3 ms·

My old TI-86 can calculate stuff faster than me. You wouldn't ever ask if it was smarter than me. An audio filter can process audio faster than I can listen to

My old TI-86 can calculate stuff faster than me. You wouldn't ever ask if it was smarter than me. An audio filter can process audio faster than I can listen to it but you'd never suggest it was intelligent. AI models are algorithms running on processors running at billions of calculations a second often scaled to hundreds of such processors. They're not intelligent. They're fast.

anon291 2y ago
Except the LLM can solve a general problem (or tell you why it cannot), while your calculator can only do that which it's been programmed.
- th0ma5 2y ago
  Do you have any evidence besides anecdote?
  - anon291 2y ago
    what kind of evidence substantiates creativity? Things I've used chat gpt for: 1. writing songs (couldn't find the generated lyrics online, so assume it's new) 2. Branding ideas (again couldn't find the logos online, so assuming they're new) 3. Recipes (with weird ingredients that I've not found put together online) 4. Vacations with lots of constraints (again, all the information is obviously available online, but it put it together for me and gave recommendations for my family particularly). 5. Theoretical physics explorations where I'm too lazy to write out the math (and why should I... chatgpt will do it for me...) I think perhaps one reason people here do not have the same results is I typically use the API directly and modify the system prompt, which drastically changes the utility of chatgpt. The default prompt is too focused on retrieval and 'truth'. If you want creativity you have to ask it to be an artist.
    - th0ma5 2y ago
      No I think they don't have the results you do because they are trying to do those things well ...
      - anon291 2y ago
        The personal insult insinuated here is not appreciated and probably against community guidelines. For what I needed, those things worked very well
        th0ma5 2y ago
        Anecdotes have equal weight. All of these models frustrate me to no end but I only do things that have never been done before. And it isn't an insult because you have no evidence of quality.
        anon291 2y ago
        > Anecdotes have equal weight. All of these models frustrate me to no end but I only do things that have never been done before. And it isn't an insult because you have no evidence of quality. You have not specified what evidence would satisfy you. And yes, it was an insult to insinuate I would accept sub par results whereas others would not. EDIT: Chat GPT seems to have a solid understanding of why your comment comes across as insulting: https://chatgpt.com/share/673b95c9-7a98-8010-9f8a-9abf5374bbeb https://chatgpt.com/share/673b95c9-7a98-8010-9f8a-9abf5374bb... Maybe this should be taken as one point of evidence of greater ability?
        th0ma5 2y ago
        I think you lead the result by not providing enough context like saying how there is no objective way to measure the quality of an LLM generation after the fact nor before. Edit I asked ChatGPT with a more proper context: "It’s not inherently insulting to say that an LLM (Large Language Model) cannot guarantee the best quality because it’s a factual statement grounded in the nature of how these models work. LLMs rely on patterns in their training data and probabilistic reasoning rather than subjective or objective judgments about "best quality."
- vlovich123 2y ago
  Go ask your favorite LLM to write you some code to implement the backend of the S3 API and see how well it does. Heck, just ask it to implement list iteration against some KV object store API and be amazed at the complete garbage that gets emitted.
  - anon291 2y ago
    So I told it what I wanted, and it generated an initial solution and then modified it to do some file distribution. Without the ability to actually execute the code, this is an excellent first pass. https://chatgpt.com/share/673b8c33-2ec8-8010-9f70-b0ed12a524aa https://chatgpt.com/share/673b8c33-2ec8-8010-9f70-b0ed12a524... Chat GPT can't directly execute code on my machine due to architectural limitations, but I imagine if I went and followed its instructions and told it what went wrong, it would correct it. and that's just it, right? If i were to program this, I would be iterating. ChatGPT cannot do that because of how its architected (I don't think it would be hard to do this if you used the API and allowed some kind of tool use). However, if I told someone to go write me an S3 backend without ever executing it, and they came back with this... that would be great. EDIT: with chunking: https://chatgpt.com/share/673b8c33-2ec8-8010-9f70-b0ed12a524aa https://chatgpt.com/share/673b8c33-2ec8-8010-9f70-b0ed12a524... IIRC, from another thread on this site, this is essentially how S3 is implemented (centralized metadata database that hashes out to nodes which implement a local storage mechanism -- MySQL I think).
    - vlovich123 2y ago
      And that's why it's dangerous to evaluate something when you don't understand what's going on. The implementation generated not only saves things directly to disk [1] [2] but it doesn't even implement file uploading correctly nor does it implementing listing of objects (which I guarantee you would be incorrect). Additionally, it makes a key mistake which is that uploading isn't a form but is the body of the request so it's already unable to have a real S3 client connect. But of course at first glance it has the appearance of maybe being something passable. Source: I had to implement R2 from scratch and nothing generated here would have helped me as even a starting point. And this isn't even getting to complex things like supporting arbitrarily large uploads and encrypting things while also supporting seeked downloads or multipart uploads. [1] No one would ever do this for all sorts of problems including that you'd have all sorts of security problems with attackers sending you /../ to escape bucket and account isolation. [2] No one would ever do this because you've got nothing more than a toy S3 server. A real S3 implementation needs to distribute the data to multiple locations so that availability is maintained in the face of isolated hardware and software failures.

