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Practically all American adults are "literate" in the sense that they can recognise and write some words, but about 14% can't really read in any useful sense -

Practically all American adults are "literate" in the sense that they can recognise and write some words, but about 14% can't really read in any useful sense - they can usually understand a warning sign or recognise a brand name, but they couldn't reliably understand a one-paragraph newspaper article or find a program in a TV listing. https://nces.ed.gov/naal/kf_demographics.asp https://nces.ed.gov/naal/kf_demographics.asp https://nces.ed.gov/pubs2009/2009481.pdf https://nces.ed.gov/pubs2009/2009481.pdf

parpfish 2y ago
That’s shockingly high. As somebody that has been literate for decades, I can’t even fathom how you would survive. Or if that’s taken care of, how would you entertain yourself?
- vanchor3 2y ago
  I'd imagine it's much easier today, than it was in the past. We have TikTok and other forms of simple to access entertainment, no heavy reliance on cash and writing checks, and worse case you just ask someone else to help you. Although I assume illiteracy indirectly implies that you can speak the language in some acceptable form, I would imagine it would be similar to living in another country without knowing the language. You go into the McDonald's click on the pictures of the food you want, press the big green button, then use your plastic card.
- fallingknife 2y ago
  It's even worse than you think. The standard for "literate" is nothing I would describe that way. Take a look at the data here: https://usafacts.org/articles/which-states-have-the-highest-and-lowest-adult-literacy-rates/ https://usafacts.org/articles/which-states-have-the-highest-... And note that very few counties in the US have a score above 276, which is the top of the range described as "Respondents can paraphrase or make low-level inferences."
  - parpfish 2y ago
    Yeah, that’s not really what comes to mind for me when I hear about “literacy”. The standards they use to measure literacy aren’t just about being able to read words, but being able to reason with the information. I’m curious is they can reason about the information if it comes up in a spoken format, otherwise it sounds more like a general cognitive impairment and not something specific to written words
alephnerd 2y ago
I'd steer clear from comparing countries based on Functional Illiteracy because the US is the only country that officially uses that definition and consistently collects data about this - which is good, because it is a forcing function for us to worker harder at solving functional illiteracy as well. That said, Germany's functional illiteracy rate is estimated to be comparable to the US [0] It's a similar story with PISA as well - most other countries use it as a dick measuring contest by testing at gifted schools, but the NCES tries to randomize PISA testing in order to actually benchmark subnational performance and identify laggards. [0] - https://psycnet.apa.org/record/2019-31821-001 https://psycnet.apa.org/record/2019-31821-001
ascorbic 2y ago
Americans suffer from the fact that most of them were taught to read using the whole language method, which has no scientific basis and has been repeatedly demonstrated to be ineffective.

parpfish 2y ago

That’s shockingly high. As somebody that has been literate for decades, I can’t even fathom how you would survive. Or if that’s taken care of, how would you entertain yourself?

vanchor3 2y ago
I'd imagine it's much easier today, than it was in the past. We have TikTok and other forms of simple to access entertainment, no heavy reliance on cash and writing checks, and worse case you just ask someone else to help you. Although I assume illiteracy indirectly implies that you can speak the language in some acceptable form, I would imagine it would be similar to living in another country without knowing the language. You go into the McDonald's click on the pictures of the food you want, press the big green button, then use your plastic card.
fallingknife 2y ago
It's even worse than you think. The standard for "literate" is nothing I would describe that way. Take a look at the data here: https://usafacts.org/articles/which-states-have-the-highest-and-lowest-adult-literacy-rates/ https://usafacts.org/articles/which-states-have-the-highest-... And note that very few counties in the US have a score above 276, which is the top of the range described as "Respondents can paraphrase or make low-level inferences."
- parpfish 2y ago
  Yeah, that’s not really what comes to mind for me when I hear about “literacy”. The standards they use to measure literacy aren’t just about being able to read words, but being able to reason with the information. I’m curious is they can reason about the information if it comes up in a spoken format, otherwise it sounds more like a general cognitive impairment and not something specific to written words

alephnerd 2y ago

I'd steer clear from comparing countries based on Functional Illiteracy because the US is the only country that officially uses that definition and consistently collects data about this - which is good, because it is a forcing function for us to worker harder at solving functional illiteracy as well. That said, Germany's functional illiteracy rate is estimated to be comparable to the US [0] It's a similar story with PISA as well - most other countries use it as a dick measuring contest by testing at gifted schools, but the NCES tries to randomize PISA testing in order to actually benchmark subnational performance and identify laggards. [0] - https://psycnet.apa.org/record/2019-31821-001 https://psycnet.apa.org/record/2019-31821-001

ascorbic 2y ago

Americans suffer from the fact that most of them were taught to read using the whole language method, which has no scientific basis and has been repeatedly demonstrated to be ineffective.