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[flagged]

declan_roberts 2y ago
"Schools treat boys like they're malfunctioning girls, and girls like they're malfunctioning boys"
zifpanachr23 2y ago
I am seriously concerned about this same issue, but I think "psychological castration" is maybe being a bit hyperbolic w.r.t the long term effects of amphetamines at typically prescribed dosages.
- Der_Einzige 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - johnnyanmac 2y ago
    This is a very weird topic to bring up, but just using your logic: Democrats "want men back" and we do so by banning circumcision. But already democratic states in the west are where they stopped. So who's doing the circumcision again?
    - zifpanachr23 2y ago
      I don't know. I'm circumcised and I feel fine and I'm not particularly resentful about it. It's definitely weird though if you think about it too long. I just don't think it's got anything to do with much of.anything politically or socially or sexually or whatever.
      - Der_Einzige 2y ago
        Nope, no connection to bodily autonomy issues at all. Not related to tail docking, cat declawing, "my body my choice", or anything libertarian at all! Nope!
- Jensson 2y ago
  > but I think "psychological castration" is maybe being a bit hyperbolic w.r.t the long term effects of amphetamines at typically prescribed dosages. You see long term brain changes in kids who get prescribed Adderall, you don't see this for adults. Proponents tend to tout this as why we absolutely need to give this to kids, because they say this will permanently heal them, could just as well be permanently damaging them.
  - zifpanachr23 2y ago
    I can accept this. I just have a problem with the allusion to castration, which is a long term, irreversible, and immediately noticeable thing in the typical context that the word is used. I'm concerned about potential long term changes to the brain as well. I wouldn't call that necessarily catastrophically consequential on the level that castration would be though, on account of many other drugs also causing long term and potentially negative changes to the brain. I wouldn't compare underage drinking (known to potentially have long term consequences for the brain) to castration for instance, which is why I think doing the same for amphetamine use is hyperbolic.
- Aeglaecia 2y ago
  you would certainly have thought somehow differently if your thinking apparatus was consistently influenced by unnatural neurotransmitter concentration during its formation
  - johnnyanmac 2y ago
    I mean, you act like the alternative would make you a genius somehow. It's a suppressor, not something that fundamentally changes your entire disposition. That's why "castration" is a exaggeration. What's this utopic ideal you're being sealed from if you take something like adderall in your early years? Can't make it to the NBA/NFL?
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - Aeglaecia 2y ago
      your world view presents inconsistencies and would benefit from reflection, for example making negative judgement of exaggeration then proceeding to exaggerate yourself. such behaviour leads me to believe you are not interested in good faith and the following will be a waste of breath. I do believe that daily drug use during childhood is likely to fundamentally change that child's adult disposition. many men I have spoken to who were medicated during childhood have agreed, I have higher confidence in their opinion than yours. some kids will benefit from this. lots and lots of kids are victims of overprescription, and effectively will be mentally castrated by having spontenaiety and peaks of enjoyment crushed via permanent downregulation of the mind's reward circuitry. physically castrated too by reducing growth 10-20% which yes would probably impact ability to maximise sporting potential.
fooblaster 2y ago
psychological castration? what are you on about exactly? Can we just discuss the problems men face without the totally unnecessary victimhood language.
- handwarmers 2y ago
  can you stop tone-moderating people who are trying to share how they feel about something?
  - hackable_sand 2y ago
    [flagged]
  - Copenjin 2y ago
    [flagged]
- djohnston 2y ago
  Force-feeding adderall to developing brains will eventually be viewed the same way we view lobotomies - a crude and cruel method of control. These children absolutely are victims of a sick system.
  - zifpanachr23 2y ago
    It's crude and it's potentially a method of control, but it's massively massively less terrible in basically every way compared to a lobotomy. The problem with the way you talk about this issue is that everything you say is comparing things that are off by about an order of magnitude in terms of their typical consequences.
bdangubic 2y ago
[flagged]
- djohnston 2y ago
  You can swear on HN you know, it's ok to say "shit," we can handle it :)
  - bdangubic 2y ago
    [flagged]
  - johnnyanmac 2y ago
    Fyuck yeah. But I don't think swearing was ever banned. I don't personally bother doing it just because of my own disposition but I've yet to read a comment here that made me go "wow, what a sailor's mouth". Just don't make it distract from the actual core points of curiosity and communication :)
