10 ms·

ACLU launches phone app to help motorists secretly record police stops

275 points by MRonney 14y ago

saurik 14y ago
One complexity is that it has been ruled that your cell phone is not a container that protects its contents, so police are allowed to search it without a warrant. This is not true, however, if it is in a physical locked container such as your glove compartment (where it is much less likely to be able to hear anything).
- tuxidomasx 14y ago
  Its probably possible to send the recordings TO a unit inside a locked container in your car (via wifi). I know this might limit the use-cases for an app, as well as require more effort to do, but that would be pretty slick. Another way to protect the recordings is to live stream the audio to the internet (with location info). This way, the data is already stored online before the police have a chance to go poking around in a confiscated phone. Maybe even make the streams available in real-time so people can listen in on live stops as they happen.
  - saurik 14y ago
    To be clear, I was bringing up this concern not to protect the recordings (although I do agree that is an interesting point, albeit one easily solved by the "stream it to the Internet" mechanism), but to point out a practical issue with using your cell phone as the recorder: your cell phone probably has a lot of other things on it, from call histories to SMS logs to photographs, any of which you might not want a police officer randomly digging through "on a whim"; hence the advice people offer to keep it locked in a glove compartment in these situations.
    - stox 14y ago
      Android ICS has an option to encrypt the entire device.
      - sigkill 14y ago
        But are you not required to give the password then?
- DannyBee 14y ago
  In the US, this depends on the state/jurisdiction you are in. It's certainly not the case that cell phone is/is not a container rulings are consistent across the country
  - einhverfr 14y ago
    Beat me to it. Orin Kerr at the Volokh Conspiracy has tended to cover a lot of these cases going both ways. I am not even sure how many jurisdictions have clear case law on the subject yet.
zethraeus 14y ago
>Whether or not you agree with the app How can you not agree with the existence of the damn app?! It just reminds you of, and helps you exercise, your rights.
- lukifer 14y ago
  People defend their oppressors every day, in every culture. Stockholm Syndrome is the rule, not the exception.
  - vecinu 14y ago
    Your comment made me Google 'Stockhold Syndrome' and I spent the next 30 minutes reading about the [1] Kidnapping of Jaycee Lee Dugard. The human mind is absolutely fascinating and scary at the same time. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kidnapping_of_Jaycee_Lee_Dugard http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kidnapping_of_Jaycee_Lee_Dugard
    - einhverfr 14y ago
      The really scary thought is this: All governments function on the basis of active citizen cooperation. If citizens don't cooperate, no government can stand. Maybe what we call Stockholm Syndrome is just a more pronounced pattern that makes possible all of the social control structures that we take for granted all around us every day.
      - AutoCorrect 14y ago
        I'd say that's spot on: YOU didn't form the government you live in, you have been coerced (by force, if necessary) to follow the laws and rules of society since the day you were born.
      - lukifer 14y ago
        I suspect it's an ancient instinct. There is evolutionary utility in joining whatever one perceives as the winning side, and adapting yourself to the tribe.
jessriedel 14y ago
> Whether or not you agree with the app, it's kind of crazy that we've gotten to a point where everybody feels they have to make recordings of everybody else and store them in Iron Mountain just to make sure that justice prevails. The abuse of positions of power (especially in one-on-one situations where the word of one party is taken over another in the absence of contrary evidence) has been around since time immemorial. The only thing that's changed is the technology to record. Robin Hanson has some interesting speculation on why don't see more universal recording of interactions like police stops which are vulnerable to abuse: http://www.overcomingbias.com/2010/06/will-we-allow-recording-police.html http://www.overcomingbias.com/2010/06/will-we-allow-recordin... However, it looks like Hanson may be wrong about whether or not video recording would end up being protected: http://www.digitaltrends.com/photography/recording-police-is-a-constitutional-right-says-doj/ http://www.digitaltrends.com/photography/recording-police-is...
aMtnViewer 14y ago
to bay area'ers: use Waze! the more people that use it the more accurate it will be
Legion 14y ago
> Furthermore, the recordings can be automatically uploaded to secure ACLU-NJ servers so that police can't delete them later. Does it upload while recording, or only after the recording ends? Streaming it during recording is the key feature. Qik does this. If I'm recording you on my phone with Qik, by the time you remove the phone from my hands, it's already too late. The video has been streaming to my Qik account the whole time, and seamlessly transitions from a "live" video stream to a recorded video when the recording session ends.
finnw 14y ago
I just hope the cops don't respond by routinely confiscating smartphones of everyone they stop. "Sorry, but I suspect you are smuggling cocaine inside the case. Don't worry you'll get it back. Well I mean you'll get the pieces back. In three years."
- flyinRyan 14y ago
  They can't do that. If a cop asks for your phone you say no.
tokenadult 14y ago
