4 ms·

The Influence of Japanese Archaeology on the Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild

255 points by zdw 2y ago

Izkata 2y ago
> Another characteristic feature of Okamoto’s work is the large, stylised eye, incarnated by his “alien named PAIRA” of 1956, which inspired the eye on the Sheikah slate, the player’s tool for altering the environment and interacting with gameplay elements (Fig. 5). Little nitpick: it's not exactly right to say the design on the Sheikah slate was inspired by this artwork, the eye symbol has long been established as Sheikah, first appearing in 1998 in Ocarina of Time. Though it didn't always have the bright blue color, the shape is basically unchanged.
- nlawalker 2y ago
  The eye goes further back than that; the top comment on https://www.reddit.com/r/zeldaconspiracies/comments/c5e8h1/agahnim_and_his_possible_connection_to_sheikah/ https://www.reddit.com/r/zeldaconspiracies/comments/c5e8h1/a... has a link to the Link to the Past illustration of Agahnim and the similar eye symbol on his robes. The poster makes the case that they’re not connected lore-wise (I mean, it’s on r/zeldaconspiracies so I imagine there’s a healthy dose of reading a little too much into everything), but in my opinion at least the similarity is strong enough to make a case for an inspiration drawn from the same source that far back.
- bitwize 2y ago
  I wonder if the Paira alien sculpture inspired Starro from DC Comics (who first appeared in 1960). It certainly inspired a race known as the Pairans who appear in the kaiju film Warning from Space. I'm not sure that I believe in the author's conclusion that these Japanese cultural inspirations represent a pivot for the Zelda series towards more focus on Japanese cultural heritage in line with the "Cool Japan" policy. Nintendo's works have always been rooted in Japanese culture with Western elements mixed in for universal appeal. Both the Mario and Zelda franchises draw heavily from that titan of the East Asian canon, Journey to the West -- with Bowser being modelled on the Ox King and Ganon being based on the pig demon Zhu Bajie. Some of Mario's transformations are based on Japanese folklore about trickster animals -- the tanuki suit, the use of the leaf, and so forth. The Jōmon artifact inspiration really serves to add that next level of mystery in a manner that would be instantly evocative of "ancient precursors" to a Japanese audience.
thrdbndndn 2y ago
This is a well-written article, but the title feels overly complicated. It’s just a roundabout way of saying that BotW includes references to Japanese heritage or cultural symbols. And honestly, which Japanese fantasy game doesn’t? The Dogū, for instance, has been used so much that I barely even notice it as a reference anymore!
dools 2y ago
Also I went to a local Viking fair and it was like walking around Hyrule.
hum3hum3 2y ago
I know virtually nothing about gaming culture. But eons ago was interested in Japanese pottery. My understanding then was the start of Japanese culture in 300 ad with importation of styles and language from Korea. I have no memory of the Jomon period. But now that long stable period snd uniquely Japanese culture from the Jomon period seems a vital strand of Japanese culture. Do the article is interesting to bring that to life in a gaming context.
- verisimi 2y ago
  > I have no memory of the Jomon period. You're not the only one with no memory of 300bc. My memory fails me too.
HellDunkel 2y ago
The game designers did a truly fantasic job with botw. Think how much time is invested in creating game assets these days and often the designs merely replicate cliches which have been seen a million times. Doing some reseach and drawing inspiration from ancient cultures adds a whole new dimension to the game.
- dn0 2y ago
  A great design job indeed. Both, BOTW and TOTK have a beautiful environment. I really wish Nintendo would create a mod without monsters, perhaps something focused more on nature, places and artifacts. My kids love to explore Hyrule but are afraid of monsters and fights :)
  - prmoustache 2y ago
    I only just recently been into BOTW (well technically last christmas but only played a few days in january) and went back to it last month. You can totally play and explore for a long time while avoiding most fights. Just keep some wood and silex to sleep during the night and avoid the random bats and skeleton creatures.
    - dn0 2y ago
      Sure, or you can stay in villages (that's what my kids do) or in other "safe zones" (marked in unofficial maps). Still, I think it would be nice to have some kind of a peaceful mod.
      - vundercind 2y ago
        I had similar feelings about Far Cry 5. My son would have loved exploring, driving, flying, fishing, spotting wildlife… but at his age the violence made it useless. A mode that removed all the guns and bad guys would have been awesome.
        bgirard 2y ago
maguay 2y ago
