5 ms·

Maybe they could start picking up a phonetic alphabet in the meantime, so it doesn't take me that long to become competent with their written language.

mkr-hn 14y ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinyin http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinyin
- WiseWeasel 14y ago
  That doesn't appear to be used for internal communication, but rather for communicating with foreigners. I'm sure many millions of young Chinese schoolchildren would love it if Pinyin was adopted as a native written language, so they wouldn't have to spend quite so much mental effort memorizing the tens of thousands of characters needed to qualify for a diploma. Same goes for Japanese schoolchildren, since they're plagued with a non-phonetic alphabet as well. The widely-used phonetic [hiragana] alphabet is ready to replace their daunting kanji alphabet imported from China.
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
  - jmadsen 14y ago
    Won't start a big argument, but replacing kanji with hiragana would make the language a vaguely-worded nightmare. Massive number of homonyms; huge number of verbs with slightly different nuance achieved through a different choice of kanji. The language IS evolving toward hiragana for simple, everyday words, but ask any adult who has to read children's books (all in hiragana) how painful it is to group the words correctly and you'll agree a bigger change won't come soon.
    - WiseWeasel 14y ago
      If there are many homonyms that could be mistaken despite context, how do people understand the spoken language? Are verbal inflections incompletely represented in hiragana versus kanji? As for grouping into words, other languages have found spaces useful. ; )
      - Natsu 14y ago
        There's a tonal accent, which is not conveyed in writing. I believe there are some regional variations of it, too. In Japanese, it's related to something called the "accent nucleus." Googling that will give you a lot of random scholarly articles. Oddly enough the best simple explanation I could find was this: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100122132557AAxv6Wy http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100122132557AA...
        WiseWeasel 14y ago
        So not only does hiragana need spaces, but it also needs accents?
        Natsu 14y ago
        Sort of. You're forgetting katakana, though. And there's still ambiguity, but live speakers know how to avoid it... usually. There's just so much nuance they convey that the language would be less expressive without kanji. Even if they are a pain in the rear to study.
        WiseWeasel 14y ago
        You're forgetting katakana, though. Yeah... about that. Do you really need two different phonetic alphabets? I mean, c'mon! Give a lazy gaijin a break!
        mkr-hn 14y ago
        http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090420033449AAZgP3z http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090420033449AA... "Katakana are not used only for foreign words. Katakana are also used with onomatopoeia, newly coined words, names when you don't know the kanji, and more. Furthermore, katakana can be used to vary the style in writing. It is not uncommon to see an entire sentence in nothing but katakana, often to express a certain emotion (even when it lacks foreign words altogether). In other words, ヲ is actually used once in a while. In addition, in ancient times, katakana were considered the proper way to write the language, while hiragana were considered sloppy and vulgar. In this respect, katakana can be used to evoke an archaic style. "

mkr-hn 14y ago

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinyin http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinyin

WiseWeasel 14y ago
That doesn't appear to be used for internal communication, but rather for communicating with foreigners. I'm sure many millions of young Chinese schoolchildren would love it if Pinyin was adopted as a native written language, so they wouldn't have to spend quite so much mental effort memorizing the tens of thousands of characters needed to qualify for a diploma. Same goes for Japanese schoolchildren, since they're plagued with a non-phonetic alphabet as well. The widely-used phonetic [hiragana] alphabet is ready to replace their daunting kanji alphabet imported from China.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- jmadsen 14y ago
  Won't start a big argument, but replacing kanji with hiragana would make the language a vaguely-worded nightmare. Massive number of homonyms; huge number of verbs with slightly different nuance achieved through a different choice of kanji. The language IS evolving toward hiragana for simple, everyday words, but ask any adult who has to read children's books (all in hiragana) how painful it is to group the words correctly and you'll agree a bigger change won't come soon.
  - WiseWeasel 14y ago
    If there are many homonyms that could be mistaken despite context, how do people understand the spoken language? Are verbal inflections incompletely represented in hiragana versus kanji? As for grouping into words, other languages have found spaces useful. ; )
    - Natsu 14y ago
      There's a tonal accent, which is not conveyed in writing. I believe there are some regional variations of it, too. In Japanese, it's related to something called the "accent nucleus." Googling that will give you a lot of random scholarly articles. Oddly enough the best simple explanation I could find was this: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100122132557AAxv6Wy http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100122132557AA...
      - WiseWeasel 14y ago
        So not only does hiragana need spaces, but it also needs accents?
        Natsu 14y ago
        Sort of. You're forgetting katakana, though. And there's still ambiguity, but live speakers know how to avoid it... usually. There's just so much nuance they convey that the language would be less expressive without kanji. Even if they are a pain in the rear to study.
        WiseWeasel 14y ago
        You're forgetting katakana, though. Yeah... about that. Do you really need two different phonetic alphabets? I mean, c'mon! Give a lazy gaijin a break!
        mkr-hn 14y ago
        http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090420033449AAZgP3z http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090420033449AA... "Katakana are not used only for foreign words. Katakana are also used with onomatopoeia, newly coined words, names when you don't know the kanji, and more. Furthermore, katakana can be used to vary the style in writing. It is not uncommon to see an entire sentence in nothing but katakana, often to express a certain emotion (even when it lacks foreign words altogether). In other words, ヲ is actually used once in a while. In addition, in ancient times, katakana were considered the proper way to write the language, while hiragana were considered sloppy and vulgar. In this respect, katakana can be used to evoke an archaic style. "