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Clear, correct, and unbiased information is what is needed. The CDC failed when they said it wasn’t airborne despite the evidence, they failed when they said ma

Clear, correct, and unbiased information is what is needed. The CDC failed when they said it wasn’t airborne despite the evidence, they failed when they said masks were not needed initially, because they were afraid of panic buying. The FDA screwed the pooch with testing. Many institutions could do tests, but the FDA wanted to maintain control and there process was flawed. Operation Warp speed got a vaccine, but it went from Sterilizing vaccine, to lessen symptoms and hospitalization. They failed to explain the difference between vaccine side effects and disease effects. Myocarditis? Could be a side effect of either. Perhaps they should have developed a test to determine which? They let an idiot spout nonsense on TV and no one on stage correct him or clarified, letting the issue become political. And have they really clarified what we are dealing with. A supposed respiratory virus that causes, myocarditis, neurological issues, stroke , blood clots , and multiple organ failures - is that really a respiratory virus. Then we’ve declared victory too soon. And everything has left a bad taste in our mouths, such that no one will accept a lockdown again unless the disease has a 20% mortality rate. Ebola could break out and some people would compare the bleeding to lots of paper cuts.

chasil 2y ago
Let us not forget the success of Sweden's approach. With a more broadly lethal virus, they would have fared badly, but with what happened, it appears correct. "...the Danish and Norwegian agencies were opposed to closing borders and schools, but political considerations trumped their concerns. Even in Britain, where the popular perception is that the government eventually agreed to a lockdown because scientific advisers called for it, it has been revealed that Prime Minister Boris Johnson’s powerful political adviser Dominic Cummings pressed the government’s independent scientific advisers to recommend faster and broader lockdown measures." https://www.cato.org/policy-analysis/sweden-during-pandemic# https://www.cato.org/policy-analysis/sweden-during-pandemic#
- chasil 2y ago
  We should also not forget that the public messaging is important. "Polls in March and April 2020 showed that more than 70 percent of Swedes trusted the public health agency and in January 2022, 68 percent did." "By early July 2020, Sweden had not suffered the 82,000 deaths that the models had assumed, but 5,455—less than 7 percent of what was predicted." On the other hand: "By July 1, 2020, Sweden had experienced 517 COVID-19 deaths per million people, which was lower than Italy and Spain but as much as 5 to 10 times higher than its geographically and culturally closest neighbors, Norway, Denmark, and Finland. This made Sweden’s approach to COVID-19 look like a fiasco." However: "Sweden’s excess death rate during the pandemic was 4.4 percent higher than previously. Compared to the data that other countries report to Eurostat, this is less than half of the average European level of 11.1 percent, and remarkably, it is the lowest excess mortality rate during the pandemic of all European countries, including Norway, Denmark, and Finland." "After all was said and done, astonishingly, Sweden had one of the lowest excess death rates of all European countries, and less than half that of the United States." "The world economy was 2.9 percent smaller after 2021 than it would have been according to the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development forecast before the pandemic; the Eurozone 2.1 was percent smaller, and the U.S. economy 1.2 percent smaller. The Swedish economy was 0.4 percent bigger. This is even more exceptional since the Swedish government introduced much less fiscal stimulus than most other countries." More importantly, general vaccine hesitance was averted: "In 2020 the Swedish childhood vaccination rate was 97.2—up by a tenth of a percentage point from the year before." "Sweden’s alternative model was to rely more on recommendations, have faith in voluntary adaptations to the pandemic, and try to keep as much of society up and running as possible. Based on what we now know, this laissez faire approach seems to have paid off."
  - ethbr1 2y ago
    It's an interesting confluence of choices and outcomes to be sure. A few points to add: - Poverty (economic shrinkage) also causes excess deaths - Herd immunity for a moderately lethal virus is very much a thing The issue at the beginning of the pandemic was... nobody knew how lethal COVID-19 was at population scale (or how lethal it might become). If it was less-lethal and wouldn't become more lethal, the winning move was to minimize restrictions, keep the economy humming, and be okay with many people getting infected quickly. If it was more-lethal or became more lethal, the above would leave a country fucked, with absolutely no way of reversing course short of a China style "everything stops" lockdown. Which would cause major economic pain and excess mortality as a consequence of that. So gambling with an entire country's population... which choice do you make? Impossible call to be "right" about.
ryandrake 2y ago
You’re right of course, but despite these many failures, our public health institutions are still more trustworthy and reliable than Cletus the high school dropout and Cathy the essential oils lady, whose cohort are back in charge for another four years. We are not going to get clear, correct information out of these guys.
- wombatpm 2y ago
  Cletus and Cathy can’t help us now, but Burks and Faucci were longtime ID specialists. Faucci lied, and Burks let herself be steamrolled.
  - ethbr1 2y ago
    It's interesting how in every "scientist wins and saves the day" movie or book, there's a neat deus ex machina that conveniently removes ignorant politicians from overriding them. ... in reality, ignorant politicians will override them, more often than not.

