Most cross platform MS Office competitors were made by companies that were comparatively nobodies and had no successes on the scale of Gmail under their belt.
      - dangus 2y ago
        I don’t think GSuite would have gotten half as much adoption as it had if it was a free downloaded app. Being in the web was a huge part of the appeal.
chris_wot 2y ago
Collabora actually have made massive strides in getting LibreOffice onto the web.
- dangus 2y ago
  Of course if we are going to talk about products made by for-profit companies it has to be pointed out that OnlyOffice can be self-hosted and integrated with NextCloud. And OnlyOffice has a much more appealing UI. Basically, OnlyOffice is doing what I think LibreOffice should be doing, which is prioritizing the modern web and mobile app workflow.

dangus 2y ago

Huge problem. How do I view a document on my phone with LibreOffice? How do I show my document to a client with an unknown different environment? The web is universal. I’m pretty sure half of all Internet traffic is on phones. Just look at the kind of business Google Workspaces and Office 365 are doing. Heck, LibreOffice has an OSS competitor on the web with OnlyOffice.

cosmic_cheese 2y ago
By installing the corresponding mobile apps. If access without a dedicated app is important, export a PDF. I really don’t like treating web access as a requirement if only because it adds enormous complexity to an already-complex project and brings much higher recurring expenses to keep the hosted service online. Neither are conducive to a free product that’s so highly reliant on volunteered time and donations. Web apps work best as closed, paid SaaSes funded by VCs, where complexity and overhead can be papered over by money.
- dangus 2y ago
  I think this view that web apps are unnecessary is really naive to the way that people prefer to work in the modern world. Google's office suite commands a 44% marketshare and is essentially a web-only platform on desktops. If you haven't been paying attention, yes, that means it has surpassed Office 365 in marketshare. The market spoke loudly about how it wants to work when Google took the #1 spot away from Microsoft by making documents accessible and simple to anyone with a web browser. Online documents are a liberating experience where the benefits are obvious. There's no more losing files and forgetting to save, no more passing files back and forth, no more worries about multiple devices. Online document editing "just works" Someone who wants to use LibreOffice in a modern way like this is just SOL. Someone who doesn't own a desktop computer can't use it. Tablet and smartphone users are stuck with a third party solution that utilizes the codebase but isn't really LibreOffice, and it's a 3 star-reviewed app with the top review complaining about how easy it is to permanently lose work. Web apps are all over the open source ecosystem. They aren't just reserved for big money VCs. I would argue that LibreOffice's own history was made possible by sponsorship by a very big company (Oracle) and that OnlyOffice being developed by a rather small company pokes a big hole in the idea that web apps work best aas closed paid SaaS products. Obviously, OnlyOffice is able to be a sustainable business while offering a compelling self-hosted community solution. I also think of Bitwarden as a success story for making modern web and desktop software that is both fully open source and hosted in the cloud in a way that makes it easy for users. I personally think that the document foundation just "doesn't get it" and isn't really prioritizing giving LibreOffice the modern overhaul it desperately needs. OnlyOffice is what LibreOffice would look like if The Document Foundation had their priorities straight.
  - cosmic_cheese 2y ago
    People may value the online aspect of GSuite, but the big brand name recognition along with being associated with Gmail (which was already beloved by then) probably did a lot of heavy lifting in its rise to prominence. Most cross platform MS Office competitors were made by companies that were comparatively nobodies and had no successes on the scale of Gmail under their belt.
    - dangus 2y ago
      I don’t think GSuite would have gotten half as much adoption as it had if it was a free downloaded app. Being in the web was a huge part of the appeal.

chris_wot 2y ago

Collabora actually have made massive strides in getting LibreOffice onto the web.

dangus 2y ago
Of course if we are going to talk about products made by for-profit companies it has to be pointed out that OnlyOffice can be self-hosted and integrated with NextCloud. And OnlyOffice has a much more appealing UI. Basically, OnlyOffice is doing what I think LibreOffice should be doing, which is prioritizing the modern web and mobile app workflow.