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I doubt air conditioning is as used as internet search engines. The only places where I ever saw air climatisation is cars and business buildings. I never saw o

I doubt air conditioning is as used as internet search engines. The only places where I ever saw air climatisation is cars and business buildings. I never saw one in a personal home, let alone a personal device carried in the pocket you can use while walking.

notfromhere 2y ago
You’ve never seen a first world house with central air?
- dotancohen 2y ago
  GP must live in the UK or India. Well, actually, some homes in India do have A/C.
  - psychoslave 2y ago
    I live in Strasbourg, France.
    - dotancohen 2y ago
      Interesting, thank you. I suppose that you do have heating in the home?
      - thatfrenchguy 2y ago
        Forced-air heating basically does not exist in France :). To be fair, radient heating is always a nicer experience.
      - psychoslave 2y ago
        Yes, actually we finally found a house that was affordable for us last year, and made lot work in it, including wall isolation, changing windows, and install a heat pump, replacing the oil-for hearing system that was in place. Heat pumps are clearly on the rise around here, contrary to AC. There is of course no magic regarding electricity price here, but oil provision and prices are also big unknowns, all the more with the state pushing oil-fire systems out of market as a legal option.
    - TeMPOraL 2y ago
      Doesn't France have extreme heat waves in summer? The way temperatures have been changing in Europe in the past decade, you may not have A/C at home now, but I bet you'll have it in ten years, tops. So will everyone else and their dogs.
      - psychoslave 2y ago
        Yes we have pick heat waves. But that didn't make magically expand incomes that can be dropped in AC installation and operational costs. As I said, in building that are attached to money incomes, be it hostels, shops or restaurants, it's of course something that can balanced within loses and profits. In a personal home, it will be just eat some of your budget. And with electricity price on the rise (and thus basically everything in common goods) and salary stagnation on the other hand, I doubt people here will suddenly rush on AC on massive scales. Plus government apparently are pushing to alternative approach, but I'm just discovering that as this thread launched me on the track to investigate the topic. Personally, I doubt I'll jump to some AC anytime soon. It's just out of reach for my incomes, all the more when there is no basically no chance to see the electricity price plummet while my salary has good chances to continue to stay freezed as it's been for the two last years. And it's not like I feel the most unlucky person in the town, to be clear, my situation is far from the worst ones I can witness around me.
        TeMPOraL 2y ago
        Where I live (Poland), A/C is expensive too, though it's been dropping in price. Portable heat pumps are becoming cheap enough to consider. Fixed installations are doable even in individual flats (obviously cheapest when during general renovation, and boring extra holes in walls isn't a big deal). The last few years made people switch from thinking about A/C as a luxury for the rich, and start thinking about maybe getting it some day. And our heat waves were quite light compared to the rest of Europe.
      - thatfrenchguy 2y ago
        most people in Western Europe don't have A/C, houses are way better insulated for short-term heatwaves and people usually don't mind indoor temperatures of up to 80-84F/26-28C. If you add the general hate French (and I think German?) people have for drafts and air currents in general and you can see how people just deal with the heat in the summer. Not to mention central A/C in the North American sense with a air handler & ducts is just never coming to France, it's such an outdated technology and forced-air heating is generally considered to suck there.
- psychoslave 2y ago
  No. Not a single time I can remember in 40 years of existence living in Europe. Shops, restaurants, airports and things like that which are attached with revenue streams have them. I never been in a billionaire palace thus said.
  - 8n4vidtmkvmk 2y ago
    Not billionaires or even millionaires. This is normal for a middle-class home in Canada and US at least. It's not that expensive to run and those who are tight on cash just run it less, only on really hot days.
- rvense 2y ago
  This is regional. Air conditioning is not at all common in Scandinavian homes.
carlosjobim 2y ago
You really need to broaden your horizons while you still have the chance. This is like believing that boats don't exist because you live inland and have never seen a boat. Hundreds of millions of people are dependent on air conditioning in their homes.
- psychoslave 2y ago
  I'm not sure what you mean with dependent here. I never said that boats or AC don't exist. Both exist, and I did saw and experimented many of them in commercial context. But not everyone can afford them plus the cost to operate them. Sure I should broaden my horizon and even consider to look people enjoying their private jets and some helicopters. But a mere wage slave like myself will never have the chance to afford one, that's for sure. Now let's consider back in initial context: mere mortals around me are definitely all using internet as soon as there parents will let them do so, and even a homeless person can afford a first price mobile access (2€/months) with a phone they can receive for nothing in some charity organizations like Emmaus. So affordability of access to online search is definitely several order below AC.
  - carlosjobim 2y ago
    Air conditioning is not an extravagant luxury, although I know many people who live in cold countries believe so. That's why I'm asking you to broaden your horizons. You don't consider indoor heating or plumbing a luxury to be comparable to a private jet? In hot and humid places, having AC was always a priority a hundred steps above having internet access, until cheap smart phones arrived. And they use a lot of energy, just like heating uses a lot of energy in colder climates.
    - psychoslave 2y ago
      Well, indoor heating is clearly more and more becoming a luxury on the affordability side, enough so that putting a jacket inside is my first go to option when I'm alone at home as I work remotely. But not yet so excited expensive as to private my children from its been benefits when they come back home. And of course nothing like a jet, indeed. Plumbing is generally not also considered a luxury over here. But at mankind level, I do feel particularly privileged on this regard. I remain amazed we have water flowing at will, and even possibility to take hot shower every day. This is not a jet level kind of privilege, but I try to keep myself aware of how incredibly lucky I am to be able to benefit of such a technology and infrastructure. I doubt humans waited AC to come alive for settling hot and humid areas. There are other ways to have cooled down residences which don't require so much sophistication in physic models before you can even dream to build a prototype. All that said, I got your hint to document more on how/why AC is so much more used in some area, and I'm just starting my journey on learning about it. I still doubt that local climate alone explain the difference in term of how common it is in different region of the world. For example USA have a very large set of different local climate, but from what I understand most homes have AC.
psychoslave 2y ago
Wow, didn't expect to be downvoted on something that is so obviously aligned with what I see around me. It is a very strange feeling, very different from downvoted posts that present unpopular opinions. It makes me look at some statistics https://www.statista.com/statistics/911064/worldwide-air-conditioning-penetration-rate-country/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/911064/worldwide-air-con... https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/air-conditioning-usage-by-country https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/air-condi... https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=52558 https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=52558 https://www.rfi.fr/en/france/20220723-france-does-not-use-much-air-conditioning-and-wants-to-keep-it-that-way https://www.rfi.fr/en/france/20220723-france-does-not-use-mu... https://www.reddit.com/r/AskFrance/comments/vhs8dn/how_common_is_air_conditioning/ https://www.reddit.com/r/AskFrance/comments/vhs8dn/how_commo... Apparently, Japan, USA and now China are huge users of AC in personal homes (like more than 90% of them). That's in sharp contrast with what is observed in most of Europe, including France where I live. I never had the opportunity to travel to any of this country, so indeed I was totally blind of this extrem gap in use from my own personal experience.
- BenjiWiebe 2y ago
  We had window unit A/C in our very-poorly-insulated 100 year old farmhouse, when I was growing up and money was very tight, as in if we go shopping and eat out, you're getting water to drink, sharing a meal, and no dessert. Not like starvation levels of poverty but still, money was tight. A/C was not considered optional, even if you could theoretically remain alive when the temperature was over 100F every day for weeks straight and stayed in the 80s (or even 90s) at night.