JumpCrisscross 2y ago
There is also a dearth of good male role models in the public sphere.
- shiroiushi 2y ago
  You don't think Trump and Andrew Tate are good role models??? /s
  - bdangubic 2y ago
    which father would not want their daughter to marry one or both of them (in Utah…)???? :)
- johnnyanmac 2y ago
  There's ton of good male role models. But you don't get to the public sphere these days by being a good wholesome person with zero drama. How many of anyone do we really have like that? Maybe leBron James? Keaneu Reeves (for now?). The public sphere gets its attention by appealing to base desires (rage, sadness, humor) and slowly slipping in the pitch for snake oil. If you're giving inconvinent truths, you're being "preachy", and "don't understand my struggle" and "are part of the problem". Or they simply become famous in various means and in that power make skeletons to be revealed years later. It's hard to have a spotlight on you 24/7 and have your entire life be squeaky clean. That used to be the facade of politicians and even they don't care anymore. Can't make the horse drink, even if they are dying of thirst because they keep being fed alcohol.
matrix87 2y ago
> psychological castration wow, I might have to try this in the bedroom sometime
Copenjin 2y ago
What did I just read. I'm not american but I doubt that this is the actual reality you guys live in. Feels like you watch too many of the wrong youtube influencers.
- bufferoverflow 2y ago
  That's a pretty accurate description of what's happening. DEI did this to men, because men were blamed by the media and by the feminists for everything. Sexist anti-male programs were created, and now we see the results. What, you thought that in one generation men magically became dumb?
  - Copenjin 2y ago
    Again, I'm not american but I'm well aware of the silly stuff you are being fed to by influencers selling male victimhood content. Stop listening to that crap. Your downvotes will not change anything. As someone else said, the only problem is the lack of real positive role models (people who build, have ethic and do something useful with their lives), that have been replaced by pathetic characters like JP and other nobodies that only sell victimhood or get rick quick fantasies on the internet.
    - bufferoverflow 2y ago
      Dude, you're so brainwashed. We're showing you actual numbers that colleges/universities are 60-80% female, and your response is that male victimhood is some conspiracy. Numbers clearly show that you're lying and gaslighting. And then in the next sentence you're victimizing yourself for being downvoted. I can't even downvote you. HN doesn't allow me for some reason. I can screenshot it, if you want proof.
      - rubyn00bie 2y ago
        > We're showing you actual numbers that colleges/universities are 60-80% female, and your response is that male victimhood is some conspiracy. You’re literally making those numbers up, they are not referenced in the linked article and you provide no proof. You may want to take a step back and ask yourself if it is you who is brainwashed.
serverlessmania 2y ago
I'd say war-grade amphetamine, adults taking amphetamines maybe, US air force still give that in some circumstances, but giving amphetamines to an hyperactive kid to calm him down, is just mind-blowing.
- zifpanachr23 2y ago
  Maybe I'm just already brain damaged in an irreparable way or am potentially a superhuman badass capable of doing all the drugs without consequences... I think it's bad to give amphetamines to kids...full stop. But it isn't similar to castration or a lobotomy or even in the same order of magnitude in terms of long term irreparable effects. Stimulant drugs of that nature tend to be more tolerable than opiates or benzos or a lot of other drugs often prescribed for common mental illnesses (and often to kids). My issue with the whole discussion is not that we shouldn't take a hard look at our amphetamine prescribing tendency and try to resolve the underlying issues instead of putting on a drug band-aid...my issue is that it is implying some sort of long term catastrophic damage for kids or adults that may have undergone that sort of treatment in the past. And it's asking them to start adopting a blame mentality and potentially start using this great potential (imagined) future that was robbed of them as a coping mechanism. They aren't mentally handicapped, and they shouldn't think of themselves as being the equivalent of somebody that's been castrated or lobotomized and therefore permanently mentally disabled in some way. Yes, giving amphetamines on a regular basis to kids is mind blowing. It's also not the end of their lives.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

[flagged]

"Schools treat boys like they're malfunctioning girls, and girls like they're malfunctioning boys"

I am seriously concerned about this same issue, but I think "psychological castration" is maybe being a bit hyperbolic w.r.t the long term effects of amphetamines at typically prescribed dosages.

