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>It’s also a result of German unions. I expect German politicians to defang the unions soon, similar to what they did with Agenda 2010 [1]. Yeah there will be

>It’s also a result of German unions. I expect German politicians to defang the unions soon, similar to what they did with Agenda 2010 [1]. Yeah there will be some strikes and riots, but if the unions are causing an industry to be uncompetitive they're causing more harm than good. It's a shame because while unions are good on paper, over time they seem to default to protecting themselves at the expense of the industry. Similar to communist parties. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agenda_2010 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agenda_2010

mmooss 2y ago
> protecting themselves at the expense of the industry Don't management and shareholders and finance do that? German car companies are among the most successful in the world - Germany and Japan sit at the pinnacle of car manufacturing.
- Cumpiler69 2y ago
  >German car companies are among the most successful in the world Nokia and Blackberry were also the most successful phone companies in the world till about 2007. Then they stopped. Similarly, there's no guarantee German companies can keep their positions for long with increased competition from US and Chinese companies.
  - ben_w 2y ago
    There's never any guarantees, of course, but on the basis of current events, there's no reason to expect a big shift on attitudes towards unions. Certainly the USA isn't going to be a relevant part of the discussion on this, as the only US brand I see enough to even notice here in Berlin is Tesla, and they have an actual factory just outside the city itself. China is a much more likely threat, as they are increasingly "the factory of the world", and their internal cars prices are wildly lower than even the cheapest (new) cars here[0], and their high-end stuff is also really impressive. (It may not surprise you to learn the EU has substantial tariffs on imported cars… but it was a big surprise to people in the UK who voted to leave the EU in the hope of boosting UK economic prospects). Increasing automation is also a bigger threat to unions than US imports, as that allows new firms that may never hire union workers in the first place. [0] https://electrek.co/2024/03/06/byd-launches-cheaper-seagull-ev-9700-price/ https://electrek.co/2024/03/06/byd-launches-cheaper-seagull-...

mmooss 2y ago

> protecting themselves at the expense of the industry Don't management and shareholders and finance do that? German car companies are among the most successful in the world - Germany and Japan sit at the pinnacle of car manufacturing.

Cumpiler69 2y ago
>German car companies are among the most successful in the world Nokia and Blackberry were also the most successful phone companies in the world till about 2007. Then they stopped. Similarly, there's no guarantee German companies can keep their positions for long with increased competition from US and Chinese companies.
- ben_w 2y ago
  There's never any guarantees, of course, but on the basis of current events, there's no reason to expect a big shift on attitudes towards unions. Certainly the USA isn't going to be a relevant part of the discussion on this, as the only US brand I see enough to even notice here in Berlin is Tesla, and they have an actual factory just outside the city itself. China is a much more likely threat, as they are increasingly "the factory of the world", and their internal cars prices are wildly lower than even the cheapest (new) cars here[0], and their high-end stuff is also really impressive. (It may not surprise you to learn the EU has substantial tariffs on imported cars… but it was a big surprise to people in the UK who voted to leave the EU in the hope of boosting UK economic prospects). Increasing automation is also a bigger threat to unions than US imports, as that allows new firms that may never hire union workers in the first place. [0] https://electrek.co/2024/03/06/byd-launches-cheaper-seagull-ev-9700-price/ https://electrek.co/2024/03/06/byd-launches-cheaper-seagull-...