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Subsidy cannot work beyond a certain scale. Sure they may have benefitted initially, but in the long run I presume they need some kind of profits to sustain. M

Subsidy cannot work beyond a certain scale. Sure they may have benefitted initially, but in the long run I presume they need some kind of profits to sustain. May be the lead in Chinese EV and battery industries is not purely technological, it is also the supply chain and scale developed over the years. All this talk assumes that USA or Western countries have always had a level playing field whereas companies like Boeing or Airbus are prime counter examples

rootusrootus 2y ago
> All this talk assumes that USA or Western countries have always had a level playing field whereas companies like Boeing or Airbus are prime counter examples As I said, every country does it. It is rational to protect your own manufacturing industry. China does it. We do it. European countries do it. Just because we protect our own industry does not mean we have to protect China's interests too. That's their problem.
- elashri 2y ago
  The problem is that the US is complaining a lot about that when it is the other countries doing that. Even here, average commentator will call it a foul (whataboittism) if you point out that. You can't eat the cake and have it. Either you follow the fair trade requirements or don't complain about others not doing the same. If you say standards, then follow by lead and respect them. Also I do not think every country does that. There are too much pressure by the US, China and EU on these countries to prevent many from doing that.
  - NotSammyHagar 2y ago
    The us of course subsidizes our manufacturing (whatever is left of it), just like many other countries. I don't know if our $7500 tax rebates on locally made EVs with non-chinese batteries compare to Chinese govt subsidies. But it's clear that EVs are going to be much much cheaper to make, maintain, and recycle over time. This is a threat to all kinds of incumbents. We face the destruction of a lot of our manufacturing industrial base if we don't convert some more of it to EVs, and this will also be destabilizing to our politics. Add on the enmity of the gas and oil industry (helped a tiiiny bit by Trump's victory).
    - elashri 2y ago
      The US is subsiding a lot of industries. Aviation, agriculture (specially agricultural exports), transportation and energy. They just introduced CHIPSA act to promote US companies chipa production and a lot more. When china does this (which is does) then this is far cry and outright harmful for international trade. Lets get out of comparison between US and China. Smaller countries will be hit hard (even with sanctions) if they try to do something from that. The point here is that the US, China shouldn't try to prevent other countries from doing what they are doing and forcing them to harm their local economy and open markets under the disguise of free trade.
nytesky 2y ago
No, they do not need long term profits to sustain, at least in certain regimes.

rootusrootus 2y ago

> All this talk assumes that USA or Western countries have always had a level playing field whereas companies like Boeing or Airbus are prime counter examples As I said, every country does it. It is rational to protect your own manufacturing industry. China does it. We do it. European countries do it. Just because we protect our own industry does not mean we have to protect China's interests too. That's their problem.

elashri 2y ago
The problem is that the US is complaining a lot about that when it is the other countries doing that. Even here, average commentator will call it a foul (whataboittism) if you point out that. You can't eat the cake and have it. Either you follow the fair trade requirements or don't complain about others not doing the same. If you say standards, then follow by lead and respect them. Also I do not think every country does that. There are too much pressure by the US, China and EU on these countries to prevent many from doing that.
- NotSammyHagar 2y ago
  The us of course subsidizes our manufacturing (whatever is left of it), just like many other countries. I don't know if our $7500 tax rebates on locally made EVs with non-chinese batteries compare to Chinese govt subsidies. But it's clear that EVs are going to be much much cheaper to make, maintain, and recycle over time. This is a threat to all kinds of incumbents. We face the destruction of a lot of our manufacturing industrial base if we don't convert some more of it to EVs, and this will also be destabilizing to our politics. Add on the enmity of the gas and oil industry (helped a tiiiny bit by Trump's victory).
  - elashri 2y ago
    The US is subsiding a lot of industries. Aviation, agriculture (specially agricultural exports), transportation and energy. They just introduced CHIPSA act to promote US companies chipa production and a lot more. When china does this (which is does) then this is far cry and outright harmful for international trade. Lets get out of comparison between US and China. Smaller countries will be hit hard (even with sanctions) if they try to do something from that. The point here is that the US, China shouldn't try to prevent other countries from doing what they are doing and forcing them to harm their local economy and open markets under the disguise of free trade.

nytesky 2y ago

No, they do not need long term profits to sustain, at least in certain regimes.