The absolutely best thing about being in Japan is realizing that games so often are recreating Japan ... and you don't realize it until you're there. You hike and exit the path at a small shrine and feel like you're in Zelda. You go through a tunnel and come out in a different (snowy, in my case) environment, and feel like you went through a Mario pipe. You drive on expressways in Tokyo with office buildings nearly right up to the road, with pillars between lanes and (in one spot) a highway going through a building and suddenly racing games don't seem so far fetched. It's a trip, in the best of ways.
- interestica 2y ago
  I’ve got 24 hours left here. Hiroshima now. Tokyo as fast as a speeding bullet. What’s your do-not-miss in Tokyo?
  - maguay 2y ago
    Far from an expert, but two favorites from last time I was there: - Uneo Park and the Tokyo National Museum. - Tokyo Metropolitan Edo-Tokyo Museum (and I've heard great things about the open-air take on this museum in the suburbs ... which could be a better option since the former I just saw is being renovated). And on the other side of the country, don't miss Kyoto. Just came back from there, and I'm not sure I've ever fallen in love with a city faster. But above all, I adore just walking around any city, aimlessly, and exploring whatever I stumble upon. Turn into a temple, walk through a random neighborhood grocery store, delight in the ordinary-for-here that's not-so-ordinary for elsewhere.
  - phn 2y ago
    If you're visiting Shinjuku, nearby there's a narrow street called Omoide Yokocho. Just take in the vibe and choose a yakitori spot to grab a bite and drink your poison of choice (tea/beer/sake). I would recommend going at night/dinner time. Speaking of Shinjuku and videogames, if you've ever played any yakuza/like a dragon game, you owe it to yourself to go to Kabukicho and its big red gate. In any case, whatever you choose to visit in Tokyo, it will be really nice, and a lot of it will still be waiting when you eventually come back. Cheers!
latexr 2y ago
> Dogū from Tajirikabukuri, Ebisuda, Miyagi Prefecture (1,000–400 BCE) If you think that looks similar in Breath of the Wild, wait until you start looking at Digimon. https://wikimon.net/Shakkoumon https://wikimon.net/Shakkoumon Which goes to a larger point: this influence isn’t specific to Breath of the Wild, or Legend of Zelda, or even video games. Manga and anime are filled to the brim with these references and inspirations. And not just legends or ancient places, but everyday locations. https://japantour.xyz/2022/06/22/27-real-life-anime-locations-in-tokyo-with-map/ https://japantour.xyz/2022/06/22/27-real-life-anime-location...
- Astor_Landaluze 2y ago
  Hello! I am one of the editors of the Journal of Geek Studies, where the article posted by the OP is from. There is actually another article in our site that discuss the Dogū presence in multiple japanese media, that I recomend the read! https://jgeekstudies.org/2018/05/19/dogu-from-prehistoric-figurines-to-collectible-pocket-monsters/ https://jgeekstudies.org/2018/05/19/dogu-from-prehistoric-fi... Cheers!
jmyeet 2y ago
BotW will go down as one of the greatest games of all time and there are so many lesons in that. You will find plenty of people who say it's too easy. And it is easy. But that's one lesson: players generally don't want "hard". A lot of people just want to chill out in video games. What makes BotW is so memorable is how it makes you feell. And a big part of that is the world. Even just standing in a grassy plain with the wind blowing the long grasses has a better sense of being alone (while still being wondrous) that I can think of pretty much any game. I'm not a Japanophile by any stretch. Kinda the opposite, actually. Dig beneath the surface and there are a lot of problematic things in Japan and Japanese culture. Anyway, I have no issue with what inspiration the designers used or what they were mimicking. That's kind of irrelevant because you can do that well or badly. I don't think the world is so great because of Japanese archeology or even in spite of it. It is interesting to see their inspiration but for anyone in the gaming space, just remember that what makes a lasting game is the emotional connection.
- floundy 2y ago
  BOTW (and most Switch-era Nintendo titles with high marks) will go down as some of the most overrated games of all time. You'd think Nintendo fans have never played an open world game prior to BOTW with how they crow about it.
  - lubujackson 2y ago
    Not sure where all the rating hate is coming from, but Nintendo always gets high marks from the amount of polish in the gameplay and design. The biggest thing BOTW accomplished was taking the "you can go anywhere, basically" approach from the original NES Zelda and translated that to an open world game far better than any game previously. Most open world games gate players hard with obvious gated entry to areas. BOTW integrated natural progression in a much more thematic way. The destructable/interactable environment was also a big innovation that only a few other games had attempted at the time. You can argue the shrines were repetitive or the fighting too easy but that is complaining that the game isn't what you want it to be and not looking at it for what it is and who it is for.
  - 2y ago
carabiner 2y ago
This is why nintendo endures. 2013: The Death Of Nintendo Has Been Greatly Under-Exaggerated https://techcrunch.com/2013/09/04/nintendont/ https://techcrunch.com/2013/09/04/nintendont/