Der_Einzige 2y ago
[flagged]
- johnnyanmac 2y ago
  This is a very weird topic to bring up, but just using your logic: Democrats "want men back" and we do so by banning circumcision. But already democratic states in the west are where they stopped. So who's doing the circumcision again?
  - zifpanachr23 2y ago
    I don't know. I'm circumcised and I feel fine and I'm not particularly resentful about it. It's definitely weird though if you think about it too long. I just don't think it's got anything to do with much of.anything politically or socially or sexually or whatever.
    - Der_Einzige 2y ago
      Nope, no connection to bodily autonomy issues at all. Not related to tail docking, cat declawing, "my body my choice", or anything libertarian at all! Nope!
Jensson 2y ago
> but I think "psychological castration" is maybe being a bit hyperbolic w.r.t the long term effects of amphetamines at typically prescribed dosages. You see long term brain changes in kids who get prescribed Adderall, you don't see this for adults. Proponents tend to tout this as why we absolutely need to give this to kids, because they say this will permanently heal them, could just as well be permanently damaging them.
- zifpanachr23 2y ago
  I can accept this. I just have a problem with the allusion to castration, which is a long term, irreversible, and immediately noticeable thing in the typical context that the word is used. I'm concerned about potential long term changes to the brain as well. I wouldn't call that necessarily catastrophically consequential on the level that castration would be though, on account of many other drugs also causing long term and potentially negative changes to the brain. I wouldn't compare underage drinking (known to potentially have long term consequences for the brain) to castration for instance, which is why I think doing the same for amphetamine use is hyperbolic.
Aeglaecia 2y ago
you would certainly have thought somehow differently if your thinking apparatus was consistently influenced by unnatural neurotransmitter concentration during its formation
- johnnyanmac 2y ago
  I mean, you act like the alternative would make you a genius somehow. It's a suppressor, not something that fundamentally changes your entire disposition. That's why "castration" is a exaggeration. What's this utopic ideal you're being sealed from if you take something like adderall in your early years? Can't make it to the NBA/NFL?
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - Aeglaecia 2y ago
    your world view presents inconsistencies and would benefit from reflection, for example making negative judgement of exaggeration then proceeding to exaggerate yourself. such behaviour leads me to believe you are not interested in good faith and the following will be a waste of breath. I do believe that daily drug use during childhood is likely to fundamentally change that child's adult disposition. many men I have spoken to who were medicated during childhood have agreed, I have higher confidence in their opinion than yours. some kids will benefit from this. lots and lots of kids are victims of overprescription, and effectively will be mentally castrated by having spontenaiety and peaks of enjoyment crushed via permanent downregulation of the mind's reward circuitry. physically castrated too by reducing growth 10-20% which yes would probably impact ability to maximise sporting potential.

fooblaster 2y ago

psychological castration? what are you on about exactly? Can we just discuss the problems men face without the totally unnecessary victimhood language.

handwarmers 2y ago
can you stop tone-moderating people who are trying to share how they feel about something?
- hackable_sand 2y ago
  [flagged]
- Copenjin 2y ago
  [flagged]
djohnston 2y ago
Force-feeding adderall to developing brains will eventually be viewed the same way we view lobotomies - a crude and cruel method of control. These children absolutely are victims of a sick system.
- zifpanachr23 2y ago
  It's crude and it's potentially a method of control, but it's massively massively less terrible in basically every way compared to a lobotomy. The problem with the way you talk about this issue is that everything you say is comparing things that are off by about an order of magnitude in terms of their typical consequences.

bdangubic 2y ago

[flagged]

djohnston 2y ago
You can swear on HN you know, it's ok to say "shit," we can handle it :)
- bdangubic 2y ago
  [flagged]
- johnnyanmac 2y ago
  Fyuck yeah. But I don't think swearing was ever banned. I don't personally bother doing it just because of my own disposition but I've yet to read a comment here that made me go "wow, what a sailor's mouth". Just don't make it distract from the actual core points of curiosity and communication :)

