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what that article says is "Even if it Italy(and all UE) the law says the hardware provider must grant 2 years warranty, Apple does not care and gives only one,

what that article says is "Even if it Italy(and all UE) the law says the hardware provider must grant 2 years warranty, Apple does not care and gives only one, and asks for money if you want the second." Explain me how this is putting the customers before the money. Apple shows a nice face to the public but then does only what it's needed to get more money. proved by both this article and how they treat developers. If it wasn't for the developers that filled the appstore with content apple would be still years back. But apple doesn't care.

technoslut 14y ago
You're pointing to an article that was very short and provided no detail. I had to go through the HN thread to see that it's more complicated than what you make it out to be but I also read a story by John Paczkowski regarding this: http://allthingsd.com/20120702/italy-accuses-apple-of-misrepresenting-warranty-options-threatens-to-kick-it-out/ http://allthingsd.com/20120702/italy-accuses-apple-of-misrep... I think you're trying to paint a picture from a certain perspective that doesn't contain the whole truth. I'm not saying that Apple isn't greedy as everyone else but I do believe your argument has flaws.
joering2 14y ago
> If it wasn't for the developers that filled the appstore with content apple would be still years back. Plus, if it wasn't for jailbreakers and first Cydia not-native apps that Jobs hated and for a long time was against an idea of giving third-parties abilities to build so-called not-native apps, Apple would still not had their App Store and never grew to today's sizes.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- rimantas 14y ago
  Just take a look at the timeline: App Store was probably in the works when Jobs was still talking about web apps. Thinking that Cydia forced Apple to reconsider its policy is very naive.
  - saurik 14y ago
    Cydia certainly did not influence Apple's decision: Cydia itself was a reaction to an ecosystem being left behind by Installer, a program whose maintainer had disappeared. However, I actually am fairly certain that Installer did. The timeline actually works for this rather well, when you take into consideration how much of a rush-job the whole SDK was: they pretty much started designing a "for third parties" API--from scratch, leaving Apple's apps built to an entirely different set of UI classes--for 2.x Meanwhile, the device setup really wasn't designed to run third-party apps, and we were actually able to watch as the software was ripped apart and rewritten to work around those problems. Had you actually been there, in the field, developing for the platform at the time, you might not consider the opinion so naive. I agree, however, that people oft fail to look at how long it takes to accomplish things like this, and somehow take the release date as the point of inception: but here we could actually watch the progress. Regardless, it might be they had it "on the horizon" (although I'd even question that, after years of talking about this story with people at conferences), but the idea that it was going to happen at that point--sufficiently early and with sufficient unknowns that they actually slipped on their release dates (not thforties slips got much press)--for that first device.. to me that is far-fetched (but I sadly realize that most of my evidence is not transferable).
dasil003 14y ago
On the other hand, if the appstore didn't exist then mobile developers would still be begging for crumbs from OEMs. All companies exist to make money. The subtleties of how they do so is not nearly so black and white as you want to make it.
- jarek 14y ago
  > On the other hand, if the appstore didn't exist then mobile developers would still be begging for crumbs from OEMs. Is that in the same imaginary universe where phones before the iPhone had tiny black and white screens? (http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1519377 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1519377) Because in this one there were several third-party mobile application stores and distribution platforms.
  - dasil003 14y ago
    Uh no, you would do well not to conflate everyone who you disagree with into one ignorant boogeyman. Please cite your figures for the pre App Store mobile app economy. I'm genuinely curious.
    - jarek 14y ago
      Which figures are you looking for in particular? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Application_store http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Application_store is a good place to start. Getjar and Handango/Pocketgear are some of the more recognizable names in the list.
  - shadesandcolour 14y ago
    No but it is the universe where lots and lots of people were not aware that there was a way to get more software onto a phone or even a computer. People used to look at me like I had three heads when I told them about those other mobile application stores.
    - jarek 14y ago
      Unless you completely ignore Getjar, Handango, Pocketgear, many other repositories, and direct sales, mobile developers were not begging for crumbs from OEMs regardless of how many people knew you could put software on a computer. To be sure, the market was smaller, there were significantly less developers and less software available overall, but they all had options.