Maryland is a two-party consent state, but even at that the United States Department of Justice is urging Maryland police agencies to make clear that recording citizen interactions with police is a civil right under federal law that can't be curtailed by state law. http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2012/05/doj-supports-right-to-record/ http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2012/05/doj-supports-right-... http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2012-05-17/news/bs-md-ci-police-recording-doj-20120516_1_officers-police-dispute-recording-police http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2012-05-17/news/bs-md-ci-po... I have every reason to believe that the law will develop in this direction around the country in the United States. In my state (Minnesota), recording conversations has been on the basis of consent of ONE party (as is also true of federal law for interstate conversations, as on long-distance telephone lines), and that will likely become the national norm in general. In the particular case of police interactions with the public, the trend line is likely to be strongly in the direction of anyone in the public being permitted to record police interactions with the public (certainly in the citizen's own space or in public spaces). The trend is also likely to be strongly in the direction of state laws requiring police agencies to record their own interactions with the public, to preserve a more accurate record of the interactions. For years now here in Minnesota, it has been mandatory for all police interrogations to be videotaped, and those interrogation videotapes always have to be preserved to be part of the court record at trial. In-car cameras in police vehicles have helped exonerate several citizens here in Minnesota who were arrested by overzealous police officers (who were then formally reprimanded by their superiors). It helps everyone be more accountable and engage in best practice when police actions are recorded. Judges and legislators live in society with all the rest of us, and they like that kind of transparency. P.S. I should probably point out that I used to be a judicial clerk for the Minnesota Supreme Court, and that some of my law school classmates are in the Minnesota Legislature or in Congress. I'm confident that the more useful technologies for looking after the police will first become generally permitted and eventually generally mandatory.
- einhverfr 14y ago
  2-way consent is easy. Get a bumper sticker which says "I record police stops." The police officer comes up you say "Hello officer. I trust you have seen my bumper sticker. What seems to be the problem?" I think Billy Murphy (a high profile Baltimore defence attorney) suggested something like that with a sign in the cab one could motion to.
ck2 14y ago
Police should be required to record all audio/video when making any kind of stop. It's an official action. Instant dismissal if such recording is purposely incomplete, tampered with or "lost". ps. that ACLU video is just not good on so many levels - they should replace it with something to reflect how serious this is
- paulsutter 14y ago
  Even in jurisdictions where police make recordings, they use the recording to prepare their notes and then dispose of the recording. This is an excellent video to watch in its entirety, but at 45:30 you can see a police officer proudly explain that he destroys recordings after he gets what he wants from them: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc This might help explain the reason to have your own recording.
- rmc 14y ago
  It can also be very benefital for police aswell. It's a great defence against claims of police brutality and abuse. "That cop pushed me!" "We looked at the video, he didn't." It's win win and helps make everyone honest.
  - fl3tch 14y ago
    Unless it's recorded, there's a good chance they won't believe you. Oh, you have a bruise? That could have been caused by anything. Judges and juries tend to side with cops. So cops have little to gain by recording everything, which is of course why they are generally against it. They outlawed it in Illinois before it was overturned.
    - bigiain 14y ago
      "Judges and juries tend to side with cops." I see that becoming less and less true… A couple of recent examples locally: http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/cctv-exposes-police-lie-20120705-21jl5.html http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/cctv-exposes-police-lie-20120705-2... http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/tasered-for-not-showing-his-ticket-20120630-219m3.html http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/tasered-for-not-showing-his-ticket...
stcredzero 14y ago
Someone needs to develop an algorithm or mechanism that allows someone to record their own voice without recording anyone else's speech. Most video recording doesn't run afoul of the law, unless there is a soundtrack. However, recording yourself is okay in most jurisdictions.
- michaelfeathers 14y ago
  That is an important point. The law varies across states. Some states are two-party consent states for audio, and some are single party. Courts seem to be allowing exceptions for recording where there is no anticipation of privacy but, if I remember correctly, stealth recording can tip back towards illegality in some places.
  - darkarmani 14y ago
    Consent is usually for phone calls and amounts to notification (hang up if you don't consent). In public states like MA recording in public is mostly about awareness and not consent. If you have a giant camera recording things they won't succeed in prosecuting you for secretly taping audio.
    - einhverfr 14y ago
      Attention officer: If you do not consent to be recorded, please don't stop me. Thank you and have a nice day ;-)
      - darkarmani 14y ago
        Which is why people are allowed to tape auto of officers with large video cameras -- the press for example.
        einhverfr 14y ago
        Again, my suggestion of a bumper sticker. Given the realities of traffic stops, I think it is entirely to be expected that police will read bumper stickers when running plates etc. It gives fair notice. Every officer will read it. And one can verify at the beginning of the conversation.