255 points by zdw 2y ago

> Another characteristic feature of Okamoto’s work is the large, stylised eye, incarnated by his “alien named PAIRA” of 1956, which inspired the eye on the Sheikah slate, the player’s tool for altering the environment and interacting with gameplay elements (Fig. 5). Little nitpick: it's not exactly right to say the design on the Sheikah slate was inspired by this artwork, the eye symbol has long been established as Sheikah, first appearing in 1998 in Ocarina of Time. Though it didn't always have the bright blue color, the shape is basically unchanged.

nlawalker 2y ago
The eye goes further back than that; the top comment on https://www.reddit.com/r/zeldaconspiracies/comments/c5e8h1/agahnim_and_his_possible_connection_to_sheikah/ https://www.reddit.com/r/zeldaconspiracies/comments/c5e8h1/a... has a link to the Link to the Past illustration of Agahnim and the similar eye symbol on his robes. The poster makes the case that they’re not connected lore-wise (I mean, it’s on r/zeldaconspiracies so I imagine there’s a healthy dose of reading a little too much into everything), but in my opinion at least the similarity is strong enough to make a case for an inspiration drawn from the same source that far back.
bitwize 2y ago
I wonder if the Paira alien sculpture inspired Starro from DC Comics (who first appeared in 1960). It certainly inspired a race known as the Pairans who appear in the kaiju film Warning from Space. I'm not sure that I believe in the author's conclusion that these Japanese cultural inspirations represent a pivot for the Zelda series towards more focus on Japanese cultural heritage in line with the "Cool Japan" policy. Nintendo's works have always been rooted in Japanese culture with Western elements mixed in for universal appeal. Both the Mario and Zelda franchises draw heavily from that titan of the East Asian canon, Journey to the West -- with Bowser being modelled on the Ox King and Ganon being based on the pig demon Zhu Bajie. Some of Mario's transformations are based on Japanese folklore about trickster animals -- the tanuki suit, the use of the leaf, and so forth. The Jōmon artifact inspiration really serves to add that next level of mystery in a manner that would be instantly evocative of "ancient precursors" to a Japanese audience.

thrdbndndn 2y ago

This is a well-written article, but the title feels overly complicated. It’s just a roundabout way of saying that BotW includes references to Japanese heritage or cultural symbols. And honestly, which Japanese fantasy game doesn’t? The Dogū, for instance, has been used so much that I barely even notice it as a reference anymore!

dools 2y ago

Also I went to a local Viking fair and it was like walking around Hyrule.

hum3hum3 2y ago

I know virtually nothing about gaming culture. But eons ago was interested in Japanese pottery. My understanding then was the start of Japanese culture in 300 ad with importation of styles and language from Korea. I have no memory of the Jomon period. But now that long stable period snd uniquely Japanese culture from the Jomon period seems a vital strand of Japanese culture. Do the article is interesting to bring that to life in a gaming context.

verisimi 2y ago
> I have no memory of the Jomon period. You're not the only one with no memory of 300bc. My memory fails me too.

HellDunkel 2y ago

The game designers did a truly fantasic job with botw. Think how much time is invested in creating game assets these days and often the designs merely replicate cliches which have been seen a million times. Doing some reseach and drawing inspiration from ancient cultures adds a whole new dimension to the game.

dn0 2y ago
A great design job indeed. Both, BOTW and TOTK have a beautiful environment. I really wish Nintendo would create a mod without monsters, perhaps something focused more on nature, places and artifacts. My kids love to explore Hyrule but are afraid of monsters and fights :)
- prmoustache 2y ago
  I only just recently been into BOTW (well technically last christmas but only played a few days in january) and went back to it last month. You can totally play and explore for a long time while avoiding most fights. Just keep some wood and silex to sleep during the night and avoid the random bats and skeleton creatures.
  - dn0 2y ago
    Sure, or you can stay in villages (that's what my kids do) or in other "safe zones" (marked in unofficial maps). Still, I think it would be nice to have some kind of a peaceful mod.
    - vundercind 2y ago
      I had similar feelings about Far Cry 5. My son would have loved exploring, driving, flying, fishing, spotting wildlife… but at his age the violence made it useless. A mode that removed all the guns and bad guys would have been awesome.
      - bgirard 2y ago

maguay 2y ago

The absolutely best thing about being in Japan is realizing that games so often are recreating Japan ... and you don't realize it until you're there. You hike and exit the path at a small shrine and feel like you're in Zelda. You go through a tunnel and come out in a different (snowy, in my case) environment, and feel like you went through a Mario pipe. You drive on expressways in Tokyo with office buildings nearly right up to the road, with pillars between lanes and (in one spot) a highway going through a building and suddenly racing games don't seem so far fetched. It's a trip, in the best of ways.