technoslut 14y ago

You're pointing to an article that was very short and provided no detail. I had to go through the HN thread to see that it's more complicated than what you make it out to be but I also read a story by John Paczkowski regarding this: http://allthingsd.com/20120702/italy-accuses-apple-of-misrepresenting-warranty-options-threatens-to-kick-it-out/ http://allthingsd.com/20120702/italy-accuses-apple-of-misrep... I think you're trying to paint a picture from a certain perspective that doesn't contain the whole truth. I'm not saying that Apple isn't greedy as everyone else but I do believe your argument has flaws.

joering2 14y ago

> If it wasn't for the developers that filled the appstore with content apple would be still years back. Plus, if it wasn't for jailbreakers and first Cydia not-native apps that Jobs hated and for a long time was against an idea of giving third-parties abilities to build so-called not-native apps, Apple would still not had their App Store and never grew to today's sizes.

deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
rimantas 14y ago
Just take a look at the timeline: App Store was probably in the works when Jobs was still talking about web apps. Thinking that Cydia forced Apple to reconsider its policy is very naive.
- saurik 14y ago
  Cydia certainly did not influence Apple's decision: Cydia itself was a reaction to an ecosystem being left behind by Installer, a program whose maintainer had disappeared. However, I actually am fairly certain that Installer did. The timeline actually works for this rather well, when you take into consideration how much of a rush-job the whole SDK was: they pretty much started designing a "for third parties" API--from scratch, leaving Apple's apps built to an entirely different set of UI classes--for 2.x Meanwhile, the device setup really wasn't designed to run third-party apps, and we were actually able to watch as the software was ripped apart and rewritten to work around those problems. Had you actually been there, in the field, developing for the platform at the time, you might not consider the opinion so naive. I agree, however, that people oft fail to look at how long it takes to accomplish things like this, and somehow take the release date as the point of inception: but here we could actually watch the progress. Regardless, it might be they had it "on the horizon" (although I'd even question that, after years of talking about this story with people at conferences), but the idea that it was going to happen at that point--sufficiently early and with sufficient unknowns that they actually slipped on their release dates (not thforties slips got much press)--for that first device.. to me that is far-fetched (but I sadly realize that most of my evidence is not transferable).

dasil003 14y ago

On the other hand, if the appstore didn't exist then mobile developers would still be begging for crumbs from OEMs. All companies exist to make money. The subtleties of how they do so is not nearly so black and white as you want to make it.

jarek 14y ago
> On the other hand, if the appstore didn't exist then mobile developers would still be begging for crumbs from OEMs. Is that in the same imaginary universe where phones before the iPhone had tiny black and white screens? (http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1519377 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1519377) Because in this one there were several third-party mobile application stores and distribution platforms.
- dasil003 14y ago
  Uh no, you would do well not to conflate everyone who you disagree with into one ignorant boogeyman. Please cite your figures for the pre App Store mobile app economy. I'm genuinely curious.
  - jarek 14y ago
    Which figures are you looking for in particular? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Application_store http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Application_store is a good place to start. Getjar and Handango/Pocketgear are some of the more recognizable names in the list.
- shadesandcolour 14y ago
  No but it is the universe where lots and lots of people were not aware that there was a way to get more software onto a phone or even a computer. People used to look at me like I had three heads when I told them about those other mobile application stores.
  - jarek 14y ago
    Unless you completely ignore Getjar, Handango, Pocketgear, many other repositories, and direct sales, mobile developers were not begging for crumbs from OEMs regardless of how many people knew you could put software on a computer. To be sure, the market was smaller, there were significantly less developers and less software available overall, but they all had options.