4 ms·

> There is no other way to spin a $100K car being the #3 overall EV vehicle of any type other than a success, especially given that they have the US government

> There is no other way to spin a $100K car being the #3 overall EV vehicle of any type other than a success, especially given that they have the US government block competition

Sabinus 2y ago
Only from China. Non-communist non-dumping, friendly states are welcome to compete.
- tredre3 2y ago
  50% of Telsas are made in China. China built Teslas are noticeably better built, too. Welcome to reality.
  - Sabinus 2y ago
    >they have the US government block competition >Only from China. Non-communist non-dumping, friendly states are welcome to compete. >50% of Telsas are made in China. China built Teslas are noticeably better built, too. Please explain how your comment relates to mine, because I see no connection.
- Qwertious 2y ago
  People keep assuming China is only successful because they're dumping, and miss the elephant in the room: China went all-in on EVs over a decade ago, while we were fucking about with hybrids and maybe-just-stick-with-ICE. They have world-class batteries and insatiable domestic demand and it's been that way since before Tesla, what if China is undercutting us because their cars are just better? In that case our tarrifs are just protectionism, is what.
  - cvalka 2y ago
    100℅
  - Sabinus 2y ago
    >They have world-class batteries and insatiable domestic demand Excellent, then they won't have an issue with losing their export markets to tariffs, because they can just sell their EVs to the "insatiable demand" of the local consumers. >what if China is undercutting us because their cars are just better Price/performance they ARE better, China can produce cheaper because of their years of (government aided) investments and economies of scale. Of course, we aren't obligated to buy from belligerent states engaging in strategic mercantilism producing the goods of the future. We aren't obligated to prop up the Chinese export-oriented economic model in pursuit of one generation of cheap EV cars.
    - sabbaticaldev 2y ago
      > excellent, then they won't have an issue with losing their export markets to tariffs, because they can just sell their EVs to the "insatiable demand" of the local consumers. that’s what happened but the point in discussion here is why Tesla does not have competition in the US and the answer is simple
      - Sabinus 2y ago
        The answer above was apparently 'protectionism'. If we're only putting tariffs on EV cars from one country, then how is protectionism the simple answer?
    - redserk 2y ago
      Boy do I have news for you if you think China is the only country that pours money into domestic R&D for strategic commercial development…
      - Sabinus 2y ago
        Indeed, plenty of countries engage in a bit of strategic development. Plenty of countries aren't belligerent communists though. Communism brings the state direction of industry to another level and with Xi as the new leader for life means they'll be extra implacable.
  - caekislove 2y ago
    Protectionism built Japan, Korea and China's economies. Protectionism is good, actually.
    - Qwertious 2y ago
      Protectionism let Harley Davidson make their motorbikes cheap enough to compete on the world stage in the 1970s. Except, they never bothered because they didn't need to compete - protectionism kept them nice and profitable, regardless of what they did. Protectionism can be done well, but blindly applying it is dangerous and stupid.

> There is no other way to spin a $100K car being the #3 overall EV vehicle of any type other than a success, especially given that they have the US government block competition

Sabinus 2y ago

Only from China. Non-communist non-dumping, friendly states are welcome to compete.

tredre3 2y ago
50% of Telsas are made in China. China built Teslas are noticeably better built, too. Welcome to reality.
- Sabinus 2y ago
  >they have the US government block competition >Only from China. Non-communist non-dumping, friendly states are welcome to compete. >50% of Telsas are made in China. China built Teslas are noticeably better built, too. Please explain how your comment relates to mine, because I see no connection.
Qwertious 2y ago
People keep assuming China is only successful because they're dumping, and miss the elephant in the room: China went all-in on EVs over a decade ago, while we were fucking about with hybrids and maybe-just-stick-with-ICE. They have world-class batteries and insatiable domestic demand and it's been that way since before Tesla, what if China is undercutting us because their cars are just better? In that case our tarrifs are just protectionism, is what.
- cvalka 2y ago
  100℅
- Sabinus 2y ago
  >They have world-class batteries and insatiable domestic demand Excellent, then they won't have an issue with losing their export markets to tariffs, because they can just sell their EVs to the "insatiable demand" of the local consumers. >what if China is undercutting us because their cars are just better Price/performance they ARE better, China can produce cheaper because of their years of (government aided) investments and economies of scale. Of course, we aren't obligated to buy from belligerent states engaging in strategic mercantilism producing the goods of the future. We aren't obligated to prop up the Chinese export-oriented economic model in pursuit of one generation of cheap EV cars.
  - sabbaticaldev 2y ago
    > excellent, then they won't have an issue with losing their export markets to tariffs, because they can just sell their EVs to the "insatiable demand" of the local consumers. that’s what happened but the point in discussion here is why Tesla does not have competition in the US and the answer is simple
    - Sabinus 2y ago
      The answer above was apparently 'protectionism'. If we're only putting tariffs on EV cars from one country, then how is protectionism the simple answer?
  - redserk 2y ago
    Boy do I have news for you if you think China is the only country that pours money into domestic R&D for strategic commercial development…
    - Sabinus 2y ago
      Indeed, plenty of countries engage in a bit of strategic development. Plenty of countries aren't belligerent communists though. Communism brings the state direction of industry to another level and with Xi as the new leader for life means they'll be extra implacable.
- caekislove 2y ago
  Protectionism built Japan, Korea and China's economies. Protectionism is good, actually.
  - Qwertious 2y ago
    Protectionism let Harley Davidson make their motorbikes cheap enough to compete on the world stage in the 1970s. Except, they never bothered because they didn't need to compete - protectionism kept them nice and profitable, regardless of what they did. Protectionism can be done well, but blindly applying it is dangerous and stupid.