3 ms·

My idea to solve all this would be to change how computing is done. We don't talk about radical disruptive ideas enough these days. What if we don't have to i

My idea to solve all this would be to change how computing is done. We don't talk about radical disruptive ideas enough these days. What if we don't have to interact with computers from a stationary position at all? VR headsets are one direction that might help with this, but in my view there is another way. Decouple peripherals and computing units fully. You'd carry around with you a battery unit that will charge display and input units, and it wouldn't be carrying but maybe put on a strap on your arm, shoulder, back,etc.. (very lightweight). I wish I could draw this out and show you, but you would be able to sit, move around, even run. You can hold a display unit, but you can also have cheap display units on walls all over the office, house,etc.. and you'd attach sensors to the back of your arm that would sense finger movements for typing and controlling the mouse and view port. Essentially, "monitors" would not be tied to one device, but whatever device is nearest to them, wirelessly. and 10-12" mobile monitors (like tablets but just the display,battery and wireless receiver board) that work in the same way would also be a thing. the actual computers would be in a static location. Imagine just sitting at a desk, or walking up to a wall, running on a treadmill, or taking a walk outside and you can still do the same exact task, just as if you were sitting down in front of a laptop. If it were that simple, someone would have done it, I get that. But we need to talk about ideas like this (I'm sure there are better ones).

dmead 2y ago
Lol did you just invent a terminal from the 1970s, but a cell phone?
- yjftsjthsd-h 2y ago
  We reinvent thin clients every few years; aren't we due for the latest take on it?
  - notepad0x90 2y ago
    well, think of thin clients but much much thinner, like anorexic clients :) , also think of peripherals, display and audio i/o units being discrete thin clients on their own that network with each other and various compute units.
- grues-dinner 2y ago
  Sounds like the hand terminals from The Expanse which you can flick onto any nearby display. Which I dearly would like to see, but the protocol and security implications make my head hurt.
  - fragmede 2y ago
    Apple doesn't have the "flick" UI for it, but you can screen share a Mac to Apple TV, so I'm able to use my TV as a monitor with no trouble. The security boundary is that all devices need to be logged into the same wifi, maybe also iCloud.
    - grues-dinner 2y ago
      Right but that's the point, isn't it? If you have a single manufacturer with complete control of the devices and software on both ends and you own the devices and have a single trusted network or authentication service it can work (but still not exactly easy to implement). But that's not the hypothetical in question - for that to be a reality, you have to have it work pretty much anywhere, on any network (or a way to negotiate an adhoc private network) and on virtually any third party IO hardware. And that's before you get to the possibility of the gym treadmill screen or coffee shop keyboard or whatever being a hostile device. Which they would easily be if people were going to use the system for something of high value as opposed to casting YouTube to the treadmill screen. Which may be a little bit of a data leak opportunity as it stands, but it's not quite a screencast of your banking account, complete with key log.
      - fragmede 2y ago
        My point is that the underlying technology is there, in a way that's accessible to users, so it's just a matter of use case and implementation and the market for such technology. If all you think about is the reasons it won't work, then you'll never try. Some great companies have come from people that didn't know they shouldn't try. As far as technology though, Airplay is what macOS uses to project the video, and there are open source implementations out there that you could run on a raspberry pi. As far as wanting it to work everywhere, if Apple supported Chromecast it would probably work more places, since Google licenses that technology so it's already on a lot of TVs and projectors. I'm not imagining using this in very many places other than my home and any office locations where I have wifi, but there are standards like wifi-direct where you wouldn't even need that. I'm only transmitting video, the keyboard/mouse is connected to my device via Bluetooth, so the worst a malicious device could do is record video that I'm transmitting, which, if I don't want people to see the video I'm transmitting, I should not transmit it in the first place.
- notepad0x90 2y ago
  cell phones have embedded compute units in them and 70's terminals were neither wireless nor lightweight.
Terr_ 2y ago
I see the big issues as: 1. Input accuracy, speed, and fatigue. Stick your keyboard to a wall and try standing next to it typing for an hour. Even if somehow gestures/sign-language are viable, your arms will get tired, and only a few people will power through the pain with the excuse that it's a form of exercise. 2. Motion sickness and physical safety. We make dedicated workspaces because we need to control external factors and have definite positions for things. A floating "window" isn't that different from an LCD on a pivoting arm, especially if you prefer to change the hat's on it rather than frequently relocate it. 3. We don't multitask nearly as well as we think we do.
- fragmede 2y ago
  I've made basically a keytar - just a flat board hanging down like a guitar, with a guitar strap for it, and then I mounted a (wireless) keyboard and trackpad to it (flat), so I can stand and type/mouse with my arms and hands hanging down. There's still fatigue, but there's not the same need for gorilla arms. So I don't see 1 as insurmountable.
- notepad0x90 2y ago
  1) You'll move your fingers just as if you were typing on a keyboard, and the sensors will give you feedback when you "type", your arm can be in any position, so long as you move your fingers like you were typing on a keyboard it would work. There won't be actual keyboards. accuracy and speed would ideally be similar to a bluetooth keyboard. 2) Dedicated workspaces are fine, you're just not tied to one concept of a workspace. A park bench can be a dedicated work space, so can standing in front of walls, or a seat at a coffee shop. the ergonomics can be adapted accordingly. 3) Multi-tasking is irrelevant here, if I'm just watching a video for example, I can sit on a sofa, get up and walk around after a bit, go to the kitchen and make some food, go to my office and sit on an office chair,etc.. all the while I would be watching the movie. My posture and location is not tied down to the compute device, that would be the ideal goal. We wouldn't need "smart" devices all that much with this approach either, "things" would interface with my I/O peripherals instead of having their own that requires my interaction. E.g.: imagine getting groceries and you'd navigate the isles and get information about products without a single thing in the store changing, you just have your peripherals interact with the environment better.
tbrownaw 2y ago
So ... a cellphone plus random screens available to cast to plus a Bluetooth keyboard small enough to wear on your arm.
- notepad0x90 2y ago
  more like a hand movement sensor than a keyboard but yeah. it would also act as a mouse if you pinch your index finger and thumb on either hand. One other important piece you're missing is that the displays are "cellphone" aren't permanently paired. and the "cellphone" could be a computing device of any size. your displays would interface with the larger computer at stores or smaller computers when you go about your day in public (street lamps, directions, information, subway,etc..). instead of a smart thermostat with a touch screen for example, you'd just bring your display near a wall (and/or actual thermostat) and interface with it. flying? just bring up your lightweight display and have it interface with the plane's computer for entertainment and information. So, instead of "cellphone" think, "thin client" but with modern wireless+battery tech.
kryptiskt 2y ago
Stephen Wolfram has a walking desk so he can use his laptop while out walking: https://writings.stephenwolfram.com/2019/02/seeking-the-productive-life-some-details-of-my-personal-infrastructure/ https://writings.stephenwolfram.com/2019/02/seeking-the-prod...

