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A few people working for boeing met early unexpected ends as well...

by rijoja 2y ago

nkrisc 2y ago
How many people total work for Boeing? What’s the typical rate at which people die while employed or recently employed by Boeing?
- rijoja 2y ago
  It's not that a huge part of their business-idea is, and has been to build machines designed to kill large amounts of people either.
  - nkrisc 2y ago
    Boeing is a company, and companies don’t make decisions. People do. So who at Boeing is motivated enough to take on the personal liability of a first degree murder conviction?
    - mywacaday 2y ago
      I don't believe there were murders but to speculate I would imagine that large shareholders and not employees would be the more likely culprits.
    - mandmandam 2y ago
      > who at Boeing is motivated enough to take on the personal liability of a first degree murder conviction Say an exec at Boeing paid someone to pay someone to 'handle' the situation. "Will no one rid me of these meddlesome whistleblowers - oops I dropped my huge luggage case of unmarked bills" kind of thing... I'm not saying they did, to be very clear, just answering this hypthetical. Where would you put the odds of that person ever facing "a first degree murder conviction"? If it's anywhere over 1%, I think you might be naive, and would benefit from looking at actual conviction rates for serious crimes (~2%) [0]. Even if they were incredibly sloppy about it, the motivation to admit in front of the world that Boeing did this to multiple whistleblowers is strongly in the wrong direction. And as others have pointed out, repeatedly, Boeing is in the business of killing people. Billions of easy dollars are at stake. So, who at Boeing might be motivated enough to take the <1% chance to keep raking in billions of dollars, protect America's 'reputation' (such as it is), and personally keep cashing in 6 or 7 figures a year? Any of them. Damn near all of them. Easily over 80%. It's not a job for people of conscience. 0 - https://theconversation.com/police-solve-just-2-of-all-major-crimes-143878 https://theconversation.com/police-solve-just-2-of-all-major...
      - gruez 2y ago
        >and would benefit from looking at actual conviction rates for serious crimes (~2%) [0]. Murders have much better clearance rates than other "serious crimes" (whatever that means), so the chances of getting caught is probably far higher than 2%. https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/04/24/what-the-data-says-about-crime-in-the-us/ https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/04/24/what-the-...
        rijoja 2y ago
        Do you think murders are prone to telling people what they done, to make sure that there is solid and accurate statistics, for the benefit of mankind?
        notnaut 2y ago
        Good thing it’s always suicide via gunshot to the back of the head and drowning in freak storms and accidental slips out of hospital windows that keeps taking out these journalists and whistleblowers and not murder!
        mandmandam 2y ago
        > "serious crimes" (whatever that means) If you click the link in the article to the author's paper [0], "serious crimes" are defined in detail... And you were correct to call that out. Thanks! Happy to be wrong on this one. True conviction rates for specifically reported murder/manslaughter are generally around 50%. Theft and Burglary indeed skew the numbers a lot, with an extremely low clearance rate and vastly more reports. (All theft/burglary losses combined are only a fraction of wage theft [1], for perspective.) All that said - if these were murders, they were committed by people with a vastly different set of resources compared to the average 'crime of passion'. I doubt that conviction statistics re professional murder are easy to come by, but I'd bet everything I own that they're significantly lower than 50%. 0 - https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3566383 https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3566383 1 - https://www.epi.org/publication/wage-theft-bigger-problem-forms-theft-workers/ https://www.epi.org/publication/wage-theft-bigger-problem-fo...
- SideburnsOfDoom 2y ago
  And how many of these recently-employed and recently-deceased people were whistle-blowers? I mean, I don't know, it's Boeing, it could be a high percentage.
geysersam 2y ago
But that had a clear motive: stopping them from testifying.
- rijoja 2y ago
  Idk if you think someone owes you 4 billion, maybe you'd start thinking about not letting it slide, and make an example out of him. His co-defendant, did within a few days as well, which is interesting. People die for a lot less, and if you have money on that magnitude, perhaps you can get someone to stage an accident, people die for a lot less.