anon291 2y ago

Except the LLM can solve a general problem (or tell you why it cannot), while your calculator can only do that which it's been programmed.

th0ma5 2y ago
Do you have any evidence besides anecdote?
- anon291 2y ago
  what kind of evidence substantiates creativity? Things I've used chat gpt for: 1. writing songs (couldn't find the generated lyrics online, so assume it's new) 2. Branding ideas (again couldn't find the logos online, so assuming they're new) 3. Recipes (with weird ingredients that I've not found put together online) 4. Vacations with lots of constraints (again, all the information is obviously available online, but it put it together for me and gave recommendations for my family particularly). 5. Theoretical physics explorations where I'm too lazy to write out the math (and why should I... chatgpt will do it for me...) I think perhaps one reason people here do not have the same results is I typically use the API directly and modify the system prompt, which drastically changes the utility of chatgpt. The default prompt is too focused on retrieval and 'truth'. If you want creativity you have to ask it to be an artist.
  - th0ma5 2y ago
    No I think they don't have the results you do because they are trying to do those things well ...
    - anon291 2y ago
      The personal insult insinuated here is not appreciated and probably against community guidelines. For what I needed, those things worked very well
      - th0ma5 2y ago
        Anecdotes have equal weight. All of these models frustrate me to no end but I only do things that have never been done before. And it isn't an insult because you have no evidence of quality.
        anon291 2y ago
        > Anecdotes have equal weight. All of these models frustrate me to no end but I only do things that have never been done before. And it isn't an insult because you have no evidence of quality. You have not specified what evidence would satisfy you. And yes, it was an insult to insinuate I would accept sub par results whereas others would not. EDIT: Chat GPT seems to have a solid understanding of why your comment comes across as insulting: https://chatgpt.com/share/673b95c9-7a98-8010-9f8a-9abf5374bbeb https://chatgpt.com/share/673b95c9-7a98-8010-9f8a-9abf5374bb... Maybe this should be taken as one point of evidence of greater ability?
        th0ma5 2y ago
        I think you lead the result by not providing enough context like saying how there is no objective way to measure the quality of an LLM generation after the fact nor before. Edit I asked ChatGPT with a more proper context: "It’s not inherently insulting to say that an LLM (Large Language Model) cannot guarantee the best quality because it’s a factual statement grounded in the nature of how these models work. LLMs rely on patterns in their training data and probabilistic reasoning rather than subjective or objective judgments about "best quality."
vlovich123 2y ago
Go ask your favorite LLM to write you some code to implement the backend of the S3 API and see how well it does. Heck, just ask it to implement list iteration against some KV object store API and be amazed at the complete garbage that gets emitted.
- anon291 2y ago
  So I told it what I wanted, and it generated an initial solution and then modified it to do some file distribution. Without the ability to actually execute the code, this is an excellent first pass. https://chatgpt.com/share/673b8c33-2ec8-8010-9f70-b0ed12a524aa https://chatgpt.com/share/673b8c33-2ec8-8010-9f70-b0ed12a524... Chat GPT can't directly execute code on my machine due to architectural limitations, but I imagine if I went and followed its instructions and told it what went wrong, it would correct it. and that's just it, right? If i were to program this, I would be iterating. ChatGPT cannot do that because of how its architected (I don't think it would be hard to do this if you used the API and allowed some kind of tool use). However, if I told someone to go write me an S3 backend without ever executing it, and they came back with this... that would be great. EDIT: with chunking: https://chatgpt.com/share/673b8c33-2ec8-8010-9f70-b0ed12a524aa https://chatgpt.com/share/673b8c33-2ec8-8010-9f70-b0ed12a524... IIRC, from another thread on this site, this is essentially how S3 is implemented (centralized metadata database that hashes out to nodes which implement a local storage mechanism -- MySQL I think).
  - vlovich123 2y ago
    And that's why it's dangerous to evaluate something when you don't understand what's going on. The implementation generated not only saves things directly to disk [1] [2] but it doesn't even implement file uploading correctly nor does it implementing listing of objects (which I guarantee you would be incorrect). Additionally, it makes a key mistake which is that uploading isn't a form but is the body of the request so it's already unable to have a real S3 client connect. But of course at first glance it has the appearance of maybe being something passable. Source: I had to implement R2 from scratch and nothing generated here would have helped me as even a starting point. And this isn't even getting to complex things like supporting arbitrarily large uploads and encrypting things while also supporting seeked downloads or multipart uploads. [1] No one would ever do this for all sorts of problems including that you'd have all sorts of security problems with attackers sending you /../ to escape bucket and account isolation. [2] No one would ever do this because you've got nothing more than a toy S3 server. A real S3 implementation needs to distribute the data to multiple locations so that availability is maintained in the face of isolated hardware and software failures.