interestica 2y ago
I’ve got 24 hours left here. Hiroshima now. Tokyo as fast as a speeding bullet. What’s your do-not-miss in Tokyo?
- maguay 2y ago
  Far from an expert, but two favorites from last time I was there: - Uneo Park and the Tokyo National Museum. - Tokyo Metropolitan Edo-Tokyo Museum (and I've heard great things about the open-air take on this museum in the suburbs ... which could be a better option since the former I just saw is being renovated). And on the other side of the country, don't miss Kyoto. Just came back from there, and I'm not sure I've ever fallen in love with a city faster. But above all, I adore just walking around any city, aimlessly, and exploring whatever I stumble upon. Turn into a temple, walk through a random neighborhood grocery store, delight in the ordinary-for-here that's not-so-ordinary for elsewhere.
- phn 2y ago
  If you're visiting Shinjuku, nearby there's a narrow street called Omoide Yokocho. Just take in the vibe and choose a yakitori spot to grab a bite and drink your poison of choice (tea/beer/sake). I would recommend going at night/dinner time. Speaking of Shinjuku and videogames, if you've ever played any yakuza/like a dragon game, you owe it to yourself to go to Kabukicho and its big red gate. In any case, whatever you choose to visit in Tokyo, it will be really nice, and a lot of it will still be waiting when you eventually come back. Cheers!

latexr 2y ago

> Dogū from Tajirikabukuri, Ebisuda, Miyagi Prefecture (1,000–400 BCE) If you think that looks similar in Breath of the Wild, wait until you start looking at Digimon. https://wikimon.net/Shakkoumon https://wikimon.net/Shakkoumon Which goes to a larger point: this influence isn’t specific to Breath of the Wild, or Legend of Zelda, or even video games. Manga and anime are filled to the brim with these references and inspirations. And not just legends or ancient places, but everyday locations. https://japantour.xyz/2022/06/22/27-real-life-anime-locations-in-tokyo-with-map/ https://japantour.xyz/2022/06/22/27-real-life-anime-location...

Astor_Landaluze 2y ago
Hello! I am one of the editors of the Journal of Geek Studies, where the article posted by the OP is from. There is actually another article in our site that discuss the Dogū presence in multiple japanese media, that I recomend the read! https://jgeekstudies.org/2018/05/19/dogu-from-prehistoric-figurines-to-collectible-pocket-monsters/ https://jgeekstudies.org/2018/05/19/dogu-from-prehistoric-fi... Cheers!

jmyeet 2y ago

BotW will go down as one of the greatest games of all time and there are so many lesons in that. You will find plenty of people who say it's too easy. And it is easy. But that's one lesson: players generally don't want "hard". A lot of people just want to chill out in video games. What makes BotW is so memorable is how it makes you feell. And a big part of that is the world. Even just standing in a grassy plain with the wind blowing the long grasses has a better sense of being alone (while still being wondrous) that I can think of pretty much any game. I'm not a Japanophile by any stretch. Kinda the opposite, actually. Dig beneath the surface and there are a lot of problematic things in Japan and Japanese culture. Anyway, I have no issue with what inspiration the designers used or what they were mimicking. That's kind of irrelevant because you can do that well or badly. I don't think the world is so great because of Japanese archeology or even in spite of it. It is interesting to see their inspiration but for anyone in the gaming space, just remember that what makes a lasting game is the emotional connection.

floundy 2y ago
BOTW (and most Switch-era Nintendo titles with high marks) will go down as some of the most overrated games of all time. You'd think Nintendo fans have never played an open world game prior to BOTW with how they crow about it.
- lubujackson 2y ago
  Not sure where all the rating hate is coming from, but Nintendo always gets high marks from the amount of polish in the gameplay and design. The biggest thing BOTW accomplished was taking the "you can go anywhere, basically" approach from the original NES Zelda and translated that to an open world game far better than any game previously. Most open world games gate players hard with obvious gated entry to areas. BOTW integrated natural progression in a much more thematic way. The destructable/interactable environment was also a big innovation that only a few other games had attempted at the time. You can argue the shrines were repetitive or the fighting too easy but that is complaining that the game isn't what you want it to be and not looking at it for what it is and who it is for.
- 2y ago

carabiner 2y ago

This is why nintendo endures. 2013: The Death Of Nintendo Has Been Greatly Under-Exaggerated https://techcrunch.com/2013/09/04/nintendont/ https://techcrunch.com/2013/09/04/nintendont/