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
chris_wot 14y ago
Curious to see how this will be done on iOS - last I checked there was no way of running apps in the background.
- hornbaker 14y ago
  I'd just fake a login screen on the app's main page.
- chris_wot 14y ago
  There is now? That would be sweet! I had a sleep cycle app, but I couldn't lock the phone or switch the app in ios5, basically I would roll on it at night and turn it off... (you had to put it under your bed covers near your head). P.s. to whoever voted me down, a response that I wasn't correct would have added to this discussion!
  - briancooley 14y ago
    Yeah, since iOS4, any app can run in the background for 10 minutes. Certain apps may be approved to run in the background longer. It's covered in the iOS App Programming Guide. Here's a link to the pdf (you might need a developer account to access): http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/iphone/conceptual/iphoneosprogrammingguide/iphoneappprogrammingguide.pdf http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/iphone/... If you can't or don't want to access the pdf, here's a link to a SO answer I gave on the subject: http://stackoverflow.com/a/9738707/239074 http://stackoverflow.com/a/9738707/239074
    - chris_wot 14y ago
      That wouldn't be too good for lengthy confrontations...
- 54mf 14y ago
  I'd imagine a totally black screen would do the trick in keeping the app hidden, or at least less obvious.
kloncks 14y ago
Curious to see how applicable this is in states like California where one can't record another without their consent. Wouldn't that apply to the policeman being recorded as well?
- cbr 14y ago
  In MA we recently had a suit (Click v Cunniffe) over whether it's legal to record police. We're a two party consent state, but the judge ruled: Simply put, a straightforward reading of the statute and case law cannot support the suggestion that a recording made with a device known to record audio and held in plain view is "secret." http://www.citmedialaw.org/sites/citmedialaw.org/files/10-1764P-01A.pdf http://www.citmedialaw.org/sites/citmedialaw.org/files/10-17... (not a lawyer)
- Domenic_S 14y ago
  That only applies if there's a reasonable expectation of privacy. The sidewalk or side of the road is not a place where you could reasonably expect privacy.
Mizza 14y ago
Hi, I'm Rich, I run http://OpenWatch.net http://OpenWatch.net, we made this app for the ACLU. It is a fork of our Free and Open Source program, OpenWatch. The really interesting part is that we get thousands of the recordings send back to us. The app has been out for more than a year and we have collected thousands of recordings. We need people to help process all of the data. If you have any experience with audio processing, trans-coding audio, or data visualization, please get in touch! - rich@gun.io (Source: https://github.com/Miserlou/OpenWatch---Android/network https://github.com/Miserlou/OpenWatch---Android/network iPhone Version: http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/cop-recorder/id433040863?mt=8 http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/cop-recorder/id433040863?mt=8 )
- DanBC 14y ago
  Isn't this something that could be Mechanical Turked?
  - MichaelApproved 14y ago
    I think they're looking for volunteers.
    - Mizza 14y ago
      Volunteers, or hackers who want to work on something automated. We have a whoolllle lot of audio, to transcribe it all on MTurk with the resources we have (ie, none) - would be very cost prohibitive. What we need is a system which can convert 3gp to something more usable, automatically remove noise, automatically remove silent parts, automatically adjust the levels for speech, and then automatically transcribe them. It's a challenge.
      - daeken 14y ago
        Pretty much everything but automatic transcription is pretty straightforward. Feel free to email me if you want some advice in that regard (email's in my profile).
- 14y ago
telecuda 14y ago
If I'm the cop conducting the traffic stop and see someone suspiciously reaching in their pocket for an object, I'm drawing my gun. I could see this being used as a bystander to an arrest, but doing anything short of keeping your hands free and visible during a traffic stop is dangerous. -Guy who makes tech for cops
- quesera 14y ago
  Where do you keep your driver's license, then?
  - Wingman4l7 14y ago
    I would imagine it's one thing if they ask you to give them your license, and another entirely if you start reaching for something on your own accord. Unfortunately, being stopped by a LEO (law enforcement officer) can be flustering and you might not stop to think about it. I imagine that the LEO basically needs to treat everyone as potentially hostile until proven otherwise, for their own safety. I've read whole forum threads discussing how to inform a LEO that you have a concealed carry license and a firearm on your person at a traffic stop, without freaking them out. Once I made the stupidly embarrassing mistake of attempting to exit my vehicle during a stop; the LEOs got hostile very quickly and I ended up getting frisked.
    - ars 14y ago
      > Once I made the stupidly embarrassing mistake of attempting to exit my vehicle during a stop Yah, don't do that! Best thing is to do after pulling over is turn on the interior lights, roll down the window, turn off the radio, and then wait. Doing that will calm the cop since he can see you easily, which can only work in your favor. Some cops will ask you to turn of the engine, or leave the car, but most won't.
      - Wingman4l7 14y ago
        Hence the "stupidly embarrassing" bit. All the more mad at myself because I knew better -- the old "hands on the steering wheel" rule (although in that case I wasn't driving). Not sure if preemptively rolling the window down would make them nervous; I'd tend not to do that. I'd think leaving the engine on would make them nervous, too.

