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Citing Fed data to argue that people's understanding of their own economic situation is a "lie" is ... brave, and the sort of thing that led to the Democrat's c

Citing Fed data to argue that people's understanding of their own economic situation is a "lie" is ... brave, and the sort of thing that led to the Democrat's current situation. The map is not the territory. Inflation is very bad for the poor. Much worse than for the rich. People's wages lag behind price rises and may not rise at all if someone is unable to gain leverage over their employer. The rich tend to keep their savings in the sort of financial assets that benefit from the way modern governments print money, so they often benefit tremendously. Who did the best out of COVID policy: a guy who works in an Amazon warehouse and can be replaced at the drop of a hat if he asks for a raise, or someone who has a ton of money in Amazon shares? The stimmy cheques are a big part of why there was inflation. They definitely didn't cancel it out.

bloppe 2y ago
This isn't about an individual. It's about America's economy, which is broadly doing very well. I never claimed it's universally doing well for every single person. That's statistically impossible. Inflation can come in many forms. The wave we just had came during a historically tight job market, so yes, the poor (those without any savings) didn't do bad. Remember the labor shortage? One of the main reasons inflation went down this year was the huge influx of migrants alleviating it. I'll concede that's not doing any short term favors for the poor right now (though it's important to remember that immigration pretty much always makes everyone better off, poor included, after a generation or so), but in 2022 the middle class was definitely suffering more than the actual poor. This was not necessarily the case outside the US where the job market was not as crazy. The stimmy checks helped with the initial Covid job shock, which was the intention. Of course they contributed to inflation.
- thunky 2y ago
  > This isn't about an individual. It's about America's economy, which is broadly doing very well I think you may be missing the parent's point, because you're repeating the mistake. An individual doesn't care that the economy is "doing very well" if they're personally struggling. It probably makes it worse, actually. And telling them that they're wrong or stupid certainly doesn't make it better either. Bernie gets it: https://www.newsweek.com/bernie-sanders-support-democratic-voters-1981996 https://www.newsweek.com/bernie-sanders-support-democratic-v...
  - bloppe 2y ago
    The point is this: when Trump says the economy is doing badly, he's objectively lying. I know people who are making more money than they've ever made who still think the economy is in bad shape and Trump will somehow make it better. The guy is a serial grifter who's primarily concerned with enriching his children and empowering his sycophants. You couldn't count the number of former business partners who've sworn off ever working with him again. His policy proposals (100% tariffs, mass deportation) are so wildly inflationary they put the (ironically named) Inflation Reduction Act to shame. If you're concerned about the economy, Trump should be your last choice. I get that people don't like being told that they're stupid and wrong. I don't know if anybody has the communication skills to convince Trump voters how stupid they're being. At this point, I just hope that when shit hits the fan, Trump doesn't manage to deflect too much blame. We're all going to have to learn some hard, hard lessons, together.
    - thunky 2y ago
      > The point is this: when Trump says the economy is doing badly, he's objectively lying Not to the person struggling. I'm not saying that Trump will actually improve their circumstances. I'm saying that, according to Bernie and others, Harris' campaign didn't do a good job speaking to them. Instead they told them that the economy is "doing very well" which clearly didn't resonate.
      - bloppe 2y ago
        I agree that Harris dropped the ball on some of her messaging, but it's weird to dwell on that when Trump's messaging is a bunch of psychotic hallucinations. Also I'm talking about the point I was originally making. I guess people don't want to talk about that tho and prefer to rationalize Harris' loss.
        thunky 2y ago
        > I guess people don't want to talk about that tho and prefer to rationalize Harris' loss. You're doing it again...repeating the same mistake of implying that everyone that supports Trump is an idiot, rather than trying to understand what motivates them. The same mistake the Democratic party keeps repeating.

bloppe 2y ago

This isn't about an individual. It's about America's economy, which is broadly doing very well. I never claimed it's universally doing well for every single person. That's statistically impossible. Inflation can come in many forms. The wave we just had came during a historically tight job market, so yes, the poor (those without any savings) didn't do bad. Remember the labor shortage? One of the main reasons inflation went down this year was the huge influx of migrants alleviating it. I'll concede that's not doing any short term favors for the poor right now (though it's important to remember that immigration pretty much always makes everyone better off, poor included, after a generation or so), but in 2022 the middle class was definitely suffering more than the actual poor. This was not necessarily the case outside the US where the job market was not as crazy. The stimmy checks helped with the initial Covid job shock, which was the intention. Of course they contributed to inflation.

thunky 2y ago
> This isn't about an individual. It's about America's economy, which is broadly doing very well I think you may be missing the parent's point, because you're repeating the mistake. An individual doesn't care that the economy is "doing very well" if they're personally struggling. It probably makes it worse, actually. And telling them that they're wrong or stupid certainly doesn't make it better either. Bernie gets it: https://www.newsweek.com/bernie-sanders-support-democratic-voters-1981996 https://www.newsweek.com/bernie-sanders-support-democratic-v...
- bloppe 2y ago
  The point is this: when Trump says the economy is doing badly, he's objectively lying. I know people who are making more money than they've ever made who still think the economy is in bad shape and Trump will somehow make it better. The guy is a serial grifter who's primarily concerned with enriching his children and empowering his sycophants. You couldn't count the number of former business partners who've sworn off ever working with him again. His policy proposals (100% tariffs, mass deportation) are so wildly inflationary they put the (ironically named) Inflation Reduction Act to shame. If you're concerned about the economy, Trump should be your last choice. I get that people don't like being told that they're stupid and wrong. I don't know if anybody has the communication skills to convince Trump voters how stupid they're being. At this point, I just hope that when shit hits the fan, Trump doesn't manage to deflect too much blame. We're all going to have to learn some hard, hard lessons, together.
  - thunky 2y ago
    > The point is this: when Trump says the economy is doing badly, he's objectively lying Not to the person struggling. I'm not saying that Trump will actually improve their circumstances. I'm saying that, according to Bernie and others, Harris' campaign didn't do a good job speaking to them. Instead they told them that the economy is "doing very well" which clearly didn't resonate.
    - bloppe 2y ago
      I agree that Harris dropped the ball on some of her messaging, but it's weird to dwell on that when Trump's messaging is a bunch of psychotic hallucinations. Also I'm talking about the point I was originally making. I guess people don't want to talk about that tho and prefer to rationalize Harris' loss.
      - thunky 2y ago
        > I guess people don't want to talk about that tho and prefer to rationalize Harris' loss. You're doing it again...repeating the same mistake of implying that everyone that supports Trump is an idiot, rather than trying to understand what motivates them. The same mistake the Democratic party keeps repeating.