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Is video calling your friends and family depressing? What about group chats with friends? Looking up the weather every morning before you leave the house? Check

by paxys 2y ago

Is video calling your friends and family depressing? What about group chats with friends? Looking up the weather every morning before you leave the house? Checking up scores of the game your favorite team is playing when you are on the move? Clicking a photo and sending it to a loved one? Playing Wordle or solving the NYT crossword on your phone during your commute? Downloading episodes of your regular podcasts? Tapping your phone to pay at the checkout counter or the subway? Being able to translate between hundreds of languages in real time? Paying rent every month without mailing a paper check? Looking up driving directions for your next appointment? Managing your fantasy football team? Checking Wikipedia when you don't know something, or generally having the sum total of human knowledge at your fingertips? Being able to work from home? Most people (including Tim Burton I bet) do all of this every day and love it, yet "the internet" is scary and depressing? Just more low effort "everything is bad these days" clickbait content.

scotty79 2y ago
> Is video calling your friends and family depressing? Could be. I tend to get depressed after positive interactions.
- paxys 2y ago
  [flagged]
pixelready 2y ago
Yeah, I think it’s human nature for modern conveniences to fade into the background and just become “part of life”. When people say “I’m going on the internet” what they’re really saying is: “I’m itching for a TikTok / YouTube / Social Media Doomscrolling fix”
- croes 2y ago
  Convenience works for bad things too.
piva00 2y ago
You are attacking it semantically, reading the article is a bit clearer he's not talking about the conveniences of services on the internet but specifically: > 'Humans were the ones who scared me' > "They were the angry villagers in Frankenstein - like the internet - these nameless faces [Burton makes monster roaring noises] and the monster always had the most emotion and most feeling even though they're looked upon as a certain way. > "Every monster usually has some kind of pathos and some kind of humanity" that the humans lacked he added. So "like the internet" means people on the internet, is it technically wrong to call comments, social media, etc. "the internet"? Yup, it doesn't mean it's not understood when we hear it, at least for me it's quite clear when people in real life tell me "I don't like to be on the internet" they mean this side of it. I think it'd be a better discussion if you focused on what the article is about instead of your argument on semantics, you are verging quite into exactly "the people on the internet" by doing this.
- abnercoimbre 2y ago
  I've seen too many fellow programmers fall into this. It's almost like they can't help themselves: a normie, valid complaint about tech gets summarily dismissed through semantic quibbles (even when done in good faith.)
  - piva00 2y ago
    It's quite common with engineering-adjacent or some hard sciences people. Attacking the semantics as if imprecise communication makes it valid to use technicalities to go around the main message. I've been guilty of being somewhat that person when I was younger. Until I realised it doesn't lead anywhere, you just become a pedantic boring person, not dissimilar to these hollow debaters talking fast over people on the internet. Imprecise communication still annoys me when I misunderstand what someone said because they used it but life is so much better when trying to understand what someone actually meant to say, and conversing about that. It leads places, or at least to some understanding. The other side is just self-stroking your ego to tell yourself you are "smarter", or "more intellectual" than someone else.
bmitc 2y ago
That's a paper thin argument. Convenience is not an anti-depressant. Additionally, all of those things had pre-Internet versions that were just fine and in some cases were even superior. And none of them existing now necessary necessitate the rest of what the Internet brings. But none of that addresses the vast depth and breadth of the negative aspects of the Internet. Control, propaganda, data stealing, etc. It's just one level below The Matrix because we're all just human compute environments for corporations, criminal enterprises, and the wealthy. The Internet connects us in the most primitive way, connecting up primate emotional capacity, which is very low compared to some other animals, and encouraging short form content. The Internet has killed the way things used to be made, especially the arts. You can barely even buy things today. You just rent them continuously.
_heimdall 2y ago
These are very surface level benefits, mostly in convenience. You need to weigh those with the downsides of the internet as well to know if its really worth it. Is using Wikipedia rather than an encyclopedia worth the damages caused by online porn? Or the loss of privacy both through data farming and digital hacks? Is checking the weather worth any number of children or adults killing themselves in part due to content they see online or how they are treated online? I'm obviously not saying we need to immediately burn the internet down, but if what you listed are the best benefits that may not be the worst argument to make.
phil21 2y ago
I don’t think the idea is clickbait at all. I deeply regret wasting my youth on my small portion of building out the Internet. What it became went well beyond the benefits you describe and might be the downfall of society as we know it in the end. I won’t go into more detail other than that. The dream of 13 year old midwestern me playing chess with some random person in South Africa in the early 90’s died long ago for me. It was truly awe inspiring while the naivety lasted though! I now operate on a harm reduction principle. I truly feel the internet as we know it causes more harm than good these days.
- eesmith 2y ago
  I'm fully in your camp. People are surprised when they find out I get depressed about the internet. When I tell them I've been on the internet for 35 years (technically ARPANET then), on the web for 30 years, and I'm tired of it, they begin to realize what might be in their future.
  - JohnFen 2y ago
    I agree entirely. I've been actively using the internet for roughly as long as you, and I find a great deal of it highly discouraging, depressing, and frightening. There's always been a dark side, even in the ARPANET days, but the percentage of it that's horrible has been growing steadily over the years. It's become so bad that I've severely limited my use of the internet anymore. Too much of it actively makes my life worse. Avoiding it has improved things quite a lot. Lately, I've been thinking that I may even need to stop hanging out here on HN, which is the only "social media" I use anymore.
eesmith 2y ago
So, here's the thing. A lot of people used to smoke, and say they liked to smoke. They liked the nicotine stimulant, of course, and the comfort of the well-practiced physical motions, and the closeness of a smoke-filled room, its association with style and elegance, and the chance to take a break from work activity. Some really got into different types of cigars, while others stuck with the same brand of cigarette their whole life. Few of them found it depressing. But certainly some did. They didn't like the stink on their clothes or how it overpowered the taste at a restaurant, or how it affected teeth, or negative health effects. Yet even some of these needed to learn to smoke in order to fit in, to land a deal, or to get promoted. Just because you don't find your internet use depressing, doesn't mean someone else - even someone actively using the internet every day - can't be depressed by it. It is very hard to have a normal life without the internet these days. Alternatives which were once common, like getting a paper local newspaper with real reporters and useful advertisements - and weather predictions for your area! - have often disappeared or cut back, meaning that yes, if you want the local weather prediction without bugging someone else every day, you have to use the internet. Try to find a good paper map, which were once commonplace and given out free at gas stations, now often requires going to a specialist store, forcing you online even to get driving directions for your next appointment. Not everyone thinks that's a good thing, and might even find it depressing. For one who considers FOMO and the need to feel on top of things as a mental weakness, then yes, seeing how so many people lack the patience to wait a few hours to know the scores of their favorite team can be depressing. The World Book is the only paper encyclopedia available these days, making Wikipedia the de facto encyclopedia for everyone, when there used to be multiple encyclopedias, each with a different slant and focus. Granted, you might have to go to a library to access three different encyclopedia sets, while Wikipedia is available within seconds, but if you prioritize both diversity and high curation standards instead of time, the internet might be depressing.
croes 2y ago
The depressing part are flat earthers, anti vaxxers, science deniers, anti-semites, conspiracy theorists, misogynists, homophobes, extremists etc.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