275 points by MRonney 14y ago

One complexity is that it has been ruled that your cell phone is not a container that protects its contents, so police are allowed to search it without a warrant. This is not true, however, if it is in a physical locked container such as your glove compartment (where it is much less likely to be able to hear anything).

tuxidomasx 14y ago
Its probably possible to send the recordings TO a unit inside a locked container in your car (via wifi). I know this might limit the use-cases for an app, as well as require more effort to do, but that would be pretty slick. Another way to protect the recordings is to live stream the audio to the internet (with location info). This way, the data is already stored online before the police have a chance to go poking around in a confiscated phone. Maybe even make the streams available in real-time so people can listen in on live stops as they happen.
- saurik 14y ago
  To be clear, I was bringing up this concern not to protect the recordings (although I do agree that is an interesting point, albeit one easily solved by the "stream it to the Internet" mechanism), but to point out a practical issue with using your cell phone as the recorder: your cell phone probably has a lot of other things on it, from call histories to SMS logs to photographs, any of which you might not want a police officer randomly digging through "on a whim"; hence the advice people offer to keep it locked in a glove compartment in these situations.
  - stox 14y ago
    Android ICS has an option to encrypt the entire device.
    - sigkill 14y ago
      But are you not required to give the password then?
DannyBee 14y ago
In the US, this depends on the state/jurisdiction you are in. It's certainly not the case that cell phone is/is not a container rulings are consistent across the country
- einhverfr 14y ago
  Beat me to it. Orin Kerr at the Volokh Conspiracy has tended to cover a lot of these cases going both ways. I am not even sure how many jurisdictions have clear case law on the subject yet.

zethraeus 14y ago

>Whether or not you agree with the app How can you not agree with the existence of the damn app?! It just reminds you of, and helps you exercise, your rights.