A few people working for boeing met early unexpected ends as well...

by rijoja 2y ago

A few people working for boeing met early unexpected ends as well...

How many people total work for Boeing? What’s the typical rate at which people die while employed or recently employed by Boeing?

rijoja 2y ago
It's not that a huge part of their business-idea is, and has been to build machines designed to kill large amounts of people either.
- nkrisc 2y ago
  Boeing is a company, and companies don’t make decisions. People do. So who at Boeing is motivated enough to take on the personal liability of a first degree murder conviction?
  - mywacaday 2y ago
    I don't believe there were murders but to speculate I would imagine that large shareholders and not employees would be the more likely culprits.
  - mandmandam 2y ago
    > who at Boeing is motivated enough to take on the personal liability of a first degree murder conviction Say an exec at Boeing paid someone to pay someone to 'handle' the situation. "Will no one rid me of these meddlesome whistleblowers - oops I dropped my huge luggage case of unmarked bills" kind of thing... I'm not saying they did, to be very clear, just answering this hypthetical. Where would you put the odds of that person ever facing "a first degree murder conviction"? If it's anywhere over 1%, I think you might be naive, and would benefit from looking at actual conviction rates for serious crimes (~2%) [0]. Even if they were incredibly sloppy about it, the motivation to admit in front of the world that Boeing did this to multiple whistleblowers is strongly in the wrong direction. And as others have pointed out, repeatedly, Boeing is in the business of killing people. Billions of easy dollars are at stake. So, who at Boeing might be motivated enough to take the <1% chance to keep raking in billions of dollars, protect America's 'reputation' (such as it is), and personally keep cashing in 6 or 7 figures a year? Any of them. Damn near all of them. Easily over 80%. It's not a job for people of conscience. 0 - https://theconversation.com/police-solve-just-2-of-all-major-crimes-143878 https://theconversation.com/police-solve-just-2-of-all-major...
    - gruez 2y ago
      >and would benefit from looking at actual conviction rates for serious crimes (~2%) [0]. Murders have much better clearance rates than other "serious crimes" (whatever that means), so the chances of getting caught is probably far higher than 2%. https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/04/24/what-the-data-says-about-crime-in-the-us/ https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/04/24/what-the-...
      - rijoja 2y ago
        Do you think murders are prone to telling people what they done, to make sure that there is solid and accurate statistics, for the benefit of mankind?
      - notnaut 2y ago
        Good thing it’s always suicide via gunshot to the back of the head and drowning in freak storms and accidental slips out of hospital windows that keeps taking out these journalists and whistleblowers and not murder!
      - mandmandam 2y ago
        > "serious crimes" (whatever that means) If you click the link in the article to the author's paper [0], "serious crimes" are defined in detail... And you were correct to call that out. Thanks! Happy to be wrong on this one. True conviction rates for specifically reported murder/manslaughter are generally around 50%. Theft and Burglary indeed skew the numbers a lot, with an extremely low clearance rate and vastly more reports. (All theft/burglary losses combined are only a fraction of wage theft [1], for perspective.) All that said - if these were murders, they were committed by people with a vastly different set of resources compared to the average 'crime of passion'. I doubt that conviction statistics re professional murder are easy to come by, but I'd bet everything I own that they're significantly lower than 50%. 0 - https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3566383 https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3566383 1 - https://www.epi.org/publication/wage-theft-bigger-problem-forms-theft-workers/ https://www.epi.org/publication/wage-theft-bigger-problem-fo...
SideburnsOfDoom 2y ago
And how many of these recently-employed and recently-deceased people were whistle-blowers? I mean, I don't know, it's Boeing, it could be a high percentage.

geysersam 2y ago

But that had a clear motive: stopping them from testifying.

rijoja 2y ago
Idk if you think someone owes you 4 billion, maybe you'd start thinking about not letting it slide, and make an example out of him. His co-defendant, did within a few days as well, which is interesting. People die for a lot less, and if you have money on that magnitude, perhaps you can get someone to stage an accident, people die for a lot less.