notfromhere 2y ago

You’ve never seen a first world house with central air?

dotancohen 2y ago
GP must live in the UK or India. Well, actually, some homes in India do have A/C.
- psychoslave 2y ago
  I live in Strasbourg, France.
  - dotancohen 2y ago
    Interesting, thank you. I suppose that you do have heating in the home?
    - thatfrenchguy 2y ago
      Forced-air heating basically does not exist in France :). To be fair, radient heating is always a nicer experience.
    - psychoslave 2y ago
      Yes, actually we finally found a house that was affordable for us last year, and made lot work in it, including wall isolation, changing windows, and install a heat pump, replacing the oil-for hearing system that was in place. Heat pumps are clearly on the rise around here, contrary to AC. There is of course no magic regarding electricity price here, but oil provision and prices are also big unknowns, all the more with the state pushing oil-fire systems out of market as a legal option.
  - TeMPOraL 2y ago
    Doesn't France have extreme heat waves in summer? The way temperatures have been changing in Europe in the past decade, you may not have A/C at home now, but I bet you'll have it in ten years, tops. So will everyone else and their dogs.
    - psychoslave 2y ago
      Yes we have pick heat waves. But that didn't make magically expand incomes that can be dropped in AC installation and operational costs. As I said, in building that are attached to money incomes, be it hostels, shops or restaurants, it's of course something that can balanced within loses and profits. In a personal home, it will be just eat some of your budget. And with electricity price on the rise (and thus basically everything in common goods) and salary stagnation on the other hand, I doubt people here will suddenly rush on AC on massive scales. Plus government apparently are pushing to alternative approach, but I'm just discovering that as this thread launched me on the track to investigate the topic. Personally, I doubt I'll jump to some AC anytime soon. It's just out of reach for my incomes, all the more when there is no basically no chance to see the electricity price plummet while my salary has good chances to continue to stay freezed as it's been for the two last years. And it's not like I feel the most unlucky person in the town, to be clear, my situation is far from the worst ones I can witness around me.
      - TeMPOraL 2y ago
        Where I live (Poland), A/C is expensive too, though it's been dropping in price. Portable heat pumps are becoming cheap enough to consider. Fixed installations are doable even in individual flats (obviously cheapest when during general renovation, and boring extra holes in walls isn't a big deal). The last few years made people switch from thinking about A/C as a luxury for the rich, and start thinking about maybe getting it some day. And our heat waves were quite light compared to the rest of Europe.
    - thatfrenchguy 2y ago
      most people in Western Europe don't have A/C, houses are way better insulated for short-term heatwaves and people usually don't mind indoor temperatures of up to 80-84F/26-28C. If you add the general hate French (and I think German?) people have for drafts and air currents in general and you can see how people just deal with the heat in the summer. Not to mention central A/C in the North American sense with a air handler & ducts is just never coming to France, it's such an outdated technology and forced-air heating is generally considered to suck there.
psychoslave 2y ago
No. Not a single time I can remember in 40 years of existence living in Europe. Shops, restaurants, airports and things like that which are attached with revenue streams have them. I never been in a billionaire palace thus said.
- 8n4vidtmkvmk 2y ago
  Not billionaires or even millionaires. This is normal for a middle-class home in Canada and US at least. It's not that expensive to run and those who are tight on cash just run it less, only on really hot days.
rvense 2y ago
This is regional. Air conditioning is not at all common in Scandinavian homes.

