4 ms·
Don’t know where you’re seeing that. Combined cardiovascular events has an RR of 0.83 and the GRADE quality is moderate, not very low.
by KempyKolibri 2y ago
Don’t know where you’re seeing that. Combined cardiovascular events has an RR of 0.83 and the GRADE quality is moderate, not very low.
- riku_iki 2y agoYes, and I am talking about subtypes of events in the "summary of findings" table. Those subtypes with "moderate" quality has very insignificant diff in # of events. Those with significant diff in # of events have "very low" quality of evidence.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- KempyKolibri 2y agoHow would that affect the inference being made here? That is, the claim being made is with regard to combined cardiovascular events. This effect is significant and the GRADE quality is moderate. One of the main purposes of meta-analyses is to summate multiple studies that may have insufficient statistical power in isolation to find a significant effect, but when summated they do. I _think_ you're trying to suggest that the insignificant individual event types aren't contributing to the significant findings on the combined event endpoint, so we should ignore the GRADE quality of those (correct me if I'm wrong). But that's not how meta analysis functions - those events are also contributing to the significant finding on that endpoint (which is also why the GRADE quality of the combined endpoint is moderate). They just aren't significant _in isolation_.
- riku_iki 2y ago> How would that affect the inference being made here? to me, it looks like several rows clearly don't add up in key findings table(they derive "moderate quality" conclusions from "very low quality" observations), which makes whole publication as data astrology quality.
- KempyKolibri 2y agoRight, but that’s because you’re misreading the table. They are deriving moderate quality conclusions from moderate quality data, as I’ve explained.
- riku_iki 2y agoLooks like we are in disagreement about who is misreading the table.
- KempyKolibri 2y agoWell, good luck sustaining the claim that Lee Hooper doesn’t know how to perform a meta analysis and that error got past Cochrane’s notoriously lax peer review process, and you definitely didn’t just make a mistake reading the table. I salute your self confidence, I must say I’m somewhat envious of it.
- riku_iki 2y agoI have low opinion about modern academia and quality of "peer review processes".
- KempyKolibri 2y agoIf you misread data in the way you appear to, that doesn’t surprise me. I can’t imagine you think many studies’ conclusions appear to follow from their results. It’s just that you’re blaming the studies, rather than your comprehension.
- riku_iki 2y agoAgain, we are in disagreement who misread the data.
- deleted 2y ago
- valval 2y agoMeta-analyses are a cool way to perform a garbage in, garbage out exercise.
- KempyKolibri 2y agoWhat’s the evidence that the data going in is garbage? We already ascertained most of it is GRADE quality moderate.
- valval 2y agoI don’t research the topic for a living, so I don’t know — I’ve read none of the studies. If the conclusion that comes out of the other end of the pipeline is that we should avoid eating the things we’ve eaten for millions of years, it’s fair to say what went in might have been based on false premises.
- KempyKolibri 2y agoWhy? Evolution doesn’t select for longevity, it selects for reproductive fitness. We have no reason to believe ancestral foods are more longevity promoting than novel ones, and antagonistic pleiotropy would suggest that all else held equal, ancestral foods are less healthy. Heck, water treatment plants are novel compared to the pathogen-laced water we’ve been ancestrally consuming, but I doubt you eschew tap water for puddle water.