by paxys 2y ago

scotty79 2y ago

> Is video calling your friends and family depressing? Could be. I tend to get depressed after positive interactions.

paxys 2y ago
[flagged]

pixelready 2y ago

Yeah, I think it’s human nature for modern conveniences to fade into the background and just become “part of life”. When people say “I’m going on the internet” what they’re really saying is: “I’m itching for a TikTok / YouTube / Social Media Doomscrolling fix”

croes 2y ago
Convenience works for bad things too.

piva00 2y ago

You are attacking it semantically, reading the article is a bit clearer he's not talking about the conveniences of services on the internet but specifically: > 'Humans were the ones who scared me' > "They were the angry villagers in Frankenstein - like the internet - these nameless faces [Burton makes monster roaring noises] and the monster always had the most emotion and most feeling even though they're looked upon as a certain way. > "Every monster usually has some kind of pathos and some kind of humanity" that the humans lacked he added. So "like the internet" means people on the internet, is it technically wrong to call comments, social media, etc. "the internet"? Yup, it doesn't mean it's not understood when we hear it, at least for me it's quite clear when people in real life tell me "I don't like to be on the internet" they mean this side of it. I think it'd be a better discussion if you focused on what the article is about instead of your argument on semantics, you are verging quite into exactly "the people on the internet" by doing this.

abnercoimbre 2y ago
I've seen too many fellow programmers fall into this. It's almost like they can't help themselves: a normie, valid complaint about tech gets summarily dismissed through semantic quibbles (even when done in good faith.)
- piva00 2y ago
  It's quite common with engineering-adjacent or some hard sciences people. Attacking the semantics as if imprecise communication makes it valid to use technicalities to go around the main message. I've been guilty of being somewhat that person when I was younger. Until I realised it doesn't lead anywhere, you just become a pedantic boring person, not dissimilar to these hollow debaters talking fast over people on the internet. Imprecise communication still annoys me when I misunderstand what someone said because they used it but life is so much better when trying to understand what someone actually meant to say, and conversing about that. It leads places, or at least to some understanding. The other side is just self-stroking your ego to tell yourself you are "smarter", or "more intellectual" than someone else.