carlosjobim 2y ago

You really need to broaden your horizons while you still have the chance. This is like believing that boats don't exist because you live inland and have never seen a boat. Hundreds of millions of people are dependent on air conditioning in their homes.

psychoslave 2y ago
I'm not sure what you mean with dependent here. I never said that boats or AC don't exist. Both exist, and I did saw and experimented many of them in commercial context. But not everyone can afford them plus the cost to operate them. Sure I should broaden my horizon and even consider to look people enjoying their private jets and some helicopters. But a mere wage slave like myself will never have the chance to afford one, that's for sure. Now let's consider back in initial context: mere mortals around me are definitely all using internet as soon as there parents will let them do so, and even a homeless person can afford a first price mobile access (2€/months) with a phone they can receive for nothing in some charity organizations like Emmaus. So affordability of access to online search is definitely several order below AC.
- carlosjobim 2y ago
  Air conditioning is not an extravagant luxury, although I know many people who live in cold countries believe so. That's why I'm asking you to broaden your horizons. You don't consider indoor heating or plumbing a luxury to be comparable to a private jet? In hot and humid places, having AC was always a priority a hundred steps above having internet access, until cheap smart phones arrived. And they use a lot of energy, just like heating uses a lot of energy in colder climates.
  - psychoslave 2y ago
    Well, indoor heating is clearly more and more becoming a luxury on the affordability side, enough so that putting a jacket inside is my first go to option when I'm alone at home as I work remotely. But not yet so excited expensive as to private my children from its been benefits when they come back home. And of course nothing like a jet, indeed. Plumbing is generally not also considered a luxury over here. But at mankind level, I do feel particularly privileged on this regard. I remain amazed we have water flowing at will, and even possibility to take hot shower every day. This is not a jet level kind of privilege, but I try to keep myself aware of how incredibly lucky I am to be able to benefit of such a technology and infrastructure. I doubt humans waited AC to come alive for settling hot and humid areas. There are other ways to have cooled down residences which don't require so much sophistication in physic models before you can even dream to build a prototype. All that said, I got your hint to document more on how/why AC is so much more used in some area, and I'm just starting my journey on learning about it. I still doubt that local climate alone explain the difference in term of how common it is in different region of the world. For example USA have a very large set of different local climate, but from what I understand most homes have AC.

psychoslave 2y ago

Wow, didn't expect to be downvoted on something that is so obviously aligned with what I see around me. It is a very strange feeling, very different from downvoted posts that present unpopular opinions. It makes me look at some statistics https://www.statista.com/statistics/911064/worldwide-air-conditioning-penetration-rate-country/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/911064/worldwide-air-con... https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/air-conditioning-usage-by-country https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/air-condi... https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=52558 https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=52558 https://www.rfi.fr/en/france/20220723-france-does-not-use-much-air-conditioning-and-wants-to-keep-it-that-way https://www.rfi.fr/en/france/20220723-france-does-not-use-mu... https://www.reddit.com/r/AskFrance/comments/vhs8dn/how_common_is_air_conditioning/ https://www.reddit.com/r/AskFrance/comments/vhs8dn/how_commo... Apparently, Japan, USA and now China are huge users of AC in personal homes (like more than 90% of them). That's in sharp contrast with what is observed in most of Europe, including France where I live. I never had the opportunity to travel to any of this country, so indeed I was totally blind of this extrem gap in use from my own personal experience.

BenjiWiebe 2y ago
We had window unit A/C in our very-poorly-insulated 100 year old farmhouse, when I was growing up and money was very tight, as in if we go shopping and eat out, you're getting water to drink, sharing a meal, and no dessert. Not like starvation levels of poverty but still, money was tight. A/C was not considered optional, even if you could theoretically remain alive when the temperature was over 100F every day for weeks straight and stayed in the 80s (or even 90s) at night.