lukifer 14y ago
People defend their oppressors every day, in every culture. Stockholm Syndrome is the rule, not the exception.
- vecinu 14y ago
  Your comment made me Google 'Stockhold Syndrome' and I spent the next 30 minutes reading about the [1] Kidnapping of Jaycee Lee Dugard. The human mind is absolutely fascinating and scary at the same time. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kidnapping_of_Jaycee_Lee_Dugard http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kidnapping_of_Jaycee_Lee_Dugard
  - einhverfr 14y ago
    The really scary thought is this: All governments function on the basis of active citizen cooperation. If citizens don't cooperate, no government can stand. Maybe what we call Stockholm Syndrome is just a more pronounced pattern that makes possible all of the social control structures that we take for granted all around us every day.
    - AutoCorrect 14y ago
      I'd say that's spot on: YOU didn't form the government you live in, you have been coerced (by force, if necessary) to follow the laws and rules of society since the day you were born.
    - lukifer 14y ago
      I suspect it's an ancient instinct. There is evolutionary utility in joining whatever one perceives as the winning side, and adapting yourself to the tribe.

jessriedel 14y ago

> Whether or not you agree with the app, it's kind of crazy that we've gotten to a point where everybody feels they have to make recordings of everybody else and store them in Iron Mountain just to make sure that justice prevails. The abuse of positions of power (especially in one-on-one situations where the word of one party is taken over another in the absence of contrary evidence) has been around since time immemorial. The only thing that's changed is the technology to record. Robin Hanson has some interesting speculation on why don't see more universal recording of interactions like police stops which are vulnerable to abuse: http://www.overcomingbias.com/2010/06/will-we-allow-recording-police.html http://www.overcomingbias.com/2010/06/will-we-allow-recordin... However, it looks like Hanson may be wrong about whether or not video recording would end up being protected: http://www.digitaltrends.com/photography/recording-police-is-a-constitutional-right-says-doj/ http://www.digitaltrends.com/photography/recording-police-is...

aMtnViewer 14y ago

to bay area'ers: use Waze! the more people that use it the more accurate it will be

Legion 14y ago

> Furthermore, the recordings can be automatically uploaded to secure ACLU-NJ servers so that police can't delete them later. Does it upload while recording, or only after the recording ends? Streaming it during recording is the key feature. Qik does this. If I'm recording you on my phone with Qik, by the time you remove the phone from my hands, it's already too late. The video has been streaming to my Qik account the whole time, and seamlessly transitions from a "live" video stream to a recorded video when the recording session ends.

finnw 14y ago

I just hope the cops don't respond by routinely confiscating smartphones of everyone they stop. "Sorry, but I suspect you are smuggling cocaine inside the case. Don't worry you'll get it back. Well I mean you'll get the pieces back. In three years."

flyinRyan 14y ago
They can't do that. If a cop asks for your phone you say no.

tokenadult 14y ago

Maryland is a two-party consent state, but even at that the United States Department of Justice is urging Maryland police agencies to make clear that recording citizen interactions with police is a civil right under federal law that can't be curtailed by state law. http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2012/05/doj-supports-right-to-record/ http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2012/05/doj-supports-right-... http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2012-05-17/news/bs-md-ci-police-recording-doj-20120516_1_officers-police-dispute-recording-police http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2012-05-17/news/bs-md-ci-po... I have every reason to believe that the law will develop in this direction around the country in the United States. In my state (Minnesota), recording conversations has been on the basis of consent of ONE party (as is also true of federal law for interstate conversations, as on long-distance telephone lines), and that will likely become the national norm in general. In the particular case of police interactions with the public, the trend line is likely to be strongly in the direction of anyone in the public being permitted to record police interactions with the public (certainly in the citizen's own space or in public spaces). The trend is also likely to be strongly in the direction of state laws requiring police agencies to record their own interactions with the public, to preserve a more accurate record of the interactions. For years now here in Minnesota, it has been mandatory for all police interrogations to be videotaped, and those interrogation videotapes always have to be preserved to be part of the court record at trial. In-car cameras in police vehicles have helped exonerate several citizens here in Minnesota who were arrested by overzealous police officers (who were then formally reprimanded by their superiors). It helps everyone be more accountable and engage in best practice when police actions are recorded. Judges and legislators live in society with all the rest of us, and they like that kind of transparency. P.S. I should probably point out that I used to be a judicial clerk for the Minnesota Supreme Court, and that some of my law school classmates are in the Minnesota Legislature or in Congress. I'm confident that the more useful technologies for looking after the police will first become generally permitted and eventually generally mandatory.