bmitc 2y ago

That's a paper thin argument. Convenience is not an anti-depressant. Additionally, all of those things had pre-Internet versions that were just fine and in some cases were even superior. And none of them existing now necessary necessitate the rest of what the Internet brings. But none of that addresses the vast depth and breadth of the negative aspects of the Internet. Control, propaganda, data stealing, etc. It's just one level below The Matrix because we're all just human compute environments for corporations, criminal enterprises, and the wealthy. The Internet connects us in the most primitive way, connecting up primate emotional capacity, which is very low compared to some other animals, and encouraging short form content. The Internet has killed the way things used to be made, especially the arts. You can barely even buy things today. You just rent them continuously.

_heimdall 2y ago

These are very surface level benefits, mostly in convenience. You need to weigh those with the downsides of the internet as well to know if its really worth it. Is using Wikipedia rather than an encyclopedia worth the damages caused by online porn? Or the loss of privacy both through data farming and digital hacks? Is checking the weather worth any number of children or adults killing themselves in part due to content they see online or how they are treated online? I'm obviously not saying we need to immediately burn the internet down, but if what you listed are the best benefits that may not be the worst argument to make.

phil21 2y ago

I don’t think the idea is clickbait at all. I deeply regret wasting my youth on my small portion of building out the Internet. What it became went well beyond the benefits you describe and might be the downfall of society as we know it in the end. I won’t go into more detail other than that. The dream of 13 year old midwestern me playing chess with some random person in South Africa in the early 90’s died long ago for me. It was truly awe inspiring while the naivety lasted though! I now operate on a harm reduction principle. I truly feel the internet as we know it causes more harm than good these days.

eesmith 2y ago
I'm fully in your camp. People are surprised when they find out I get depressed about the internet. When I tell them I've been on the internet for 35 years (technically ARPANET then), on the web for 30 years, and I'm tired of it, they begin to realize what might be in their future.
- JohnFen 2y ago
  I agree entirely. I've been actively using the internet for roughly as long as you, and I find a great deal of it highly discouraging, depressing, and frightening. There's always been a dark side, even in the ARPANET days, but the percentage of it that's horrible has been growing steadily over the years. It's become so bad that I've severely limited my use of the internet anymore. Too much of it actively makes my life worse. Avoiding it has improved things quite a lot. Lately, I've been thinking that I may even need to stop hanging out here on HN, which is the only "social media" I use anymore.

eesmith 2y ago

So, here's the thing. A lot of people used to smoke, and say they liked to smoke. They liked the nicotine stimulant, of course, and the comfort of the well-practiced physical motions, and the closeness of a smoke-filled room, its association with style and elegance, and the chance to take a break from work activity. Some really got into different types of cigars, while others stuck with the same brand of cigarette their whole life. Few of them found it depressing. But certainly some did. They didn't like the stink on their clothes or how it overpowered the taste at a restaurant, or how it affected teeth, or negative health effects. Yet even some of these needed to learn to smoke in order to fit in, to land a deal, or to get promoted. Just because you don't find your internet use depressing, doesn't mean someone else - even someone actively using the internet every day - can't be depressed by it. It is very hard to have a normal life without the internet these days. Alternatives which were once common, like getting a paper local newspaper with real reporters and useful advertisements - and weather predictions for your area! - have often disappeared or cut back, meaning that yes, if you want the local weather prediction without bugging someone else every day, you have to use the internet. Try to find a good paper map, which were once commonplace and given out free at gas stations, now often requires going to a specialist store, forcing you online even to get driving directions for your next appointment. Not everyone thinks that's a good thing, and might even find it depressing. For one who considers FOMO and the need to feel on top of things as a mental weakness, then yes, seeing how so many people lack the patience to wait a few hours to know the scores of their favorite team can be depressing. The World Book is the only paper encyclopedia available these days, making Wikipedia the de facto encyclopedia for everyone, when there used to be multiple encyclopedias, each with a different slant and focus. Granted, you might have to go to a library to access three different encyclopedia sets, while Wikipedia is available within seconds, but if you prioritize both diversity and high curation standards instead of time, the internet might be depressing.

croes 2y ago

The depressing part are flat earthers, anti vaxxers, science deniers, anti-semites, conspiracy theorists, misogynists, homophobes, extremists etc.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]