4 ms·

Is this also true for French with a similar timeline, potentially explaining why Québecois - settled in the 1600s - primarily uses religious swear words?

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
kragen 2y ago
I think the French today mostly say putain, which has mostly lost its literal sense, but my French is not very good.
- 082349872349872 2y ago
  The francophones of my acquaintance mostly do. (although one or two of them use punaise to mince, nom de Dieu !)
- ekianjo 2y ago
  There is a much wider range of swear words than just putain in French. And much more than in English in general which sounds like a poor language for insults to French ears.
  - kragen 2y ago
    Enlighten us! English is of course rather impoverished here. What does the wider range of cursing in French look like, in current use? Do people still say c'est con, ça and sacrebleu!? My own exposure to French cussing in real life has all been putain putain putain.
    - 082349872349872 2y ago
      and if we were to ask Sarko for some big words? https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casse-toi,_pauv%27_con_!#Retentissement_européen https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casse-toi,_pauv%27_con_!#Reten...
      - kragen 2y ago
        Is con even a cussword? Most of the translations are non-taboo insults referring to stupidity rather than to genitalia, with the exception of the Italian and the Argentine rajá, pobre pelotudo, which refers to different genitalia and is not taboo. (The Greek "shabby wanker” is maybe an exception?) But there may be some selection bias involved in the translation sampling process; by definition, taboo words won't be printed in a major newspaper headline. If he had used a racial slur against Maghrebis, for example, the NYT surely would not run a headline containing the N-word.
        kgwgk 2y ago
        The original meaning of "con" is cunt. It's also used for very unpleasant or stupid people (like cunt, but much more).
        082349872349872 2y ago
        Around here, people will say of actions or other people that they are stupid, but not con, so I get the impression it goes well beyond stupidity, into sheer bloody-mindedness. (whether the latter rates cusswordedness I prefer to leave to L1 speakers) Lagniappe: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWCNFzdE31A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWCNFzdE31A (fr-u-sd-caqc)
        kgwgk 2y ago
        I don't where is "around there" but https://www.larousse.fr/dictionnaires/francais/con/17848 https://www.larousse.fr/dictionnaires/francais/con/17848 says: Très familier. Stupide, imbécile, idiot.
        082349872349872 2y ago
        Guess it depends upon the region; https://fr.wiktionary.org/wiki/con#Nom_commun_1 https://fr.wiktionary.org/wiki/con#Nom_commun_1 has an example (sense 3) with the valence I tend to hear: – C'est un imbécile..., lâcha le garçon. – Non, c'est un con. – C'est pareil. M. Pelletier s'arrêta de jouer. – Non, c'est pas pareil. Si tu expliques trois fois un truc à quelqu'un et qu'il ne le comprend pas, c'est un imbécile. Mais si, à la fin, il est certain de l'avoir compris mieux que toi, alors, tu as affaire à un con. — (Pierre Lemaître, Le Grand Monde, Calmann-Lévy, 2022, pages 20-21) (it does seem very mild compared to the evolution and use in russian: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/пиздец#Etymology https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/пиздец#Etymology )

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

kragen 2y ago

I think the French today mostly say putain, which has mostly lost its literal sense, but my French is not very good.

082349872349872 2y ago
The francophones of my acquaintance mostly do. (although one or two of them use punaise to mince, nom de Dieu !)
ekianjo 2y ago
There is a much wider range of swear words than just putain in French. And much more than in English in general which sounds like a poor language for insults to French ears.
- kragen 2y ago
  Enlighten us! English is of course rather impoverished here. What does the wider range of cursing in French look like, in current use? Do people still say c'est con, ça and sacrebleu!? My own exposure to French cussing in real life has all been putain putain putain.
  - 082349872349872 2y ago
    and if we were to ask Sarko for some big words? https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casse-toi,_pauv%27_con_!#Retentissement_européen https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casse-toi,_pauv%27_con_!#Reten...
    - kragen 2y ago
      Is con even a cussword? Most of the translations are non-taboo insults referring to stupidity rather than to genitalia, with the exception of the Italian and the Argentine rajá, pobre pelotudo, which refers to different genitalia and is not taboo. (The Greek "shabby wanker” is maybe an exception?) But there may be some selection bias involved in the translation sampling process; by definition, taboo words won't be printed in a major newspaper headline. If he had used a racial slur against Maghrebis, for example, the NYT surely would not run a headline containing the N-word.
      - kgwgk 2y ago
        The original meaning of "con" is cunt. It's also used for very unpleasant or stupid people (like cunt, but much more).
        082349872349872 2y ago
        Around here, people will say of actions or other people that they are stupid, but not con, so I get the impression it goes well beyond stupidity, into sheer bloody-mindedness. (whether the latter rates cusswordedness I prefer to leave to L1 speakers) Lagniappe: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWCNFzdE31A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWCNFzdE31A (fr-u-sd-caqc)
        kgwgk 2y ago
        I don't where is "around there" but https://www.larousse.fr/dictionnaires/francais/con/17848 https://www.larousse.fr/dictionnaires/francais/con/17848 says: Très familier. Stupide, imbécile, idiot.
        082349872349872 2y ago
        Guess it depends upon the region; https://fr.wiktionary.org/wiki/con#Nom_commun_1 https://fr.wiktionary.org/wiki/con#Nom_commun_1 has an example (sense 3) with the valence I tend to hear: – C'est un imbécile..., lâcha le garçon. – Non, c'est un con. – C'est pareil. M. Pelletier s'arrêta de jouer. – Non, c'est pas pareil. Si tu expliques trois fois un truc à quelqu'un et qu'il ne le comprend pas, c'est un imbécile. Mais si, à la fin, il est certain de l'avoir compris mieux que toi, alors, tu as affaire à un con. — (Pierre Lemaître, Le Grand Monde, Calmann-Lévy, 2022, pages 20-21) (it does seem very mild compared to the evolution and use in russian: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/пиздец#Etymology https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/пиздец#Etymology )