JumpCrisscross 2y ago

There is also a dearth of good male role models in the public sphere.

shiroiushi 2y ago
You don't think Trump and Andrew Tate are good role models??? /s
- bdangubic 2y ago
  which father would not want their daughter to marry one or both of them (in Utah…)???? :)
johnnyanmac 2y ago
There's ton of good male role models. But you don't get to the public sphere these days by being a good wholesome person with zero drama. How many of anyone do we really have like that? Maybe leBron James? Keaneu Reeves (for now?). The public sphere gets its attention by appealing to base desires (rage, sadness, humor) and slowly slipping in the pitch for snake oil. If you're giving inconvinent truths, you're being "preachy", and "don't understand my struggle" and "are part of the problem". Or they simply become famous in various means and in that power make skeletons to be revealed years later. It's hard to have a spotlight on you 24/7 and have your entire life be squeaky clean. That used to be the facade of politicians and even they don't care anymore. Can't make the horse drink, even if they are dying of thirst because they keep being fed alcohol.

matrix87 2y ago

> psychological castration wow, I might have to try this in the bedroom sometime

Copenjin 2y ago

What did I just read. I'm not american but I doubt that this is the actual reality you guys live in. Feels like you watch too many of the wrong youtube influencers.

bufferoverflow 2y ago
That's a pretty accurate description of what's happening. DEI did this to men, because men were blamed by the media and by the feminists for everything. Sexist anti-male programs were created, and now we see the results. What, you thought that in one generation men magically became dumb?
- Copenjin 2y ago
  Again, I'm not american but I'm well aware of the silly stuff you are being fed to by influencers selling male victimhood content. Stop listening to that crap. Your downvotes will not change anything. As someone else said, the only problem is the lack of real positive role models (people who build, have ethic and do something useful with their lives), that have been replaced by pathetic characters like JP and other nobodies that only sell victimhood or get rick quick fantasies on the internet.
  - bufferoverflow 2y ago
    Dude, you're so brainwashed. We're showing you actual numbers that colleges/universities are 60-80% female, and your response is that male victimhood is some conspiracy. Numbers clearly show that you're lying and gaslighting. And then in the next sentence you're victimizing yourself for being downvoted. I can't even downvote you. HN doesn't allow me for some reason. I can screenshot it, if you want proof.
    - rubyn00bie 2y ago
      > We're showing you actual numbers that colleges/universities are 60-80% female, and your response is that male victimhood is some conspiracy. You’re literally making those numbers up, they are not referenced in the linked article and you provide no proof. You may want to take a step back and ask yourself if it is you who is brainwashed.

serverlessmania 2y ago

I'd say war-grade amphetamine, adults taking amphetamines maybe, US air force still give that in some circumstances, but giving amphetamines to an hyperactive kid to calm him down, is just mind-blowing.

zifpanachr23 2y ago
Maybe I'm just already brain damaged in an irreparable way or am potentially a superhuman badass capable of doing all the drugs without consequences... I think it's bad to give amphetamines to kids...full stop. But it isn't similar to castration or a lobotomy or even in the same order of magnitude in terms of long term irreparable effects. Stimulant drugs of that nature tend to be more tolerable than opiates or benzos or a lot of other drugs often prescribed for common mental illnesses (and often to kids). My issue with the whole discussion is not that we shouldn't take a hard look at our amphetamine prescribing tendency and try to resolve the underlying issues instead of putting on a drug band-aid...my issue is that it is implying some sort of long term catastrophic damage for kids or adults that may have undergone that sort of treatment in the past. And it's asking them to start adopting a blame mentality and potentially start using this great potential (imagined) future that was robbed of them as a coping mechanism. They aren't mentally handicapped, and they shouldn't think of themselves as being the equivalent of somebody that's been castrated or lobotomized and therefore permanently mentally disabled in some way. Yes, giving amphetamines on a regular basis to kids is mind blowing. It's also not the end of their lives.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]