chasil 2y ago

Let us not forget the success of Sweden's approach. With a more broadly lethal virus, they would have fared badly, but with what happened, it appears correct. "...the Danish and Norwegian agencies were opposed to closing borders and schools, but political considerations trumped their concerns. Even in Britain, where the popular perception is that the government eventually agreed to a lockdown because scientific advisers called for it, it has been revealed that Prime Minister Boris Johnson’s powerful political adviser Dominic Cummings pressed the government’s independent scientific advisers to recommend faster and broader lockdown measures." https://www.cato.org/policy-analysis/sweden-during-pandemic# https://www.cato.org/policy-analysis/sweden-during-pandemic#

chasil 2y ago
We should also not forget that the public messaging is important. "Polls in March and April 2020 showed that more than 70 percent of Swedes trusted the public health agency and in January 2022, 68 percent did." "By early July 2020, Sweden had not suffered the 82,000 deaths that the models had assumed, but 5,455—less than 7 percent of what was predicted." On the other hand: "By July 1, 2020, Sweden had experienced 517 COVID-19 deaths per million people, which was lower than Italy and Spain but as much as 5 to 10 times higher than its geographically and culturally closest neighbors, Norway, Denmark, and Finland. This made Sweden’s approach to COVID-19 look like a fiasco." However: "Sweden’s excess death rate during the pandemic was 4.4 percent higher than previously. Compared to the data that other countries report to Eurostat, this is less than half of the average European level of 11.1 percent, and remarkably, it is the lowest excess mortality rate during the pandemic of all European countries, including Norway, Denmark, and Finland." "After all was said and done, astonishingly, Sweden had one of the lowest excess death rates of all European countries, and less than half that of the United States." "The world economy was 2.9 percent smaller after 2021 than it would have been according to the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development forecast before the pandemic; the Eurozone 2.1 was percent smaller, and the U.S. economy 1.2 percent smaller. The Swedish economy was 0.4 percent bigger. This is even more exceptional since the Swedish government introduced much less fiscal stimulus than most other countries." More importantly, general vaccine hesitance was averted: "In 2020 the Swedish childhood vaccination rate was 97.2—up by a tenth of a percentage point from the year before." "Sweden’s alternative model was to rely more on recommendations, have faith in voluntary adaptations to the pandemic, and try to keep as much of society up and running as possible. Based on what we now know, this laissez faire approach seems to have paid off."
- ethbr1 2y ago
  It's an interesting confluence of choices and outcomes to be sure. A few points to add: - Poverty (economic shrinkage) also causes excess deaths - Herd immunity for a moderately lethal virus is very much a thing The issue at the beginning of the pandemic was... nobody knew how lethal COVID-19 was at population scale (or how lethal it might become). If it was less-lethal and wouldn't become more lethal, the winning move was to minimize restrictions, keep the economy humming, and be okay with many people getting infected quickly. If it was more-lethal or became more lethal, the above would leave a country fucked, with absolutely no way of reversing course short of a China style "everything stops" lockdown. Which would cause major economic pain and excess mortality as a consequence of that. So gambling with an entire country's population... which choice do you make? Impossible call to be "right" about.

ryandrake 2y ago

You’re right of course, but despite these many failures, our public health institutions are still more trustworthy and reliable than Cletus the high school dropout and Cathy the essential oils lady, whose cohort are back in charge for another four years. We are not going to get clear, correct information out of these guys.

wombatpm 2y ago
Cletus and Cathy can’t help us now, but Burks and Faucci were longtime ID specialists. Faucci lied, and Burks let herself be steamrolled.
- ethbr1 2y ago
  It's interesting how in every "scientist wins and saves the day" movie or book, there's a neat deus ex machina that conveniently removes ignorant politicians from overriding them. ... in reality, ignorant politicians will override them, more often than not.