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Making an argument that fascists are taking over the world may indeed be what gp doesn’t like. But gp (and yourself, presumably) not liking it doesn’t make it

Making an argument that fascists are taking over the world may indeed be what gp doesn’t like. But gp (and yourself, presumably) not liking it doesn’t make it untrue, and certainly doesn’t mean the argument should be censored.

parl_match 2y ago
Being censored is not the same as not being amplified.
- otterley 2y ago
  Or, freedom of speech does not mean freedom of reach.
  - parl_match 2y ago
    Freedom of speech means you are allowed to say whatever you like. You are allowed to write it down. You are allowed to make copies of it and distribute it. It does NOT mean that others are COMPELLED to carry or distribute your message. I recognize this can create uncomfortable situations, such as when a corporation that controls the stack of modern communication decides your speech is forbidden. That is, I think, a very related but separate issue. At the end of the day, you can stand on a box on the corner of your street and yell.
- bbor 2y ago
  Idk deleting a comment is kinda the definition of censorship. It’s not governmental censorship, but that’s not the only kind, just the worst one. Censorship is justified sometimes of course, tho I’m both sad and surprised that our two kings have decided any discussion of authoritarianism deserves this treatment. What is HackerNews? What does it mean to stimulate intellectual curiosity when legal freedom of speech is at risk for the large majority of the user base? I guess technically Thiel is into Trump so maybe influencing Graham, but I never got the impression he dictated moderation decisions here. The more likely explanation, IMO, is that they’re just trying not to rock the boat, and “ban all serious political discussion on sight” is still their way to do that
- blackeyeblitzar 2y ago
  Providing different amplification to messages based on their political viewpoint is effectively censorship.
  - mandmandam 2y ago
    Sad to see such a logical and straightforward statement being grayed out :/ Especially when the political viewpoint in question is "Guys maybe we should worry about this looming fascism, evidenced by just about every possible indicator".
  - blackqueeriroh 2y ago
    This is incorrect. Censorship is eliminating someone’s voice. Amplifying views you like is called running your own social network.
    - mandmandam 2y ago
      Nope. > censorship, the changing or the suppression or prohibition of speech or writing that is deemed subversive of the common good. (Brittanica) - note 'changing' and 'suppression', rather than 'elimination'. > Any regime or context in which the content of what is publically expressed, exhibited, published, broadcast, or otherwise distributed is regulated or in which the circulation of information is controlled. > The practice and process of suppression or any particular instance of this. This may involve the partial or total suppression of any text or the entire output of an individual or organization on a limited or permanent basis. (Oxford) - note 'regulated' and 'controlled', and explicitly, 'partial or total', rather than elimination. > Amplifying views you like Ie, literally de facto censorship. When every social network is owned by the yacht class, and they are "amplifying" everything except political views calling for a more equitable and less genocidal system, that's censorship. Definitevily.

parl_match 2y ago

Being censored is not the same as not being amplified.

otterley 2y ago
Or, freedom of speech does not mean freedom of reach.
- parl_match 2y ago
  Freedom of speech means you are allowed to say whatever you like. You are allowed to write it down. You are allowed to make copies of it and distribute it. It does NOT mean that others are COMPELLED to carry or distribute your message. I recognize this can create uncomfortable situations, such as when a corporation that controls the stack of modern communication decides your speech is forbidden. That is, I think, a very related but separate issue. At the end of the day, you can stand on a box on the corner of your street and yell.
bbor 2y ago
Idk deleting a comment is kinda the definition of censorship. It’s not governmental censorship, but that’s not the only kind, just the worst one. Censorship is justified sometimes of course, tho I’m both sad and surprised that our two kings have decided any discussion of authoritarianism deserves this treatment. What is HackerNews? What does it mean to stimulate intellectual curiosity when legal freedom of speech is at risk for the large majority of the user base? I guess technically Thiel is into Trump so maybe influencing Graham, but I never got the impression he dictated moderation decisions here. The more likely explanation, IMO, is that they’re just trying not to rock the boat, and “ban all serious political discussion on sight” is still their way to do that
blackeyeblitzar 2y ago
Providing different amplification to messages based on their political viewpoint is effectively censorship.
- mandmandam 2y ago
  Sad to see such a logical and straightforward statement being grayed out :/ Especially when the political viewpoint in question is "Guys maybe we should worry about this looming fascism, evidenced by just about every possible indicator".
- blackqueeriroh 2y ago
  This is incorrect. Censorship is eliminating someone’s voice. Amplifying views you like is called running your own social network.
  - mandmandam 2y ago
    Nope. > censorship, the changing or the suppression or prohibition of speech or writing that is deemed subversive of the common good. (Brittanica) - note 'changing' and 'suppression', rather than 'elimination'. > Any regime or context in which the content of what is publically expressed, exhibited, published, broadcast, or otherwise distributed is regulated or in which the circulation of information is controlled. > The practice and process of suppression or any particular instance of this. This may involve the partial or total suppression of any text or the entire output of an individual or organization on a limited or permanent basis. (Oxford) - note 'regulated' and 'controlled', and explicitly, 'partial or total', rather than elimination. > Amplifying views you like Ie, literally de facto censorship. When every social network is owned by the yacht class, and they are "amplifying" everything except political views calling for a more equitable and less genocidal system, that's censorship. Definitevily.