einhverfr 14y ago
2-way consent is easy. Get a bumper sticker which says "I record police stops." The police officer comes up you say "Hello officer. I trust you have seen my bumper sticker. What seems to be the problem?" I think Billy Murphy (a high profile Baltimore defence attorney) suggested something like that with a sign in the cab one could motion to.

ck2 14y ago

Police should be required to record all audio/video when making any kind of stop. It's an official action. Instant dismissal if such recording is purposely incomplete, tampered with or "lost". ps. that ACLU video is just not good on so many levels - they should replace it with something to reflect how serious this is

paulsutter 14y ago
Even in jurisdictions where police make recordings, they use the recording to prepare their notes and then dispose of the recording. This is an excellent video to watch in its entirety, but at 45:30 you can see a police officer proudly explain that he destroys recordings after he gets what he wants from them: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc This might help explain the reason to have your own recording.
rmc 14y ago
It can also be very benefital for police aswell. It's a great defence against claims of police brutality and abuse. "That cop pushed me!" "We looked at the video, he didn't." It's win win and helps make everyone honest.
- fl3tch 14y ago
  Unless it's recorded, there's a good chance they won't believe you. Oh, you have a bruise? That could have been caused by anything. Judges and juries tend to side with cops. So cops have little to gain by recording everything, which is of course why they are generally against it. They outlawed it in Illinois before it was overturned.
  - bigiain 14y ago
    "Judges and juries tend to side with cops." I see that becoming less and less true… A couple of recent examples locally: http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/cctv-exposes-police-lie-20120705-21jl5.html http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/cctv-exposes-police-lie-20120705-2... http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/tasered-for-not-showing-his-ticket-20120630-219m3.html http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/tasered-for-not-showing-his-ticket...

stcredzero 14y ago

Someone needs to develop an algorithm or mechanism that allows someone to record their own voice without recording anyone else's speech. Most video recording doesn't run afoul of the law, unless there is a soundtrack. However, recording yourself is okay in most jurisdictions.

michaelfeathers 14y ago
That is an important point. The law varies across states. Some states are two-party consent states for audio, and some are single party. Courts seem to be allowing exceptions for recording where there is no anticipation of privacy but, if I remember correctly, stealth recording can tip back towards illegality in some places.
- darkarmani 14y ago
  Consent is usually for phone calls and amounts to notification (hang up if you don't consent). In public states like MA recording in public is mostly about awareness and not consent. If you have a giant camera recording things they won't succeed in prosecuting you for secretly taping audio.
  - einhverfr 14y ago
    Attention officer: If you do not consent to be recorded, please don't stop me. Thank you and have a nice day ;-)
    - darkarmani 14y ago
      Which is why people are allowed to tape auto of officers with large video cameras -- the press for example.
      - einhverfr 14y ago
        Again, my suggestion of a bumper sticker. Given the realities of traffic stops, I think it is entirely to be expected that police will read bumper stickers when running plates etc. It gives fair notice. Every officer will read it. And one can verify at the beginning of the conversation.

deleted 14y ago

[deleted]

chris_wot 14y ago

Curious to see how this will be done on iOS - last I checked there was no way of running apps in the background.

hornbaker 14y ago
I'd just fake a login screen on the app's main page.
chris_wot 14y ago
There is now? That would be sweet! I had a sleep cycle app, but I couldn't lock the phone or switch the app in ios5, basically I would roll on it at night and turn it off... (you had to put it under your bed covers near your head). P.s. to whoever voted me down, a response that I wasn't correct would have added to this discussion!
- briancooley 14y ago
  Yeah, since iOS4, any app can run in the background for 10 minutes. Certain apps may be approved to run in the background longer. It's covered in the iOS App Programming Guide. Here's a link to the pdf (you might need a developer account to access): http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/iphone/conceptual/iphoneosprogrammingguide/iphoneappprogrammingguide.pdf http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/iphone/... If you can't or don't want to access the pdf, here's a link to a SO answer I gave on the subject: http://stackoverflow.com/a/9738707/239074 http://stackoverflow.com/a/9738707/239074
  - chris_wot 14y ago
    That wouldn't be too good for lengthy confrontations...
54mf 14y ago
I'd imagine a totally black screen would do the trick in keeping the app hidden, or at least less obvious.

