3 ms·

Completely agree with you. However, what does this mean for a software engineer or anyone who must be in front of a computer for extended periods of time? I’v

Completely agree with you. However, what does this mean for a software engineer or anyone who must be in front of a computer for extended periods of time? I’ve moved to biking everywhere and daily walks with the dogs, but still have 8 hours where I’m mostly sedentary

krior 2y ago
Try to get movement in whenever possible. Take the stairs, pace around during calls (when you do not share an office). Get up and stretch between "work segments". And my favorite new tool: A skipping rope that I use whenever I feel too tired/ like my concentration is breaking / I do not want to do, what I currently have to do. (Mind you, there is a storage room big enough next to my office room that is right above the underground garage, so I will not disturb my colleagues.). Before that, I used to climb the stairs to the top of my office building (five floors) and down to "unfog" my mind and get some energy back.
- skirmish 2y ago
  I once got a bright idea to climb up the stairs to the 13th floor where our office was located. Once I got there, I found that doors can only be opened from the inside, so I climbed 13 floors down and took an elevator up again like a good little sheep.
stocknoob 2y ago
My 2c if helpful: the solution was to question deeper assumptions. Why are you at a desk? Because you have to work 8 hours. Why? Because your job requires it. Why do you have that job? Because you need income to live. Is a job the only way to have income to live? (See: FI). Ultimately the root cause is not being in control of your time. It takes time, but once solved the downstream problems solve themselves. You can work (exert effort on goals you care about) in a way that prioritizes your health.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
tikhonj 2y ago
I've developed two habits that work well for me: 1. Taking walks during the day. I have figured out a lot of tricky design and even debugging questions by taking a walk. And even if I don't think about programming directly, it still clears my head. Splitting my day up with an hour (or longer) walk leaves me more effective than spending the same time in front of my computer. I usually work remotely, so often this involves walking to a cafe, doing some work there and walking back. 2. Taking walking meetings. I've found this works well for 1:1s, and it works reasonably well for large calls where I don't need to participate much. There are lots of meetings where it's too awkward or doesn't work at all, but converting even a small fraction of my meetings to walking meetings is a real improvement. Of course, both of these assume a flexible culture where this does not make me look like a slacker and where I can take meetings in different ways. But I figure that's a minimum for having a healthy and productive work environment regardless!
- aeternum 2y ago
  The videocall obsession has got to stop for #2 to work. It used to be much easier to do walking meetings and walking calls, now every external call has to be on video and even internal calls there are plenty of people that subtly guilt you or assume you're not actually working if you have video off. I'm about to start leaving video on with the phone in my pocket as I walk.
  - tikhonj 2y ago
    Yeah, I've been lucky to work on teams where people are pretty flexible about having video on or off. And for 1:1s walking meetings can work well in person too :)
jltsiren 2y ago
I think it's less about deliberate tricks and more about developing habits that ensure some low intensity activity throughout the day. Most things you do on a computer don't actually require being in front of the computer all the time. There are always moments when you are waiting for something to happen or thinking about something instead of actually doing it. You can use those moments to snap out of the torpor, even if just for a few seconds.
satvikpendem 2y ago
I saw this comment by the user smeej recently on Ask HN about your best purchases of 2024 [0]: > Semi-recumbent stationary bike that fits under my standing desk. > I've never been coordinated enough to get the hang of walking on the treadmill and typing, but pedaling slowly all day I can do! I've lost 45 lbs so far this year, and adding up the calorie estimate for each day (I've been tracking) and dividing by the 3500 calories people say are in a pound, about 20 of them have been from the bike! (The rest have been from hard work with a dietitian who helped me solve some longstanding issues, but that was more expensive.) [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42080255 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42080255
dagmx 2y ago
I change positions throughout the day (Apple Watch is good for reminding to move) But also for me , if I’m at home, I take my dog for walks during the day and just make up the time later if needed. It breaks things up. Or if I’m in the office I go for thinking walks to plan out what I’m doing
0xEF 2y ago
I was not in the same industry, but I once had a remote job that kept me tethered to my desk because I was constantly responding to phone calls. After about two months of that, I ended up purchasing a cheap walking pad (think slow treadmill with no side rails that only goes at walking pace) from Amazon for about $120USD. This was not a perfect solution, any stretch, it provided movement instead of just standing in place. What I mean by "rethink the way we work" is that jobs like yours (and you may not agree with this) need to be broken up into smaller chunks through the day. So, you work for 2 hours, do something else for 2 hours, work a little more for 2 hours, and so on. I work beside a lot of programmers and CAD designers in my industry and, in fact, am trying to move over to their side of the team (currently I am the guy who builds, tests and repairs the machines they create). One thing I feel is universally true is that, while you may be sitting at your desk for 8 hours, you are really only doing any actual work for about half the time, possibly less. Here me out; sitting in front of a computer is tough on both the brain and body. When you are tethered to the desk and 90% of your job is cerebral, to an outsider that looks like a pretty easy day, but we know it's not. Those stress hormones build up fast and because you can't get up to work them off or give them some physical purpose, you sit tensed, bouncing a leg, shoulders up to the ears, etc etc. Your body suffers and really, the output for the day could have probably been done with only 4 hours of actual computer time, instead of 8. So, open up the opportunity for our programmers to move around by doing some other stuff. If no work tasks can be assigned, the programmer should just get those 2 on/2 off times to do what they think is best, because, as far as the employer is concerned, if the output each day remains the same, who cares? Nothing changes for them and you get to stop being a pressure cooker of cortisol. Understandably, my idea needs some massaging, so don't take any of this as 'this is the way it must be to work.' Consider it a work in progress and your suggestions are welcome.