dmead 2y ago

Lol did you just invent a terminal from the 1970s, but a cell phone?

yjftsjthsd-h 2y ago
We reinvent thin clients every few years; aren't we due for the latest take on it?
- notepad0x90 2y ago
  well, think of thin clients but much much thinner, like anorexic clients :) , also think of peripherals, display and audio i/o units being discrete thin clients on their own that network with each other and various compute units.
grues-dinner 2y ago
Sounds like the hand terminals from The Expanse which you can flick onto any nearby display. Which I dearly would like to see, but the protocol and security implications make my head hurt.
- fragmede 2y ago
  Apple doesn't have the "flick" UI for it, but you can screen share a Mac to Apple TV, so I'm able to use my TV as a monitor with no trouble. The security boundary is that all devices need to be logged into the same wifi, maybe also iCloud.
  - grues-dinner 2y ago
    Right but that's the point, isn't it? If you have a single manufacturer with complete control of the devices and software on both ends and you own the devices and have a single trusted network or authentication service it can work (but still not exactly easy to implement). But that's not the hypothetical in question - for that to be a reality, you have to have it work pretty much anywhere, on any network (or a way to negotiate an adhoc private network) and on virtually any third party IO hardware. And that's before you get to the possibility of the gym treadmill screen or coffee shop keyboard or whatever being a hostile device. Which they would easily be if people were going to use the system for something of high value as opposed to casting YouTube to the treadmill screen. Which may be a little bit of a data leak opportunity as it stands, but it's not quite a screencast of your banking account, complete with key log.
    - fragmede 2y ago
      My point is that the underlying technology is there, in a way that's accessible to users, so it's just a matter of use case and implementation and the market for such technology. If all you think about is the reasons it won't work, then you'll never try. Some great companies have come from people that didn't know they shouldn't try. As far as technology though, Airplay is what macOS uses to project the video, and there are open source implementations out there that you could run on a raspberry pi. As far as wanting it to work everywhere, if Apple supported Chromecast it would probably work more places, since Google licenses that technology so it's already on a lot of TVs and projectors. I'm not imagining using this in very many places other than my home and any office locations where I have wifi, but there are standards like wifi-direct where you wouldn't even need that. I'm only transmitting video, the keyboard/mouse is connected to my device via Bluetooth, so the worst a malicious device could do is record video that I'm transmitting, which, if I don't want people to see the video I'm transmitting, I should not transmit it in the first place.
notepad0x90 2y ago
cell phones have embedded compute units in them and 70's terminals were neither wireless nor lightweight.