kloncks 14y ago

Curious to see how applicable this is in states like California where one can't record another without their consent. Wouldn't that apply to the policeman being recorded as well?

cbr 14y ago
In MA we recently had a suit (Click v Cunniffe) over whether it's legal to record police. We're a two party consent state, but the judge ruled: Simply put, a straightforward reading of the statute and case law cannot support the suggestion that a recording made with a device known to record audio and held in plain view is "secret." http://www.citmedialaw.org/sites/citmedialaw.org/files/10-1764P-01A.pdf http://www.citmedialaw.org/sites/citmedialaw.org/files/10-17... (not a lawyer)
Domenic_S 14y ago
That only applies if there's a reasonable expectation of privacy. The sidewalk or side of the road is not a place where you could reasonably expect privacy.

Mizza 14y ago

Hi, I'm Rich, I run http://OpenWatch.net http://OpenWatch.net, we made this app for the ACLU. It is a fork of our Free and Open Source program, OpenWatch. The really interesting part is that we get thousands of the recordings send back to us. The app has been out for more than a year and we have collected thousands of recordings. We need people to help process all of the data. If you have any experience with audio processing, trans-coding audio, or data visualization, please get in touch! - rich@gun.io (Source: https://github.com/Miserlou/OpenWatch---Android/network https://github.com/Miserlou/OpenWatch---Android/network iPhone Version: http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/cop-recorder/id433040863?mt=8 http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/cop-recorder/id433040863?mt=8 )

DanBC 14y ago
Isn't this something that could be Mechanical Turked?
- MichaelApproved 14y ago
  I think they're looking for volunteers.
  - Mizza 14y ago
    Volunteers, or hackers who want to work on something automated. We have a whoolllle lot of audio, to transcribe it all on MTurk with the resources we have (ie, none) - would be very cost prohibitive. What we need is a system which can convert 3gp to something more usable, automatically remove noise, automatically remove silent parts, automatically adjust the levels for speech, and then automatically transcribe them. It's a challenge.
    - daeken 14y ago
      Pretty much everything but automatic transcription is pretty straightforward. Feel free to email me if you want some advice in that regard (email's in my profile).
14y ago

telecuda 14y ago

If I'm the cop conducting the traffic stop and see someone suspiciously reaching in their pocket for an object, I'm drawing my gun. I could see this being used as a bystander to an arrest, but doing anything short of keeping your hands free and visible during a traffic stop is dangerous. -Guy who makes tech for cops

quesera 14y ago
Where do you keep your driver's license, then?
- Wingman4l7 14y ago
  I would imagine it's one thing if they ask you to give them your license, and another entirely if you start reaching for something on your own accord. Unfortunately, being stopped by a LEO (law enforcement officer) can be flustering and you might not stop to think about it. I imagine that the LEO basically needs to treat everyone as potentially hostile until proven otherwise, for their own safety. I've read whole forum threads discussing how to inform a LEO that you have a concealed carry license and a firearm on your person at a traffic stop, without freaking them out. Once I made the stupidly embarrassing mistake of attempting to exit my vehicle during a stop; the LEOs got hostile very quickly and I ended up getting frisked.
  - ars 14y ago
    > Once I made the stupidly embarrassing mistake of attempting to exit my vehicle during a stop Yah, don't do that! Best thing is to do after pulling over is turn on the interior lights, roll down the window, turn off the radio, and then wait. Doing that will calm the cop since he can see you easily, which can only work in your favor. Some cops will ask you to turn of the engine, or leave the car, but most won't.
    - Wingman4l7 14y ago
      Hence the "stupidly embarrassing" bit. All the more mad at myself because I knew better -- the old "hands on the steering wheel" rule (although in that case I wasn't driving). Not sure if preemptively rolling the window down would make them nervous; I'd tend not to do that. I'd think leaving the engine on would make them nervous, too.