4 ms·

Voter ID laws do, in fact, just make sense.

by coolspot 2y ago

briantakita 2y ago
[flagged]
- 78653644 2y ago
  "I tried to be civil, but people didn't like what I had to say. Rather than asking why they disagree, I'm going to assume they're evil criminals."
  - briantakita 2y ago
    [flagged]
seadan83 2y ago
Drivers license or a hunting license are acceptable but student ID is not acceptable to vote does not make sense. Further, it is a superficially reasonable solution to a non-problem. Fwiw: "time and time again, voter photo ID laws are proven to be ineffective tools to fight voter fraud — in the rare instances it does take place. While voter photo ID laws aim to prevent in-person voter impersonation, an almost non-existent form of voter fraud, other types of voter impersonation are similarly rare and not cause for significant concern. According to the Brennan Center, the rate of in-person voter impersonation is extremely low: only 0.00004% of all ballots cast. It’s worth noting that this rate is even significantly lower than other rare forms of voter fraud, such as absentee ballot fraud, which voter photo ID laws do not address." "Voter fraud is so extremely rare. Out of 250,000,000 votes cast by mail between 2000 and 2020, there were 193 criminal convictions. By those numbers, a person is more likely to be struck by lightning than they are to commit voter fraud. Further, there are already measures in place to detect irregularities and investigate potential cases of voter fraud, making the need for further legislation even smaller." https://www.lwv.org/blog/whats-so-bad-about-voter-id-laws https://www.lwv.org/blog/whats-so-bad-about-voter-id-laws
- skissane 2y ago
  > Drivers license or a hunting license are acceptable but student ID is not acceptable to vote does not make sense. Drivers licenses are issued by a single state-wide government agency in each state and there are national standards for their security. Student IDs are issued by thousands of educational institutions, both public and private, and they don't have the same security standards. It is much easier for election officials to distinguish genuine from fake drivers licenses than genuine from fake student IDs, so it actually makes a lot of sense to accept the former as voting ID but not the latter. I know less about hunting licenses, but if they are issued by a statewide agency, they would be closer to drivers licenses than student IDs, so accepting them but not student IDs makes sense too.
  - seadan83 2y ago
    If a persons goal is to disenfranchise young & poor voters, but enfranchise those that hunt and or have more money (which closely associates to being white), then hunting license & drivers license makes perfect sense while rejecting student licenses. To your point of how official they are to obtain: "Hunting licenses can generally be purchased at any retail outlet that deals in hunting and fishing equipment, such as sporting goods stores." [1] University ID cards are generally hard to get, and significant if forged. Let's not gloss over the other side of this coin where this type of fraud that is prevented by voter id is vanishingly small. To be blunt, it really is just a modern poll tax, a way to disenfranchise specific demographics. [1] https://www.fws.gov/initiative/hunting/purchase-hunting-license https://www.fws.gov/initiative/hunting/purchase-hunting-lice...
Spooky23 2y ago
It’s a solution that “just makes sense” only if you are ignorant of both the problems it claims to solve and the problems it creates. It’s kinda like the DNSSEC of politics.
DesiLurker 2y ago
problem is now that the election is over no one will take about voter id anymore. for a large population base the time to do it in good faith is now when you have most chance of uptake. but the way id laws get brought up is basically near the finish line so the only conclusion that can be drawn is they are there to discourage voting by 'undesirable' groups.

Voter ID laws do, in fact, just make sense.

briantakita 2y ago

[flagged]

78653644 2y ago
"I tried to be civil, but people didn't like what I had to say. Rather than asking why they disagree, I'm going to assume they're evil criminals."
- briantakita 2y ago
  [flagged]

seadan83 2y ago

Drivers license or a hunting license are acceptable but student ID is not acceptable to vote does not make sense. Further, it is a superficially reasonable solution to a non-problem. Fwiw: "time and time again, voter photo ID laws are proven to be ineffective tools to fight voter fraud — in the rare instances it does take place. While voter photo ID laws aim to prevent in-person voter impersonation, an almost non-existent form of voter fraud, other types of voter impersonation are similarly rare and not cause for significant concern. According to the Brennan Center, the rate of in-person voter impersonation is extremely low: only 0.00004% of all ballots cast. It’s worth noting that this rate is even significantly lower than other rare forms of voter fraud, such as absentee ballot fraud, which voter photo ID laws do not address." "Voter fraud is so extremely rare. Out of 250,000,000 votes cast by mail between 2000 and 2020, there were 193 criminal convictions. By those numbers, a person is more likely to be struck by lightning than they are to commit voter fraud. Further, there are already measures in place to detect irregularities and investigate potential cases of voter fraud, making the need for further legislation even smaller." https://www.lwv.org/blog/whats-so-bad-about-voter-id-laws https://www.lwv.org/blog/whats-so-bad-about-voter-id-laws

skissane 2y ago
> Drivers license or a hunting license are acceptable but student ID is not acceptable to vote does not make sense. Drivers licenses are issued by a single state-wide government agency in each state and there are national standards for their security. Student IDs are issued by thousands of educational institutions, both public and private, and they don't have the same security standards. It is much easier for election officials to distinguish genuine from fake drivers licenses than genuine from fake student IDs, so it actually makes a lot of sense to accept the former as voting ID but not the latter. I know less about hunting licenses, but if they are issued by a statewide agency, they would be closer to drivers licenses than student IDs, so accepting them but not student IDs makes sense too.
- seadan83 2y ago
  If a persons goal is to disenfranchise young & poor voters, but enfranchise those that hunt and or have more money (which closely associates to being white), then hunting license & drivers license makes perfect sense while rejecting student licenses. To your point of how official they are to obtain: "Hunting licenses can generally be purchased at any retail outlet that deals in hunting and fishing equipment, such as sporting goods stores." [1] University ID cards are generally hard to get, and significant if forged. Let's not gloss over the other side of this coin where this type of fraud that is prevented by voter id is vanishingly small. To be blunt, it really is just a modern poll tax, a way to disenfranchise specific demographics. [1] https://www.fws.gov/initiative/hunting/purchase-hunting-license https://www.fws.gov/initiative/hunting/purchase-hunting-lice...

Spooky23 2y ago

It’s a solution that “just makes sense” only if you are ignorant of both the problems it claims to solve and the problems it creates. It’s kinda like the DNSSEC of politics.

DesiLurker 2y ago

problem is now that the election is over no one will take about voter id anymore. for a large population base the time to do it in good faith is now when you have most chance of uptake. but the way id laws get brought up is basically near the finish line so the only conclusion that can be drawn is they are there to discourage voting by 'undesirable' groups.