Terr_ 2y ago

I see the big issues as: 1. Input accuracy, speed, and fatigue. Stick your keyboard to a wall and try standing next to it typing for an hour. Even if somehow gestures/sign-language are viable, your arms will get tired, and only a few people will power through the pain with the excuse that it's a form of exercise. 2. Motion sickness and physical safety. We make dedicated workspaces because we need to control external factors and have definite positions for things. A floating "window" isn't that different from an LCD on a pivoting arm, especially if you prefer to change the hat's on it rather than frequently relocate it. 3. We don't multitask nearly as well as we think we do.

fragmede 2y ago
I've made basically a keytar - just a flat board hanging down like a guitar, with a guitar strap for it, and then I mounted a (wireless) keyboard and trackpad to it (flat), so I can stand and type/mouse with my arms and hands hanging down. There's still fatigue, but there's not the same need for gorilla arms. So I don't see 1 as insurmountable.
notepad0x90 2y ago
1) You'll move your fingers just as if you were typing on a keyboard, and the sensors will give you feedback when you "type", your arm can be in any position, so long as you move your fingers like you were typing on a keyboard it would work. There won't be actual keyboards. accuracy and speed would ideally be similar to a bluetooth keyboard. 2) Dedicated workspaces are fine, you're just not tied to one concept of a workspace. A park bench can be a dedicated work space, so can standing in front of walls, or a seat at a coffee shop. the ergonomics can be adapted accordingly. 3) Multi-tasking is irrelevant here, if I'm just watching a video for example, I can sit on a sofa, get up and walk around after a bit, go to the kitchen and make some food, go to my office and sit on an office chair,etc.. all the while I would be watching the movie. My posture and location is not tied down to the compute device, that would be the ideal goal. We wouldn't need "smart" devices all that much with this approach either, "things" would interface with my I/O peripherals instead of having their own that requires my interaction. E.g.: imagine getting groceries and you'd navigate the isles and get information about products without a single thing in the store changing, you just have your peripherals interact with the environment better.

tbrownaw 2y ago

So ... a cellphone plus random screens available to cast to plus a Bluetooth keyboard small enough to wear on your arm.

notepad0x90 2y ago
more like a hand movement sensor than a keyboard but yeah. it would also act as a mouse if you pinch your index finger and thumb on either hand. One other important piece you're missing is that the displays are "cellphone" aren't permanently paired. and the "cellphone" could be a computing device of any size. your displays would interface with the larger computer at stores or smaller computers when you go about your day in public (street lamps, directions, information, subway,etc..). instead of a smart thermostat with a touch screen for example, you'd just bring your display near a wall (and/or actual thermostat) and interface with it. flying? just bring up your lightweight display and have it interface with the plane's computer for entertainment and information. So, instead of "cellphone" think, "thin client" but with modern wireless+battery tech.

kryptiskt 2y ago

Stephen Wolfram has a walking desk so he can use his laptop while out walking: https://writings.stephenwolfram.com/2019/02/seeking-the-productive-life-some-details-of-my-personal-infrastructure/ https://writings.stephenwolfram.com/2019/02/seeking-the-prod...