krior 2y ago

Try to get movement in whenever possible. Take the stairs, pace around during calls (when you do not share an office). Get up and stretch between "work segments". And my favorite new tool: A skipping rope that I use whenever I feel too tired/ like my concentration is breaking / I do not want to do, what I currently have to do. (Mind you, there is a storage room big enough next to my office room that is right above the underground garage, so I will not disturb my colleagues.). Before that, I used to climb the stairs to the top of my office building (five floors) and down to "unfog" my mind and get some energy back.

skirmish 2y ago
I once got a bright idea to climb up the stairs to the 13th floor where our office was located. Once I got there, I found that doors can only be opened from the inside, so I climbed 13 floors down and took an elevator up again like a good little sheep.

stocknoob 2y ago

My 2c if helpful: the solution was to question deeper assumptions. Why are you at a desk? Because you have to work 8 hours. Why? Because your job requires it. Why do you have that job? Because you need income to live. Is a job the only way to have income to live? (See: FI). Ultimately the root cause is not being in control of your time. It takes time, but once solved the downstream problems solve themselves. You can work (exert effort on goals you care about) in a way that prioritizes your health.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

tikhonj 2y ago

I've developed two habits that work well for me: 1. Taking walks during the day. I have figured out a lot of tricky design and even debugging questions by taking a walk. And even if I don't think about programming directly, it still clears my head. Splitting my day up with an hour (or longer) walk leaves me more effective than spending the same time in front of my computer. I usually work remotely, so often this involves walking to a cafe, doing some work there and walking back. 2. Taking walking meetings. I've found this works well for 1:1s, and it works reasonably well for large calls where I don't need to participate much. There are lots of meetings where it's too awkward or doesn't work at all, but converting even a small fraction of my meetings to walking meetings is a real improvement. Of course, both of these assume a flexible culture where this does not make me look like a slacker and where I can take meetings in different ways. But I figure that's a minimum for having a healthy and productive work environment regardless!

aeternum 2y ago
The videocall obsession has got to stop for #2 to work. It used to be much easier to do walking meetings and walking calls, now every external call has to be on video and even internal calls there are plenty of people that subtly guilt you or assume you're not actually working if you have video off. I'm about to start leaving video on with the phone in my pocket as I walk.
- tikhonj 2y ago
  Yeah, I've been lucky to work on teams where people are pretty flexible about having video on or off. And for 1:1s walking meetings can work well in person too :)

jltsiren 2y ago

I think it's less about deliberate tricks and more about developing habits that ensure some low intensity activity throughout the day. Most things you do on a computer don't actually require being in front of the computer all the time. There are always moments when you are waiting for something to happen or thinking about something instead of actually doing it. You can use those moments to snap out of the torpor, even if just for a few seconds.

satvikpendem 2y ago

I saw this comment by the user smeej recently on Ask HN about your best purchases of 2024 [0]: > Semi-recumbent stationary bike that fits under my standing desk. > I've never been coordinated enough to get the hang of walking on the treadmill and typing, but pedaling slowly all day I can do! I've lost 45 lbs so far this year, and adding up the calorie estimate for each day (I've been tracking) and dividing by the 3500 calories people say are in a pound, about 20 of them have been from the bike! (The rest have been from hard work with a dietitian who helped me solve some longstanding issues, but that was more expensive.) [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42080255 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42080255

dagmx 2y ago

I change positions throughout the day (Apple Watch is good for reminding to move) But also for me , if I’m at home, I take my dog for walks during the day and just make up the time later if needed. It breaks things up. Or if I’m in the office I go for thinking walks to plan out what I’m doing

0xEF 2y ago

I was not in the same industry, but I once had a remote job that kept me tethered to my desk because I was constantly responding to phone calls. After about two months of that, I ended up purchasing a cheap walking pad (think slow treadmill with no side rails that only goes at walking pace) from Amazon for about $120USD. This was not a perfect solution, any stretch, it provided movement instead of just standing in place. What I mean by "rethink the way we work" is that jobs like yours (and you may not agree with this) need to be broken up into smaller chunks through the day. So, you work for 2 hours, do something else for 2 hours, work a little more for 2 hours, and so on. I work beside a lot of programmers and CAD designers in my industry and, in fact, am trying to move over to their side of the team (currently I am the guy who builds, tests and repairs the machines they create). One thing I feel is universally true is that, while you may be sitting at your desk for 8 hours, you are really only doing any actual work for about half the time, possibly less. Here me out; sitting in front of a computer is tough on both the brain and body. When you are tethered to the desk and 90% of your job is cerebral, to an outsider that looks like a pretty easy day, but we know it's not. Those stress hormones build up fast and because you can't get up to work them off or give them some physical purpose, you sit tensed, bouncing a leg, shoulders up to the ears, etc etc. Your body suffers and really, the output for the day could have probably been done with only 4 hours of actual computer time, instead of 8. So, open up the opportunity for our programmers to move around by doing some other stuff. If no work tasks can be assigned, the programmer should just get those 2 on/2 off times to do what they think is best, because, as far as the employer is concerned, if the output each day remains the same, who cares? Nothing changes for them and you get to stop being a pressure cooker of cortisol. Understandably, my idea needs some massaging, so don't take any of this as 'this is the way it must be to work.' Consider it a work in progress and your suggestions are welcome.